Victimless crimes - Page 8

afro-elf · 06-12-2002, 03:13 PM

So are you pan-psychic who knows that all women think like you and those that say that they don't are lying.

Or is it that all women lie. In which case why should I believe you.

Maybe you are lying because you think your husband what's an anti-porn girl

I just feel that you are being supercillious claiming to know what ALL women like. As if all are static beings with no variation.

Why do you assume that ALL these girls are brainless? Some of these women are quite articulate aware. HOWEVER, some are trashy idiots.

That's as bad as some ghetto punk arguing that all blacks feel as certain way and ANY black that is different is lying to themselves.

I've had this applied to me. ( i don't think you are the equivalent of a ghetto punk)

Are athletes objectified and abused because of their bodies. Should they stop playing sports and use their brains instead?

Hmmm. I can do something with my body and make more money in a short time than i could in my life time studying for years and years.

ONCE AGAIN I have NEVER denied that some don't like it.

Actually, I find your opinion of women to be quite low.

Lizra · 06-12-2002, 03:13 PM

no I don't see it . Honestly, I've explained myself thoroughly, we don't agree. OK...OK I'm done..

Oh my opinion of a very small minority of women is quite low.

afro-elf · 06-12-2002, 03:17 PM

Its just seems that YOU don't like it and you can not understand how someone else can.

So since you can't not see how they can ( MIGHT) like it. You denegrated them into brainless liars.

afro-elf · 06-12-2002, 03:19 PM

I think the point now is how can YOU claim to speak for ALL women?

Cirdan · 06-12-2002, 03:20 PM

Throughout human history, as our species has faced the frightening, terrorizing fact that we do not know who we are, or where we are going in this ocean of chaos, it has been the authorities, the political, the religious, the educational authorities who attempted to comfort us by giving us order, rules, regulations, informing, forming in our minds their view of reality. To think for yourself you must question authority and learn how to put yourself in a state of vulnerable, open-mindedness; chaotic, confused, vulnerability to inform yourself.

Think for yourself.
Question authority.

-Tool

Lizra · 06-12-2002, 03:21 PM

I don't claim to SPEAK for all women. I'm telling you MY opinion. Hey, I never called them brainless liars! Those are your words.

jerseydevil · 06-12-2002, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lizra
I wouldn't call it pretentiousness, but you can! I'm still not getting your point Cirdan. OBOS was about not letting your gynecologist dupe you, you know, taking control of your body. Whats the sexploitation backlash?

This is what Amazon has on their summary of the new edition called Our Bodies, Ourselves for the New Century: A Book by and for Women -

Quote:

Our Bodies, Ourselves for the New Century reflects the vital health concerns of women of diverse ages, ethnic and racial backgrounds, and sexual orientations. In these pages, women will find new information, resources (including web sites!), and personal support for the decisions that will shape their health -- and their lives -- from living a healthy life, to relationships and sexuality, to child-bearing, growing older, dealing with the medical system, and organizing for change. This is a book for women of all generations to use, to rely on, and to share with others.

Concerning the pretentiousness comments - I just don't understand how you can presume to know what other people are thinking. You're putting your values on others. I agree that many people are taken advantage of in the porn industry. I'm not saying it's not wrong if someone is forced into porn or prostitution - but if it's based on a free choice - then there should be nothing wrong with it.

I'm not going to change my mind that once you're 18 you can do with your life and body whatever you want to. It goes back to my arguments in support of euthansia.

afro-elf · 06-12-2002, 03:26 PM

Yet your opinion classifies ALL women who would make a choice you would not as brainless lairs.

How can you say you have the knowledge that ALL women how make such a choice are.

Its different to say I can't see how someone COULD enjoy, I don't like it. I think its wrong. But it is supercillious to claim that ALL those might think different that you are brainless lairs.

afro-elf · 06-12-2002, 03:29 PM

Quote:

. I'm not saying it's not wrong if someone is forced into porn or prostitution - but if it's based on a free choice - then there should be nothing wrong with it.

