subtitles or lack thereof?

Sminty_Smeagol · 12-20-2003, 11:05 PM

I viewed ROTK for the second time tonight. Well... I'm not sure of the accuracy of this, but it seemed like there were subtitles for elvish where there was lack of them upon my first viewing. The only scene I noticed that I was confused about upon first viewing for the lack of subtitles is a couple lines by Aragorn talking to Elrond in the tent when Elrond brings him Anduril. Upon the first viewing, there were no subtitles and we were left wondering. This viewing, at a different theatre, the sbutitles said something along the lines of 'I put all of my hope into my men. I have none left for myself.'

Also, the sound was quite messed up the entire time, though it may have been the theatre we were in.

Has anyone else noticed this?

Dúnedain · 12-20-2003, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Sminty_Smeagol
I viewed ROTK for the second time tonight. Well... I'm not sure of the accuracy of this, but it seemed like there were subtitles for elvish where there was lack of them upon my first viewing. The only scene I noticed that I was confused about upon first viewing for the lack of subtitles is a couple lines by Aragorn talking to Elrond in the tent when Elrond brings him Anduril. Upon the first viewing, there were no subtitles and we were left wondering. This viewing, the sbutitles said something along the lines of 'I put all of my hope into my men. I have none left for myself.'

Also, the sound was quite messed up the entire time, though it may have been the theatre we were in.

Has anyone else noticed this?

Nope, when I saw it there were subtitles. I remember that scene specifically, because that line is what Aragorn's mother says to him the last time they saw each other...

Sminty_Smeagol · 12-20-2003, 11:16 PM

Do you remember what the words were?

I've read reviews on some websites and stuff and I know its been mentions that there are no subtitles in crucial moments. And I had read the reviews before my first viewing on dec 17 afternoon, and at that scene I was like 'Yup. There it is. no subtitles. just elvish jabber I guess'
But now tonight they were there... at a different theatre i might add. Do they have different cuts and stuff going around?

***Khamûl*** · 12-21-2003, 01:40 AM

Interesting that you should mention that... I noticed that they were speaking Elvish in the tent, but there were no subtitles. The only subtitle in the whole movie was at the end when Elrond said, "The sea calls us home." I saw the movie at the same theater all three times I've seen it. (Small town, limited options) That is curious.

***anduin*** · 12-21-2003, 03:02 AM

i too noticed this. in my theatre i didn't have any subs in the tent scene, but that was the only place. the first time i saw it was during the "trilogy" tuesday night. the second time was thursday afternoon. same thing. our theatre had sound difficulties during the extended TTT. we lost sound completely a couple of times and for a good chunk of time we lost "6.1". it did not bother me though the loss of subs during the tent scene, but i am glad to know at least it was dialogue from the book.

Dúnedain · 12-21-2003, 03:28 AM

Wow that is weird. I had subtitles when I saw it. I am gonna see it again this week, so I will let you know if I see them again...

Sminty_Smeagol · 12-21-2003, 12:03 PM

try going to a different theatre

Sylvee Estel · 12-21-2003, 01:46 PM

When I went the second time, I went to a different theater. There were subtitiles there, and I remember thinking that I must have missed them the first time because I didn't remember seeing them.

Starr Polish · 12-21-2003, 04:34 PM

Those who say they aren't seeing subitles: Go to another theater. There are definiely subtitles in the tent scene.

And Sylvee, I really like your icon.

Goldberry1 · 12-21-2003, 05:23 PM

Well, I had subtitles when I saw it... but actually it seemed like there really wasn't a lot of elvish spoken compared to the other two movies. not that i really mind, but that was just what it seemed to me.

Falagar · 12-21-2003, 05:30 PM

...not that we who have read the book need subtitles.

Artanis · 12-22-2003, 05:37 AM

Yes we do - when the people around is sobbing loudly right into your ear, or chewing potato chips.

