Concerning Hobbits

Black Breathalizer · 03-09-2003, 09:54 AM

There has been some interesting side discussions in the "Jackson got it right on the Scouring" thread about Jackson's treatment of the hobbits as one of the primary themes of the books.

What do you think? Has Peter Jackson been true to Tolkien concerning Hobbits?

We can talk about this both in terms of their general portrayal in the films as well as the underlying "power of the common man" themes of the books vs. the movies.

Lizra · 03-09-2003, 12:06 PM

I'm not getting Frodo yet. Hopefully, Jackson will do more with him in RoTK than he has. In the movie, he comes off (to me) as a privileged young hobbit who gets stuck with a nasty job, that he's afraid to do. In the book, I get more of the intellectual "elf friend", who has more sense of the world around him (not just the Shire) than the other hobbits, and a deeper well of "spirit" to draw from. The other three hobbits project well enough, but I get too much "fear" from Frodo in the movie. The changed Ford scene and the elimination of the Barrow Down sequence are probably the cause of this. Still, I will hold judgement till I see everything.

Firekitten2006 · 03-09-2003, 02:51 PM

Yeah I dont like how PJ seemed to make Frodo a very very big baby. In the books he's slightly older than the other hobbits, and seems to accept what he has to do, and doesnt whine about it. PJ seemed to stay pretty true to Merry and Sam, but I dont think you can get from the movie that Pippin is the youngest of the four, and is pretty much a child. So apart from Pippin and Frodo I'm happy.

***Fat middle*** · 03-09-2003, 04:37 PM

none of the hobbits is developed enough so far. i agree with what have been said about Frodo, and i'd add that i don't like E. Wood's performance. i'm dissapointed.

Sam is getting better. he had very few lines in FOTR, but i'm begining to like him in TTT.

Pippin's also getting better, but he isn't funny enough. same as Sam, i like his look.

Merry. perhaps his character is okay, but i just cannot stand D. Monaghan's face

Elvedans · 03-09-2003, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Firekitten2006
Yeah I dont like how PJ seemed to make Frodo a very very big baby. In the books he's slightly older than the other hobbits, and seems to accept what he has to do, and doesnt whine about it. PJ seemed to stay pretty true to Merry and Sam, but I dont think you can get from the movie that Pippin is the youngest of the four, and is pretty much a child. So apart from Pippin and Frodo I'm happy.

I think that actually tolkien makes Frodo seem more like a baby as he becomes so dependent on Sam, but i think it is a good thing. I think the aging could have been shown better.

Indril Anarion · 03-09-2003, 07:29 PM

I like the way Hobbits were portrayed in the movie, but I agree that Frodo seems a bit wussy. In the book, I imagined him as a bit stronger and braver, yet a bit afraid, but willing to take the challenge. In TTT, a bit of a tougher Frodo comes out. So I guess it's a good development. I believe Sam, Merry, and Pippin's characters played out as in the books...

Elvedans · 03-10-2003, 03:53 PM

Sam and Pip were the best portrayed. Actually, no, Bilbo was brilliant too.

Gwaimir Windgem · 03-10-2003, 05:25 PM

Didn't like Frodo. Sam was brilliant. Bilbo was excellent. Pippin downright sucked, In My Opinion. Neutral on Merry. Sackville-Bagginses were good.

Lady Tinuveil · 03-10-2003, 05:40 PM

For all being aprx. 30 yrs. of age, none looked it... I think Frodo wines too much in the film and pj left a lot of the story line out.
His interepitation is not too bad, I cant wait for two towers to come out on video, Ill be first in line...

Gwaimir Windgem · 03-10-2003, 05:47 PM

How old would Merry and Pippin have been at the party?

Lady Tinuveil · 03-10-2003, 05:56 PM

Are ther any sites avaliable(?) that show how to stich hobbits clothes? Or Rangers clothes? I am a master with my sewing machine, I wish I could find hobbit patterns. Can Anyone help?

Elvengirl · 03-10-2003, 06:55 PM

Sam was great! Pippin and Merry were good. Frodo was ok, he's too wimpy, and I personally don't think he looks like a hobbit. I think Elijah could pass for an elf.
The Shire and all other hobbits looked perfect. I love the hobbit children.

