Considering closing GM - Page 2

***Earniel*** · 05-07-2002, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Comic Book Guy
There is no reason why they should try to be newbies.

They're not trying to be newbies. They are newbies. No one knows a messageboard well before they blunder unto it.

Quote:

Originally posted by Comic Book Guy
And what?

I was merely pointing out that newbies aren't the only ones guilty of spam. What else would you like to hear? I thought it was pretty straight foreward....

Quote:

Originally posted by Comic Book Guy
It also happens to be the actual topic of this board.

I know that. I wouldn't be here if it wasn't that. But GM just happens to be a well-visited area of the entmoot.

Rána Eressëa · 05-07-2002, 04:43 PM

Nooooo! We cannot lose the lovable GM forum! I say we vote on it as a community!

afro-elf · 05-07-2002, 04:52 PM

hey rogue elf we could all just move to the crossroads of arda

emplynx · 05-07-2002, 04:55 PM

Let me compare Entmoot to a church picnic.
Why do people go to a church picnic? To talk to people who share beliefs with them and socialize. They will probably have some conversations with people about God, Jesus, and The Bible, but they really just like being with people like them.
Why do people come to Entmoot? To talk to people who share beliefs with them and socialize. They will probably have some conversations with people about Sauron, Gandalf, and The Balrog, but they really just like being with people like them.

Thank you.

StrawberryIcecream · 05-07-2002, 05:07 PM

it is human nature to go off subjecta little bit anyway. i like the idea of a vote though. after all we ARE the entmoot!

maybe set up twothrdsentitled yes and no. and then simply see whichone hasthe most replies.

and no one has answered my question. what is a newbie? when does a newbie no longer have to be called idiot?

afro-elf · 05-07-2002, 05:10 PM

it is a rare day I agree with you emplynx

ps are you truly 6'7' at age 16

i thought I was tall when i was 6' at 13

topped out at 6'2'

Rána Eressëa · 05-07-2002, 05:20 PM

Ooh . . . good idea, afro-elf. *evil snicker*

Darth Tater · 05-07-2002, 05:22 PM

There will be no vote. You should feel lucky we let you know we're even considering it.

**crickhollow** · 05-07-2002, 05:38 PM

a haven for spammers it surely is at times, but if you close GM the spammers may spread the spam to other threads. I like GM b/c I can start a thread about almost anything, and someone will reply. Likewise, there are valid discussions going on that would not fit in any other category on the moot.

When get on a kick where I feel like avoiding the rampant silliness that goes on in General Messages, I stick to the Gen Lit and the Tolkien areas.

So, my opinion is: leave the spammers a place to spam, and they will leave the rest of the moot in peace.

PS according to my current rate of posts, I don't think I'm considered a spammer anymore

Comic Book Guy · 05-07-2002, 06:24 PM

Quote:

They're not trying to be newbies. They are newbies. No one knows a messageboard well before they blunder unto it.

You said "So they should be", should they be Newbies deliberately then.

Quote:

I was merely pointing out that newbies aren't the only ones guilty of spam. What else would you like to hear? I thought it was pretty straight foreward....

Does that excuse spam then, because others are tempted?

Quote:

but if you close GM the spammers may spread the spam to other threads

Read below.

Quote:

So, my opinion is: leave the spammers a place to spam, and they will leave the rest of the moot in peace.

Yeah, whats next, a forum for swearing? A forum for flame wars?

emplynx · 05-07-2002, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Darth Tater
There will be no vote. You should feel lucky we let you know we're even considering it.

Hey, it is your board... See how you like it if we all leave.

P.S. I am not planning on going anywhere, even if you do close GM

Quote:

Originally posted by Comic Book Guy

A forum for flame wars?

That would be very popular, I'm sure!

Quote:

Originally posted by afro-elf
it is a rare day I agree with you emplynx

*bows* Wow, if you agree with me, it must be good

Quote:

Originally posted by afro-elf
ps are you truly 6'7' at age 16

Yes, where did you read that?
I also wear a size 16 (american) shoe

By the way, I am still growing so don't call that tall quite yet.

Quote:

Originally posted by afro-elf
i thought I was tall when i was 6' at 13

You wern't

afro-elf · 05-07-2002, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Yeah, whats next, a forum for swearing? A forum for flame wars?

that's just a slippery slope argument

but as emplynx said

Quote:

That would be very popular, I'm sure!

Quote:

thought I was tall when i was 6' at 13

Quote:

You wern't

LOL

we are agreeing a lot today

***azalea*** · 05-07-2002, 07:32 PM

I don't think spam is the only problem.
I think they don't want this to be just a place for people to hang out and yak (although I love to yak myself). I think they want to keep it a special place devoted to Tolkein's works, rather than just any old message board. I agree that I like to discuss many things with everyone here, but I'm just looking at it from their perspective. As harsh as it sounds, this board was not created for our personal (meaning individual) enjoyment, and I'll bet that some of them might be thinking if we want to talk about *insert Tolkein-irrelavent subject example here*, we should start our own. (THIS WAS NOT MEANT TO OFFEND OR TO BE RUDE. I just want to mention my thoughts about why this might be happening. If it were just spam, it would be dealt with as they've done, so that's why I suspect it's more than that).
I guess I'm considered a newbie, but I hope I've not been annoying, but rather excited to find a place to post my opinions on different Tolkein debates, ideas, etc., and to read others' opinions and ideas.
I don't want GM to be closed, but if it doesn't fit with the admn's vision for the board, so be it. I'll still have plenty to say (all appropriate of course).