Shadowfax · 12-22-2003, 02:49 PM

I saw it twice, at different theaters, and there were subtitles in all of the same places. This sounds really wierd!

Fimbrethil · 12-23-2003, 02:50 PM

There was elvish in the tent scene? Do you remeber what was said? When I saw it there were sub. where they were supposed to be but I don't remember elvish in the tent scene. I think I'm seeing it again Friday so I'll let you know what happens.

Falagar · 12-23-2003, 04:36 PM

From my memory, this is what it was in the book. I don't think there were any subtitles where I was.
Elrond: Ónen i-estel edain...
Aragorn: ...úchebin estel anin

Rosie Gamgee · 12-23-2003, 07:47 PM

I saw all the subtitles. Of course I've only seen it once (and am itching tremendously to see it again).
I loved that part with Elrond and Aragorn saying "I gave Hope to the world... but have kept none for myself." A great moment for Aragorn, and for those of us who've read the appendices.

Jedi X · 12-31-2003, 04:30 AM

sminty:

oh yeah, i did notice that, too. the first time i saw the movie, it was at our cinema 2; and the subtitles were there. it is the part where elrond is talking to aragorn, that someone else up there mentioned, when he says "i give hope to the world" and aragorn says "i keep none for myself".

well, first time i saw it they were there. so, next night i go with a couple of my buddies at cinema 1 and they aren't there! i say afterwards "hey, there were no subtitles in the tent!" and i kept wondering "how the heck can that be possible???"

anyway, i talked to other friends on texas hold 'em night. they all saw it in theater 1 and i was telling them all about the missing subtitles. they're all like "you sure?" and giving me that suspicious squinty eye; you know the one *jedi x does the suspicious squinty eye* and i am like "yeah, i'm sure", i mean, it's like, you hear elfin and the first thing you expect to see are subtitles. right? so, they are all like "well, what was it that was said?" and i am all like, "i can't remember what it was" and they are all like "man, are you positively sure" and i am like "yeah, i am positively sure" and they are like "that doesnt sound right" and then i am all like "hmmm" and i start to doubt myself. but then i think about it and i am like "no, i'm sure". so, they give me the squinty eye again and we go on with our game.

anyway, then i go back on a sunday with more friends to see it again. and we go to cinema 2 at noon. so, i am like "okay, now they will see that i know what i'm talking about"

so, the whole time i am sitting there thinking "okay- when this gets to that scene, there had better be subtitles, or i'm going to look like a complete dumbars." then, the scene starts drawing near and i am like "hmmm, maybe they WERENT there? maybe, hmmm" and i'm all doubting myself again. one of my friends said he was sitting there waiting for the subtitles too and he was thinking "man, if there are no subtitles, i'm going to slap him"

anyway, the tent scene comes- hallelujah chorus- subtitles.

i folded my arms across my chess and nodded in satisfactory triumph.

so, apparently, there are two different "movies", one with the tent scene subtitles- one without.

i'm glad you noticed that too. good eye! you get 50 gold stars!

dawningoftime · 01-01-2004, 02:14 AM

I went and saw it yesterday with my folks and afterwards my sister and I got talking about the lack of subtitles the first time we went to see it and my mom suspects that there may have been shipment of film that didn't have the subtitles that went out accidently.

Ohtar · 01-03-2004, 11:33 AM

Does anyone else got annoyed with the PJ phrase, which he's clearly invented, Gondorians! I know a lot of people have been using this phrase on the message boards but to me it's extremely annoying!!!!!!!!! I note that a lot of people on the LOTR production teams used it as well during the commentaries and narratives. I would have preferred Southern Dunedain or people of Gondor etc. or even Gondorhirrim - Gondorians is like, to me in any case, a horrible perversion and an intrusion into Middle Earth authenticity..... what do others think?

Falagar · 01-03-2004, 12:03 PM

I think it should be 'Gondorrim' (not Gondohirrim, "Lords of Gondor").

