A question of height...

Glorfindel_of_Gondolin · 05-04-2004, 01:11 AM

Firstly, this is not another debate on the actual height of hobbits, elves and men.

Tolkien has a bit of a thing for "Height = Grace"

All through the Silmarilion, unfinished tales and LOTR, constant mentions of the height of characters is made, and it is usually in reference to their overall goodness. Elendil the tall, the dunadain being taller than lesser men, elves being taller again. Tolkien seems to associate height with strength, grace and wisdom.

Of course, where do hobbits fit into this argument?

Thoughts?

Count Comfect · 05-04-2004, 01:33 AM

Well, I seem to see height usually equaling nobility in the grand scheme... and hobbits, despite their major plus sides, are not usually considered grandly noble.
They can be, but this is seen as shocking - so maybe what I mean is that it represents the expectation of nobility.

Durin1 · 05-04-2004, 06:41 AM

It is one of my little irritants that there is this aspect of height = nobility.

Maybe it's because i'm not that tall (in real life, not Durin!

) but I just cannot understand that you have to be tall to be wise, heroic and strong. As far as I can remember, Hurin is the only one that Tolkien mentions who is unusually "short(er)" than others of his race; although he happens to be the best fighting machine around during his time.

I think I agree that it is the "expectation" of nobility that height has particular emphasis.

Looking at it from another point of view, maybe Tolkien was thinking about his fascination for mythology of Northern Europe; in that he wanted to create a particular type of people that should be made distinctive?

Anglorfin · 05-04-2004, 10:14 AM

As for hobbits, their defining traits really did not include being noble. They were for the most part stealthy.

What I am most curious about is how Dwarves fit in. They definately come off as a noble race to me yet their stature is somewhat diminished. And I don't recall height ever being mentioned about any dwarf.

LeniFreak · 05-07-2004, 11:24 PM

Quote:

it represents the expectation of nobility.

To extend that a little...hobbits being underestimated seems to be a constant event. This could be a way of showing this contrast.

Dwarves never seemed all that noble to me. I don't know...

05-04-2004, 01:11 AM	#1
Glorfindel_of_Gondolin Hobbit Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: The High Seas Posts: 36	A question of height... Firstly, this is not another debate on the actual height of hobbits, elves and men. Tolkien has a bit of a thing for "Height = Grace" All through the Silmarilion, unfinished tales and LOTR, constant mentions of the height of characters is made, and it is usually in reference to their overall goodness. Elendil the tall, the dunadain being taller than lesser men, elves being taller again. Tolkien seems to associate height with strength, grace and wisdom. Of course, where do hobbits fit into this argument? Thoughts? __________________ Taste Elven Steel, Creatures of the Dark Lord, and Despair!

05-04-2004, 01:33 AM	#2
Count Comfect Word Santa Claus Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 2,922	Well, I seem to see height usually equaling nobility in the grand scheme... and hobbits, despite their major plus sides, are not usually considered grandly noble. They can be, but this is seen as shocking - so maybe what I mean is that it represents the expectation of nobility. __________________ Sufficient to have stood, yet free to fall.

05-04-2004, 06:41 AM	#3
Durin1 Elven Warrior Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Birmingham, UK Posts: 221	It is one of my little irritants that there is this aspect of height = nobility. Maybe it's because i'm not that tall (in real life, not Durin! ) but I just cannot understand that you have to be tall to be wise, heroic and strong. As far as I can remember, Hurin is the only one that Tolkien mentions who is unusually "short(er)" than others of his race; although he happens to be the best fighting machine around during his time. I think I agree that it is the "expectation" of nobility that height has particular emphasis. Looking at it from another point of view, maybe Tolkien was thinking about his fascination for mythology of Northern Europe; in that he wanted to create a particular type of people that should be made distinctive? __________________ Durin the Sleepless!

05-04-2004, 10:14 AM	#4
Anglorfin Alasailon Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: college Posts: 861	As for hobbits, their defining traits really did not include being noble. They were for the most part stealthy. What I am most curious about is how Dwarves fit in. They definately come off as a noble race to me yet their stature is somewhat diminished. And I don't recall height ever being mentioned about any dwarf. __________________ "and then this hobbit was walking, and then this elf jumped out of a bush and totally flipped out on him while wailing on his guitar." "Anglorfin was tall and straight; his hair was of shining gold, his face fair and young and fearless and full of anger; his eyes were bright and keen, and his voice like music; on his brow sat wisdom, and in his hand was great skill."

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