How old are they supposed to be? I think I remember Frodo being close to fifty when he leaves Bag End. I'll have to check on that.

Celebriel · 03-10-2003, 10:45 PM

I think Bilbo was portrayed pretty closely to the books, but I hated the whole "Ahhh, ring! Let me bug my eyes!".

Frodo does look like a wuss. I thought PJ started his deterioration too quickly.

I do like how Sam is shown as strong (pulling Gollum off Frodo) and overprotective (not trusting Gollum).

---

As far as I know, Frodo was 33 when Bilbo turned 111.

cassiopeia · 03-10-2003, 11:22 PM

According to the book Pippin would be 11 and Merry was 19 at the time of Bilbo's party. Of course this doesn't translate to the movie because the hobbits left the Shire very soon after the party, not after 17 years as in the book.
I agree with Lizra about Frodo. The only thing I like it that he looks good.

Sam is brilliant (Po-tay-toes!). Bilbo is excellent. Pippin is all right. Don't care about Merry (though how did he gained 50 IQ points in TTT is beyond me). Gollum is brilliant.

samwise of the shire · 03-10-2003, 11:36 PM

Quote:

PJ seemed to stay pretty true to Merry and Sam, but I dont think you can get from the movie that Pippin is the youngest of the four, and is pretty much a child.

Uhhh fire kitten...Pippin IS a child in the book...the time before 33 is the irresponsible tweens...which means he's still a teen when they go on the quest...28 to be precise...or in human terms that would be 14.
Frodo is a wimp in the movie I must profess. They were just trying to show the audience the innocence of the hobbits...and Frodo is about as innocent lookin' as you can get. It's REALLY sad to see him reduced to a bunch of quivering nerves.
I thought that Merry was a bit more immature in LOTR:FOTR than he was in the book...but he kind of smarts up in TTT...or else other charecters were dumbed down *coughs and glances at a statue of Treebeard*. Sam starts growin' up as well...honestly Sean Astin should get an Oscar for best supporting...or else Andy Serkis should. Those two did VERY good.
Frodo turned into a pessimistic wet blanket.
Cheers,
Sam

Lady of Rohan · 03-11-2003, 10:32 AM

I also agree with what is being said about Frodo. I thought that Sam was great. Merry and Pippin "matured" alot from FotR to TTT. I am fine with Merry and Pippin though, only Frodo bugged me.

Dunadan · 03-11-2003, 03:54 PM

Seems like there's almost consensus on Frodo being crap and Sam being great. I wonder how much of this is the casting, how much is the script/direction and how much is the acting.

Frodo was certainly cast too young to be faithful to the book; also the actor seems capable of only one facial expression. However, I think the main problem is that his character was rewritten in one dimension. None of his decisive or insightful actions were carried over.

BB, did you mean hobbits in general rather than the individual characters? If that's so, I think it was like the rest of the films: design, costume and effects were brilliant but the direction and editing was heavy-handed at times, making the characters cartoon-ish and disrupting the flow of the story.

cheers

d.

***Fat middle*** · 03-11-2003, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dunadan
BB, did you mean hobbits in general rather than the individual characters? If that's so, I think it was like the rest of the films: design, costume and effects were brilliant but the direction and editing was heavy-handed at times, making the characters cartoon-ish and disrupting the flow of the story.

i cannot agree more.

Gwaimir Windgem · 03-11-2003, 05:46 PM

Not quite true, he did decide to go to Mordor by himself.

durin's bane · 03-11-2003, 07:03 PM

In my opinion, Sam was wonderful and Bilbo was good, too, except for the whole big, buggy eyes when he held the Ring. Pippin and Merry were all right, but I think they went from silly dopes to Mr. Serious too quickly. Frodo...cute, but that's the only good side. The portrayal was awful, and he fell on his butt too much. In the books, Frodo was strong, mature, and brave, calm most of the time, and confident. It wasn't until he reached Mordor and the Ring became almost impossible to bear did he let himself go a little.