12-20-2003, 11:05 PM	#1
Sminty_Smeagol Manic Cardboard-Box Dweller Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: In a house Posts: 1,071	subtitles or lack thereof? I viewed ROTK for the second time tonight. Well... I'm not sure of the accuracy of this, but it seemed like there were subtitles for elvish where there was lack of them upon my first viewing. The only scene I noticed that I was confused about upon first viewing for the lack of subtitles is a couple lines by Aragorn talking to Elrond in the tent when Elrond brings him Anduril. Upon the first viewing, there were no subtitles and we were left wondering. This viewing, at a different theatre, the sbutitles said something along the lines of 'I put all of my hope into my men. I have none left for myself.' Also, the sound was quite messed up the entire time, though it may have been the theatre we were in. Has anyone else noticed this? __________________ I love the fishes. Last edited by Sminty_Smeagol : 12-20-2003 at 11:08 PM.

12-20-2003, 11:16 PM	#3
Sminty_Smeagol Manic Cardboard-Box Dweller Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: In a house Posts: 1,071	Do you remember what the words were? I've read reviews on some websites and stuff and I know its been mentions that there are no subtitles in crucial moments. And I had read the reviews before my first viewing on dec 17 afternoon, and at that scene I was like 'Yup. There it is. no subtitles. just elvish jabber I guess' But now tonight they were there... at a different theatre i might add. Do they have different cuts and stuff going around? __________________ I love the fishes. Last edited by Sminty_Smeagol : 12-20-2003 at 11:17 PM.

12-21-2003, 01:40 AM	#4
*Khamûl* Slacker Warrior Admin Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Alabama Posts: 2,759	Interesting that you should mention that... I noticed that they were speaking Elvish in the tent, but there were no subtitles. The only subtitle in the whole movie was at the end when Elrond said, "The sea calls us home." I saw the movie at the same theater all three times I've seen it. (Small town, limited options) That is curious. __________________ "If the giving of information is to be the cure of your inquisitiveness, I shall spend all the rest of my days in answering you." Gandalf to Pippin Psalm 107:31

12-21-2003, 03:02 AM	#5
*anduin* Entwife Join Date: Oct 1999 Location: louisville Posts: 3,718	i too noticed this. in my theatre i didn't have any subs in the tent scene, but that was the only place. the first time i saw it was during the "trilogy" tuesday night. the second time was thursday afternoon. same thing. our theatre had sound difficulties during the extended TTT. we lost sound completely a couple of times and for a good chunk of time we lost "6.1". it did not bother me though the loss of subs during the tent scene, but i am glad to know at least it was dialogue from the book. __________________ Far away across the field The tolling of the iron bell Calls the faithful to their knees To hear the softly spoken magic spells.

12-21-2003, 03:28 AM	#6
Dúnedain High King of Númenórë Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Númenórë <--United States of America Posts: 1,947	Wow that is weird. I had subtitles when I saw it. I am gonna see it again this week, so I will let you know if I see them again... __________________ 'Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta!' - And those were the words that Elendil spoke when he came up out of the Sea on the wings of the wind: 'Out of the Great Sea to Middle-earth I am come. In this place will I abide, and my heirs, unto the ending of the world.' 'Then Tuor arrayed himself in the hauberk, and set the helm upon his head, and he girt himself with the sword; black were sheath and belt with clasps of silver. Thus armed he went forth from Turgon's hall, and stood upon the high terraces of Taras in the red light of the sun. None were there to see him, as he gazed westward, gleaming in silver and gold, and he knew not that in that hour he appeared as one of the Mighty of the West, and fit to be father of the kings of the Kings of Men beyond the Sea, as it was indeed his doom to be; but in the taking of those arms a change came upon Tuor son of Huor, and his heart grew great within him. And as he stepped down from the doors the swans did him reverence, and plucking each a great feather from their wings they proffered them to him, laying their long necks upon the stone before his feet; and he took the seven feathers and set them in the crest of his helm, and straightway the swans arose and flew north in the sunset, and Tuor saw them no more.' -Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin "Oh. Forgive me, fairest of all males of Entmoot...Back down, all ye other wannabe fairest males! Dunedain is the fairest!" --Linaewen

12-21-2003, 12:03 PM	#7
Sminty_Smeagol Manic Cardboard-Box Dweller Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: In a house Posts: 1,071	try going to a different theatre __________________ I love the fishes.