JD I concur wholeheartedly

Lizra · 06-12-2002, 03:32 PM

Well JD, You live your life and as the years pile up you are exposed to many experiences and realationships. You observe many people, choices, consequences, changes,whatever. Then you reflect on it all and come up with some conclusions. Nothing fancy, just hindsight I guess. Mine is different from someone elses I'm sure. It's just my opinion, maybe wrong, but I think its right. Don't get so bent out of shape over it!

afro-elf · 06-12-2002, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Mine is different from someone elses I'm sure

Can I call this a truce? Please can I please huh!?

Lizra · 06-12-2002, 03:42 PM

YES!!!!! I have so much to do, this is taking too much of my time.

Thanks

jerseydevil · 06-12-2002, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lizra
Well JD, You live your life and as the years pile up you are exposed to many experiences and realationships. You observe many people, choices, consequences, changes,whatever. Then you reflect on it all and come up with some conclusions. Nothing fancy, just hindsight I guess. Mine is different from someone elses I'm sure. It's just my opinion, maybe wrong, but I think its right. Don't get so bent out of shape over it!

Yes - my experiences are shaped by - living most of my life in New Jersey, being raised by parents (particularly my mother) that taught me the world was gray, not black and white, went to college in West Virginia, moved to Indiana, moved to Oregon, lived in California and lived in Chicago. I grew up poor, my parents worked hard - we became "rich". I've experienced a lot, I've had friends that have had to use outhouses for bathrooms (including me when I'd stay at their house) and friends that have lived in a holler in West Virginia.

I have friends that are drug addicts and alcoholics, I friends that are gay, I have friends that are extremely religious, I've lost friends who became very religious and couldn't accept that I'm atheist. These are my experiences.

By the way - I'm not bent out of shape over it. I just find it strange that someone can say what all woman think and feel.

Quote:

Can I call this a truce? Please can I please huh!?

I don't like truces.

Lizra · 06-12-2002, 04:42 PM

Too Bad! As I drink this delicious glass of Moscato, I offer a toast to Afro Elf for calling the truce. Cheers!

BeardofPants · 06-12-2002, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lizra
[B] I've been trying to tell you AE, that the reason I think these women say they like it, is because they want you to think they do, because you're a male.

Bollocks. I have a couple of friends who strip, and they certainly don't do it because they want men to "think they like it". Absolute bollocks.

JD, Cirdan and A-E have already put in their 2 cents, and I gonna add my weak inferior female argument.

BOLLOCKS!

One friend, who I was quite close to while I was in varsity stripped. She certainly didn't need to bow down to men. She enjoyed her sensuality. She enjoyed being empowered by it. And she certainly didn't need to project an image to get men, because she didn't use it in the first place to get them!

Quote:

They want you to think they're sexually free women,who enjoy these types of things...

Have you ever thought that perhaps they ARE actually sexually free women, who DO enjoy their sexuality? I don't know about you, but after a while, missionary gets boring.

Quote:

....maybe you'll date one, maybe it's her image, (if you are a stripper, that better be your image or you'll suck!)

Yeah, and did I mention that my stripper friend managed to pull in guys without using her image? Oh, silly me. I did.

Quote:

(Being hot sexy babes who want it all the time) to please men, cause men rule their world.

If you think that, then you're an even bigger biggot than some of those men out there that you're lampooning. So a woman can't enjoy sex? Enjoy being sexy?

Quote:

Women can do amazing things to get men to do what they want. You won't believe me, I know. Its my experience as a women that makes me say this. If men only knew what women really thought!!!

(and vice versa I'm sure)

[edit] By your implications, I can't enjoy stripping, porn, I'm assuming toys, S & M etc, because I don't really want it?! Whatever.