03-09-2003, 09:54 AM	#1
Black Breathalizer Elf Lord Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 828	Concerning Hobbits There has been some interesting side discussions in the "Jackson got it right on the Scouring" thread about Jackson's treatment of the hobbits as one of the primary themes of the books. What do you think? Has Peter Jackson been true to Tolkien concerning Hobbits? We can talk about this both in terms of their general portrayal in the films as well as the underlying "power of the common man" themes of the books vs. the movies.

03-09-2003, 12:06 PM	#2
Lizra Domesticated Swing Babe Join Date: May 2002 Location: Reality Posts: 5,340	I'm not getting Frodo yet. Hopefully, Jackson will do more with him in RoTK than he has. In the movie, he comes off (to me) as a privileged young hobbit who gets stuck with a nasty job, that he's afraid to do. In the book, I get more of the intellectual "elf friend", who has more sense of the world around him (not just the Shire) than the other hobbits, and a deeper well of "spirit" to draw from. The other three hobbits project well enough, but I get too much "fear" from Frodo in the movie. The changed Ford scene and the elimination of the Barrow Down sequence are probably the cause of this. Still, I will hold judgement till I see everything. __________________ Happy Atheist Go Democrats!

03-09-2003, 02:51 PM	#3
Firekitten2006 Elven Warrior Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: the US of A! But I wish i was in austraila, never been, just think it would be a fun place to live :) Posts: 372	Yeah I dont like how PJ seemed to make Frodo a very very big baby. In the books he's slightly older than the other hobbits, and seems to accept what he has to do, and doesnt whine about it. PJ seemed to stay pretty true to Merry and Sam, but I dont think you can get from the movie that Pippin is the youngest of the four, and is pretty much a child. So apart from Pippin and Frodo I'm happy. __________________ I'm Baaaack!!

03-09-2003, 04:37 PM	#4
*Fat middle* Mootis per forum Administrator Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Spain Posts: 61,439	none of the hobbits is developed enough so far. i agree with what have been said about Frodo, and i'd add that i don't like E. Wood's performance. i'm dissapointed. Sam is getting better. he had very few lines in FOTR, but i'm begining to like him in TTT. Pippin's also getting better, but he isn't funny enough. same as Sam, i like his look. Merry. perhaps his character is okay, but i just cannot stand D. Monaghan's face __________________ Do not be hasty. That is my motto. Now we'll have a drink and go to the Entmoot.

03-09-2003, 07:29 PM	#6
Indril Anarion Elven Warrior Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: My heart is forever in Mirkwood Posts: 429	I like the way Hobbits were portrayed in the movie, but I agree that Frodo seems a bit wussy. In the book, I imagined him as a bit stronger and braver, yet a bit afraid, but willing to take the challenge. In TTT, a bit of a tougher Frodo comes out. So I guess it's a good development. I believe Sam, Merry, and Pippin's characters played out as in the books... __________________ I'm a Jesus Freak and proud of it... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to do is decide what to do with the time that is given to us." -Gandalf, FOTR ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Nobody tosses a Dwarf." - Gimli, FOTR ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Save Ferris!!!!!! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ My true Elven name is Idril Anarion, but I misspelled in the username, and now I can't fix it... Oh, well...now you know... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Don't be afraid of death....Be afraid of the unlived life- Tuck Everlasting

03-10-2003, 03:53 PM	#7
Elvedans Diamond Of The Night Sky Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Old London Town (Well somewhere near there) Posts: 366	Sam and Pip were the best portrayed. Actually, no, Bilbo was brilliant too. __________________ I see a little silhouetto of a man. Scaramouche scaramouche will you do the fandango? Thunderbolts and Lightning, very very frightening me!

03-10-2003, 05:25 PM	#8
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	Didn't like Frodo. Sam was brilliant. Bilbo was excellent. Pippin downright sucked, In My Opinion. Neutral on Merry. Sackville-Bagginses were good. __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

03-10-2003, 05:40 PM	#9
Lady Tinuveil Elven Warrior Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Oregon Hills Posts: 257	For all being aprx. 30 yrs. of age, none looked it... I think Frodo wines too much in the film and pj left a lot of the story line out. His interepitation is not too bad, I cant wait for two towers to come out on video, Ill be first in line...