12-21-2003, 01:46 PM	#8
Sylvee Estel Elven Warrior Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Tennessee Posts: 115	When I went the second time, I went to a different theater. There were subtitiles there, and I remember thinking that I must have missed them the first time because I didn't remember seeing them. __________________ ~Sylvee

12-21-2003, 04:34 PM	#9
Starr Polish Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Slow down and I sail on the river, slow down and I walk to the hill Posts: 2,389	Those who say they aren't seeing subitles: Go to another theater. There are definiely subtitles in the tent scene. And Sylvee, I really like your icon. __________________ “The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.” –Bertrand Russell

12-21-2003, 05:23 PM	#10
Goldberry1 Elven Warrior Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: DC or Delaware, depending on the time of year Posts: 244	Well, I had subtitles when I saw it... but actually it seemed like there really wasn't a lot of elvish spoken compared to the other two movies. not that i really mind, but that was just what it seemed to me. __________________ Oh, your collegiate grief has left you dowdy in sweatshirts, absolute horror!

12-21-2003, 05:30 PM	#11
Falagar Death of Mooters and [Entmoot] Internal Affairs Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Oslo, Norway Posts: 2,870	...not that we who have read the book need subtitles. __________________ Fëanor - Innocence incarnated Still, Aikanáro 'till the Last battle.

12-22-2003, 05:37 AM	#12
Artanis Greatest Elven woman of Aman Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Having way too much fun with Fëanor's 7 Posts: 4,285	Yes we do - when the people around is sobbing loudly right into your ear, or chewing potato chips. __________________ --Life is hard, and then we die.

12-22-2003, 02:49 PM	#13
Shadowfax The Fleet-Footed Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: British Columbia Posts: 913	I saw it twice, at different theaters, and there were subtitles in all of the same places. This sounds really wierd! __________________ Jesus saved me "To remain ignorant of things that happened before you were born is to remain a child" (Cicero, 106-43 B.C.) "Art is a lie which makes us realize the truth" (Picasso)

12-23-2003, 02:50 PM	#14
Fimbrethil My microwave speaks to me Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Having conversations with my major household appliances. Posts: 937	There was elvish in the tent scene? Do you remeber what was said? When I saw it there were sub. where they were supposed to be but I don't remember elvish in the tent scene. I think I'm seeing it again Friday so I'll let you know what happens. __________________ Bah, Bah black sheep have oyu any wool? Yes sir, yes sir. Three bags full! One for the master, one for the dame, one for the little boy who lives down the lane! Bah, bah black sheep have you any wool? Yes sir, yes sir. Three bags full. I'll be gone for a while. But never fear! "I shall return anon!"

12-23-2003, 04:36 PM	#15
Falagar Death of Mooters and [Entmoot] Internal Affairs Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Oslo, Norway Posts: 2,870	From my memory, this is what it was in the book. I don't think there were any subtitles where I was. Elrond: Ónen i-estel edain... Aragorn: ...úchebin estel anin __________________ Fëanor - Innocence incarnated Still, Aikanáro 'till the Last battle.