Quote:

Oh and women do have minds of their own, some just choose to pretend to enjoy being part of the porn industry because it gets them where they want to go.

Did I mention that my stripper friend was also really bright? That she could have chosen to go onto accountancy, but she chose to do stripping because she enjoyed her job - the freedom and empowerment - as well as the money? Oh, and last time I checked with her, she DID have a mind of her own.

Quote:

I think they want you to believe they do it for pleasure, but I don't believe it at all. Ha!, I say to that!!! The doing it for pleasure part is all part of the illusion.

It's a job. Some people like their jobs, some people don't. And I'll say it again. Some women actually DO enjoy porn, stripping, and all that other naughty stuff. For you to arrogantly assume that ALL women think the way you do [edit]

[edit]

Cirdan · 06-12-2002, 05:51 PM

BoP for president!

Lizra · 06-12-2002, 06:11 PM

I've caught your snot and flipped it back at ya, catch.

Cirdan · 06-12-2002, 06:17 PM

Umm, you might want to wash your hands

Self-victimizers of the world, unite!

The only thing we have to fear is ourselves!

BeardofPants · 06-12-2002, 06:27 PM

Ooh. Snot. I'll go and smear this on BF, monkey style!

Cirdan · 06-12-2002, 06:57 PM

...and then do it like they do it on "The Animal Planet"...

06-12-2002, 03:13 PM	#141
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	So are you pan-psychic who knows that all women think like you and those that say that they don't are lying. Or is it that all women lie. In which case why should I believe you. Maybe you are lying because you think your husband what's an anti-porn girl I just feel that you are being supercillious claiming to know what ALL women like. As if all are static beings with no variation. Why do you assume that ALL these girls are brainless? Some of these women are quite articulate aware. HOWEVER, some are trashy idiots. That's as bad as some ghetto punk arguing that all blacks feel as certain way and ANY black that is different is lying to themselves. I've had this applied to me. ( i don't think you are the equivalent of a ghetto punk) Are athletes objectified and abused because of their bodies. Should they stop playing sports and use their brains instead? Hmmm. I can do something with my body and make more money in a short time than i could in my life time studying for years and years. ONCE AGAIN I have NEVER denied that some don't like it. Actually, I find your opinion of women to be quite low. __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer.

06-12-2002, 03:13 PM	#142
Lizra Domesticated Swing Babe Join Date: May 2002 Location: Reality Posts: 5,340	no I don't see it . Honestly, I've explained myself thoroughly, we don't agree. OK...OK I'm done.. Oh my opinion of a very small minority of women is quite low. __________________ Happy Atheist Go Democrats! Last edited by Lizra : 06-12-2002 at 03:19 PM.

06-12-2002, 03:17 PM	#143
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	Its just seems that YOU don't like it and you can not understand how someone else can. So since you can't not see how they can ( MIGHT) like it. You denegrated them into brainless liars. __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer.

06-12-2002, 03:19 PM	#144
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	I think the point now is how can YOU claim to speak for ALL women? __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer.

06-12-2002, 03:20 PM	#145
Cirdan Elf Lord of the Grey Havens Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: somewhere else Posts: 2,381	Throughout human history, as our species has faced the frightening, terrorizing fact that we do not know who we are, or where we are going in this ocean of chaos, it has been the authorities, the political, the religious, the educational authorities who attempted to comfort us by giving us order, rules, regulations, informing, forming in our minds their view of reality. To think for yourself you must question authority and learn how to put yourself in a state of vulnerable, open-mindedness; chaotic, confused, vulnerability to inform yourself. Think for yourself. Question authority. -Tool __________________ There exists a limit to the force even ther most powerful may apply without destroying themselves. Judging this limit is the true artistry of government. Misuse of power is the fatal sin. The law cannot be a tool of vengance, never a hostage, nor a fortification against the martyrs it has created. You cannot threaten any individual and escape the consequences. -Muad'dib on Law The Stilgar Commentary

06-12-2002, 03:21 PM	#146
Lizra Domesticated Swing Babe Join Date: May 2002 Location: Reality Posts: 5,340	I don't claim to SPEAK for all women. I'm telling you MY opinion. Hey, I never called them brainless liars! Those are your words. __________________ Happy Atheist Go Democrats! Last edited by Lizra : 06-12-2002 at 03:25 PM.