03-10-2003, 05:47 PM	#10
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	How old would Merry and Pippin have been at the party? __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

03-10-2003, 05:56 PM	#11
Lady Tinuveil Elven Warrior Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Oregon Hills Posts: 257	* Are ther any sites avaliable(?) that show how to stich hobbits clothes? Or Rangers clothes? I am a master with my sewing machine, I wish I could find hobbit patterns. Can Anyone help?

03-10-2003, 06:55 PM	#12
Elvengirl Mirthful Maiden Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Rivendell Posts: 1,252	Sam was great! Pippin and Merry were good. Frodo was ok, he's too wimpy, and I personally don't think he looks like a hobbit. I think Elijah could pass for an elf. The Shire and all other hobbits looked perfect. I love the hobbit children. How old are they supposed to be? I think I remember Frodo being close to fifty when he leaves Bag End. I'll have to check on that.

03-10-2003, 10:45 PM	#13
Celebriel Elven Warrior Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Mirkwood Posts: 139	I think Bilbo was portrayed pretty closely to the books, but I hated the whole "Ahhh, ring! Let me bug my eyes!". Frodo does look like a wuss. I thought PJ started his deterioration too quickly. I do like how Sam is shown as strong (pulling Gollum off Frodo) and overprotective (not trusting Gollum). --- As far as I know, Frodo was 33 when Bilbo turned 111. __________________ ~ Celebriel ~ Go not to the Elves for counsel, for they will say both no and yes. ~ __________________

03-10-2003, 11:22 PM	#14
cassiopeia Viggoholic Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 1,749	According to the book Pippin would be 11 and Merry was 19 at the time of Bilbo's party. Of course this doesn't translate to the movie because the hobbits left the Shire very soon after the party, not after 17 years as in the book. I agree with Lizra about Frodo. The only thing I like it that he looks good. Sam is brilliant (Po-tay-toes!). Bilbo is excellent. Pippin is all right. Don't care about Merry (though how did he gained 50 IQ points in TTT is beyond me). Gollum is brilliant. __________________ Kids, you tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is, never try.

03-11-2003, 10:32 AM	#16
Lady of Rohan Doughy Elf Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 1,006	I also agree with what is being said about Frodo. I thought that Sam was great. Merry and Pippin "matured" alot from FotR to TTT. I am fine with Merry and Pippin though, only Frodo bugged me.

03-11-2003, 03:54 PM	#17
Dunadan The Quite Querulous Quendi Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Oxon, UK Posts: 638	Seems like there's almost consensus on Frodo being crap and Sam being great. I wonder how much of this is the casting, how much is the script/direction and how much is the acting. Frodo was certainly cast too young to be faithful to the book; also the actor seems capable of only one facial expression. However, I think the main problem is that his character was rewritten in one dimension. None of his decisive or insightful actions were carried over. BB, did you mean hobbits in general rather than the individual characters? If that's so, I think it was like the rest of the films: design, costume and effects were brilliant but the direction and editing was heavy-handed at times, making the characters cartoon-ish and disrupting the flow of the story. cheers d.

03-11-2003, 05:46 PM	#19
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	Not quite true, he did decide to go to Mordor by himself. __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

03-11-2003, 07:03 PM	#20
durin's bane Lady of Westernesse Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Canada (Help! Our parliament building is melting!) Posts: 761	In my opinion, Sam was wonderful and Bilbo was good, too, except for the whole big, buggy eyes when he held the Ring. Pippin and Merry were all right, but I think they went from silly dopes to Mr. Serious too quickly. Frodo...cute, but that's the only good side. The portrayal was awful, and he fell on his butt too much. In the books, Frodo was strong, mature, and brave, calm most of the time, and confident. It wasn't until he reached Mordor and the Ring became almost impossible to bear did he let himself go a little. __________________ Yada, yada, yada

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Maiar can be Hobbits, too!	Elanor the hobbit	Writer's Workshop	15	06-24-2007 05:48 PM
fighting hobbits	gimli7410	Lord of the Rings Books	17	03-10-2003 07:19 PM
Contentedness, homelessness and hobbits	Varda	The Hobbit (book)	11	07-25-2002 12:04 PM
Vote for us at 25 Hobbits	bmilder	General Messages	25	08-03-2001 03:06 AM
Hobbits	Telkontar	Middle Earth	8	03-29-2000 08:25 AM