12-23-2003, 07:47 PM	#16
Rosie Gamgee The Lovely Hobbit-Lass Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Bounded in a nut-shell Posts: 1,593	I saw all the subtitles. Of course I've only seen it once (and am itching tremendously to see it again). I loved that part with Elrond and Aragorn saying "I gave Hope to the world... but have kept none for myself." A great moment for Aragorn, and for those of us who've read the appendices. __________________ It's New Years Day, just like the day before; Same old skies of grey, same empty bottles on the floor. Another year's gone by, and I was thinking once again, How can I take this losing hand and somehow win? Just give me One Good Year To get my feet back on the ground. I've been chasing grace; Grace ain't so easily found One bad hand can devil a man, chase him and carry him down. I've got to get out of here, just give me One Good Year!

12-31-2003, 04:30 AM	#17
Jedi X Hobbit Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Behind the East Wind Posts: 22	sminty: oh yeah, i did notice that, too. the first time i saw the movie, it was at our cinema 2; and the subtitles were there. it is the part where elrond is talking to aragorn, that someone else up there mentioned, when he says "i give hope to the world" and aragorn says "i keep none for myself". well, first time i saw it they were there. so, next night i go with a couple of my buddies at cinema 1 and they aren't there! i say afterwards "hey, there were no subtitles in the tent!" and i kept wondering "how the heck can that be possible???" anyway, i talked to other friends on texas hold 'em night. they all saw it in theater 1 and i was telling them all about the missing subtitles. they're all like "you sure?" and giving me that suspicious squinty eye; you know the one jedi x does the suspicious squinty eye and i am like "yeah, i'm sure", i mean, it's like, you hear elfin and the first thing you expect to see are subtitles. right? so, they are all like "well, what was it that was said?" and i am all like, "i can't remember what it was" and they are all like "man, are you positively sure" and i am like "yeah, i am positively sure" and they are like "that doesnt sound right" and then i am all like "hmmm" and i start to doubt myself. but then i think about it and i am like "no, i'm sure". so, they give me the squinty eye again and we go on with our game. anyway, then i go back on a sunday with more friends to see it again. and we go to cinema 2 at noon. so, i am like "okay, now they will see that i know what i'm talking about" so, the whole time i am sitting there thinking "okay- when this gets to that scene, there had better be subtitles, or i'm going to look like a complete dumbars." then, the scene starts drawing near and i am like "hmmm, maybe they WERENT there? maybe, hmmm" and i'm all doubting myself again. one of my friends said he was sitting there waiting for the subtitles too and he was thinking "man, if there are no subtitles, i'm going to slap him" anyway, the tent scene comes- hallelujah chorus- subtitles. i folded my arms across my chess and nodded in satisfactory triumph. so, apparently, there are two different "movies", one with the tent scene subtitles- one without. i'm glad you noticed that too. good eye! you get 50 gold stars! __________________ That which was is that which will be; and that which is done is that which will be done: and there is no new thing under the sun. Last edited by Jedi X : 12-31-2003 at 04:44 AM.

01-01-2004, 02:14 AM	#18
dawningoftime Enting Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 90	I went and saw it yesterday with my folks and afterwards my sister and I got talking about the lack of subtitles the first time we went to see it and my mom suspects that there may have been shipment of film that didn't have the subtitles that went out accidently.

01-03-2004, 11:33 AM	#19
Ohtar Sapling Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 3	GONDORIANS! Does anyone else got annoyed with the PJ phrase, which he's clearly invented, Gondorians! I know a lot of people have been using this phrase on the message boards but to me it's extremely annoying!!!!!!!!! I note that a lot of people on the LOTR production teams used it as well during the commentaries and narratives. I would have preferred Southern Dunedain or people of Gondor etc. or even Gondorhirrim - Gondorians is like, to me in any case, a horrible perversion and an intrusion into Middle Earth authenticity..... what do others think?

01-03-2004, 12:03 PM	#20
Falagar Death of Mooters and [Entmoot] Internal Affairs Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Oslo, Norway Posts: 2,870	I think it should be 'Gondorrim' (not Gondohirrim, "Lords of Gondor"). __________________ Fëanor - Innocence incarnated Still, Aikanáro 'till the Last battle.

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