06-12-2002, 03:26 PM	#148
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	Yet your opinion classifies ALL women who would make a choice you would not as brainless lairs. How can you say you have the knowledge that ALL women how make such a choice are. Its different to say I can't see how someone COULD enjoy, I don't like it. I think its wrong. But it is supercillious to claim that ALL those might think different that you are brainless lairs. __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer.

06-12-2002, 03:32 PM	#150
Lizra Domesticated Swing Babe Join Date: May 2002 Location: Reality Posts: 5,340	Well JD, You live your life and as the years pile up you are exposed to many experiences and realationships. You observe many people, choices, consequences, changes,whatever. Then you reflect on it all and come up with some conclusions. Nothing fancy, just hindsight I guess. Mine is different from someone elses I'm sure. It's just my opinion, maybe wrong, but I think its right. Don't get so bent out of shape over it! __________________ Happy Atheist Go Democrats!

06-12-2002, 03:42 PM	#152
Lizra Domesticated Swing Babe Join Date: May 2002 Location: Reality Posts: 5,340	YES!!!!! I have so much to do, this is taking too much of my time. Thanks __________________ Happy Atheist Go Democrats!

06-12-2002, 04:42 PM	#154
Lizra Domesticated Swing Babe Join Date: May 2002 Location: Reality Posts: 5,340	Too Bad! As I drink this delicious glass of Moscato, I offer a toast to Afro Elf for calling the truce. Cheers! __________________ Happy Atheist Go Democrats!

06-12-2002, 05:51 PM	#156
Cirdan Elf Lord of the Grey Havens Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: somewhere else Posts: 2,381	BoP for president! __________________ There exists a limit to the force even ther most powerful may apply without destroying themselves. Judging this limit is the true artistry of government. Misuse of power is the fatal sin. The law cannot be a tool of vengance, never a hostage, nor a fortification against the martyrs it has created. You cannot threaten any individual and escape the consequences. -Muad'dib on Law The Stilgar Commentary

06-12-2002, 06:11 PM	#157
Lizra Domesticated Swing Babe Join Date: May 2002 Location: Reality Posts: 5,340	I've caught your snot and flipped it back at ya, catch. __________________ Happy Atheist Go Democrats!

06-12-2002, 06:17 PM	#158
Cirdan Elf Lord of the Grey Havens Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: somewhere else Posts: 2,381	Umm, you might want to wash your hands Self-victimizers of the world, unite! The only thing we have to fear is ourselves! __________________ There exists a limit to the force even ther most powerful may apply without destroying themselves. Judging this limit is the true artistry of government. Misuse of power is the fatal sin. The law cannot be a tool of vengance, never a hostage, nor a fortification against the martyrs it has created. You cannot threaten any individual and escape the consequences. -Muad'dib on Law The Stilgar Commentary

06-12-2002, 06:27 PM	#159
BeardofPants the Shrike Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA <3 Posts: 10,647	Ooh. Snot. I'll go and smear this on BF, monkey style! __________________ "Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords

06-12-2002, 06:57 PM	#160
Cirdan Elf Lord of the Grey Havens Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: somewhere else Posts: 2,381	...and then do it like they do it on "The Animal Planet"... __________________ There exists a limit to the force even ther most powerful may apply without destroying themselves. Judging this limit is the true artistry of government. Misuse of power is the fatal sin. The law cannot be a tool of vengance, never a hostage, nor a fortification against the martyrs it has created. You cannot threaten any individual and escape the consequences. -Muad'dib on Law The Stilgar Commentary

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