Ancient Cultures

[sun-star]

Originally posted by Nurvingiel
A tunnel under Stonehenge? I don't like the idea, simply because they run the risk of disturbing the henge itself. That alone makes the project too risky IMO. Besides, I've been there, and when you're standing near those awesome stones, you forget about the highway. There's a hedge that shields your view of the parking lot.

It's not just to hide the road - it's also to improve congestion on it. It's an important route to the West Country and it needs to be improved anyway. I don't think the tunnel will go right under Stonehenge itself, though it will be very close:

artist's impression

It's more the surrounding area that's the problem.

Before and after

The whole issue's quite interesting in terms of how you accomodate modern needs and ancient monuments. Obviously we have to protect Stonehenge, but how much should be sacrificed to do it?

[Nurvingiel]

Thanks Sun-star. I guess it's okay then, except wouldn't excavations for the tunner take it dangerously close? I think something like Stonehenge deserves every possible protection, even at great expense.

[The Gaffer]

I hope you don't lose that first sight you get of the stones coming over the hill from the east.

* Has a proper look at the story *

At least they're doing a bored tunnel instead of cut 'n cover. Looks as if it'll be well under the stones.

[Valandil]

I sure hope Guillaume comes back soon! HE would have some good things to say about the King Harold thing. And I wonder if he's into historical Arthur research.

[Tuor of Gondolin]

On a different aspect of ancient cultures, it's interesting how perceptions of the Maya have changed. It used to be thought they were sort of warm and fuzzy, compared to the Aztecs warlike nature and human sacrifices, but archeological work has seemed to find them much more akin to the Aztecs in behavior and beliefs then previously thought. (Hey, I get National Geographic!) Although Sports Illustrated sometimes seems to have more, ah, revealing, pictures.

[Grey_Wolf]

Today I bought a book called Vikingar i österled(author: Mats G Larsson) which means Vikings going east . I have two other books by the same author:

Götarnas Riken : Upptäcktsfärder Till Sveriges Enande

Vinland Det Goda : Nordbornas Färder Till Amerika Under Vikingatiden

[The Gaffer]

Originally posted by Valandil
I sure hope Guillaume comes back soon! HE would have some good things to say about the King Harold thing. And I wonder if he's into historical Arthur research.

Yes, I was thinking that too. We need someone to wade in about how things were better in days of old when knights were bold (and women hadn't been invented...)

Actually, there's an interesting prog on the telly at the moment about the Middle Ages. Apparently, your typical peasant in the goat track had to work for about 50 days a year on the feudal lord's land to pay off his rent etc. Today, the average Brit has to work for about 80 days to pay off his or her rent/mortgage and taxes. Progress...??

[sun-star]

A little bump for:

Tolkien's hobbit hill up for sale at £500,000

It dominates views of the surrounding countryside and is credited as the inspiration for Tolkien's Middle Earth, and now the Wrekin, a 1,300ft hill, is up for sale.

It is deemed one of the most important of mid-Shropshire's heritage sites.

Tony Morris-Eyton, of the agents FPD Savills, said: "Anyone who knows Shropshire knows the Wrekin; it is an essential landmark and offers spellbinding views of the local area. For many centuries it has been used as a way for people to find their way home.

"Tolkien lived nearby and like a lot of writers drew influence from his local surroundings.

"It is said that he used the Wrekin upon which to base Middle Earth.

The Wrekin, which overlooks Telford, is so well known locally that it has entered the language of the Midlands people.

The expression "All round the Wrekin" means "going the long way" or "not explaining something clearly and directly".

Made, it is believed, from volcanic rock, it lies very close to the Church Stretton Fault, a dormant fault in the earth's crust.

Among its features is a pool that never dries up, known as the Raven's Eye. The public path up the hill will be included as a condition of sale.

The Wrekin was first populated by man in the Bronze Age.

The double fortress below the summit, now an ancient monument, was thought to have been completed by the Celts in the Iron Age.

Many believe that the Wrekin was the stronghold of Caracatus, one of the last leaders of the Ancient Britons.

Others believe that the last ruler of the hill fort was Virico, the leader of the Cornovi, who were defeated by Caesar's Roman empire.

During Saxon and Norman times the Wrekin became part of a royal hunting forest. Since the Iron Age the Wrekin's oak and beech trees have been used to build houses and coppiced to make charcoal.

Imprints of ancient charcoal pits can still be found in the woods.

Giants, mermaids and even the Devil all play a part in the folklore of the Wrekin.

One of the more popular stories is that of the giant and the cobbler.

The giant, to cut a long story short, was carrying a huge clod of earth under which he was going to bury Shrewsbury, but the cobbler persuaded him that the town was too far away and in despair the giant dumped the earth down, forming the Wrekin.

Another involves two exiled giants building a new home. They piled up soil to make a huge hill leaving a great, long trench, which filled with water and formed the Severn. The Wrekin, which is older than the Alps, the Himalayas and the Andes and may once have been even higher, is also valued for its geology and plantation.

[Last Child of Ungoliant]

i am doing a-levels in history and archaeology and as-level in classical civilisation in college, and i love all ancient history and mythology'tis extremely fascinating

[Last Child of Ungoliant]

Originally posted by sun-star
It's not just to hide the road - it's also to improve congestion on it. It's an important route to the West Country and it needs to be improved anyway. I don't think the tunnel will go right under Stonehenge itself, though it will be very close:

artist's impression

It's more the surrounding area that's the problem.

Before and after

The whole issue's quite interesting in terms of how you accomodate modern needs and ancient monuments. Obviously we have to protect Stonehenge, but how much should be sacrificed to do it?

i think it's a good idea, i live fairly near salisbury, and have used that road often to get to london and surrey, and the tunnel won't actually be going under the henge so there is no danger to the monument itself

[Lotesse]

Originally Posted by Falagar

Got this idea from a discussion that just arose in the Language-thread, which didn't really fit in there. I thought that since we all share a common love for LotR, it is natural that we also share a common love for "the good, brutal ol' days".

What do you think of the ancient cultures, like the romans, huns, vikings, native indians, ancient egyphtians, etc? Which one is to you the most interesting, most intriguing, etc? I'm no great historian (though I plan to be...some day ), so I'm hoping to learn a lot.

Just to start off, I've always been facinated by the Celts. A mystical people, of which we know very little (at least I don't). Is Julius "Julle" Caesar's claim that they were making human sacrifices regarded as a historical fact? How prominent were the Druids in their society?

I love the Celts, also the Greeks and the Romans, and the 17th-20th century Native Americans, I like the Greeks a lot, did I mention Greeks? and Rome, did I... mention... yeah. And the Mesopotamians, and ancient Persians, yeah baby!! And Atilla the Hun, what a genius. and, lemme see, I'll be back with more thoughts some other time, now that I've bumped the ghost of the beast of this old Ancient Thread...

[Lief Erikson]

I'm very impressed by the indomitable willpower of the Roman Republic. The willingness they showed to lay down everything to achieve their objectives is amazing.