Khadrane · 05-07-2002, 07:45 PM

What emplynx said. I really don't think you should close GM. I'd give you some great argument, but I stink at that kind of stuff.

P.S.- 6'7" at sixteen? Do you play basketball?

Starr Polish · 05-07-2002, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by crickhollow
a haven for spammers it surely is at times, but if you close GM the spammers may spread the spam to other threads. I like GM b/c I can start a thread about almost anything, and someone will reply. Likewise, there are valid discussions going on that would not fit in any other category on the moot.

Exactly my feelings.

***Ben*** · 05-07-2002, 08:34 PM

I think emplynx has the right idea.

There is only so much that one can say about Tolkien. The movies have revitalized interest, but after a time, most discussion will be exhausted. Especially due to our strictly-enforced "redundant thread" policies, it is becoming increasingly difficult for the new or casual Tolkien fan to find anything original or interesting to discuss. Even the seasoned Tolkienites would have to think hard to come up with something never mentioned once in the past 2 and a half years.

For someone who is worn out (at least temporarily) by coming up with more comments on everyone's favorite story, there are two options. One is to leave, and the other is to join the community here in General Messages. I think the latter is preferable, because it keeps the board going. As emplynx said, it's nice to chat with people with similar interests.

The board was certainly started to discuss the works of J.R.R. Tolkien. However, it was also created in the spirit of the Jedi Council - where all the "regulars" had long since stopped being regulars in the actual Star Wars forums, and instead congregated in the miscellaneous area. Tater himself founded an RPG/chat series in which he was Emperor.

The only way that themed message boards can remain successful is by balancing the distinguishing "real" content with the needs of a growing virtual community.

Has this forum had more than its share of inane and pointless messages? Sure. Just as we can't expect everyone discuss Tolkien 24/7, we can't expect you to participate in intellectual debates all the time either (which tend to degenerate into flame wars anyway, but I digress

)

I think that some of the suggestions in this thread are valid. An official welcome thread would certainly cut down on the amount of new threads, but the others don't really need to be shoved into one topic, imo.

Renille · 05-07-2002, 08:54 PM

Okay, as usual, I'm here after everything of value has been said. But also as usual, I'm going to put in my 2 cents anyways.
Entmoot may be primarily for Tolkien. But even if you deleted this forum, don't you think people would discuss Tolkien non-related subjects elsewhere, anyway? Unless the administration plans on being extremely busy, this is almost inevitable. I think it was wise to include this forum just to talk. Expanding on emplynx's church picnic thing...Entmoot is like school. You come here to learn and teach, but you also meet great people. Please don't close this forum down. I probably won't argue if it is closed, because I understand the reasoning. But I will be dissapointed.

galadriel88 · 05-07-2002, 09:13 PM

I basically agree with most everyone here, and I think emplynx sums it up pretty well. I'm not sure what i'll do if you do decide to close GM, I might stay, but like Ben said, there's only so much to discuss before it's all been said. Especially considering that I'm a new Tolkein fan and haven't even finished ROTK yet, I don't have much to contribute to the Tolkein related forums. Yeah, I drop by and post on a few threads occasionally, but I don't want to spoil anything for myself, and of course I can't make a single comment in The Silmarillon. That being said, if I stay, I won't post very often, at least until i finish some more of Tolkein's works. The alternative? Leave, which I don't really want to do, because every other mb I've been to hasn't been as well organized, kept up, and frequented as this one. (No offense to emplynx and RE.) I have alot of fun here, and leaving would definitely make my mom happy, but my hope is that the admins and mods will seriously consider an alternative to closing GM. That's all I've got to say for now.

frodosgirlfriend · 05-07-2002, 09:50 PM

i think it's a really bad idia. alot of ppl will prob leave if u close the GM.

Quote:

a haven for spammers it surely is at times, but if you close GM the spammers may spread the spam to other threads. I like GM b/c I can start a thread about almost anything, and someone will reply. Likewise, there are valid discussions going on that would not fit in any other category on the moot

i thought the exact same thing. it would just really suck if u put the pad lock on the entire GM. even if there is some spam, it's still a cool place to yap & yap & yap about nothing important, or some things that r. i've only seen the lotr movie and am 2 chaps away from finishing ttt. i'm not much of a Tolkein fan who has read each book about 50 times and takes classes on him & such & such. at the moment i'm a lotr movie fan. but i will be a Tolkein fan soon enough.

i've already had so many things spoiled from looking at the Tolkein stuff i don't even need to read the books! that's y i mainly poast here in the GM. i really don't think this is a good idia

Menelvagor · 05-07-2002, 10:20 PM

Well, I won't be inciting a riot is GM is closed, but I strongly agree with Ben in that without the break from Tolkien that GM provides a lot of people would post less. There are some times when you just can't talk anymore about Tolkien, and when that happens you can either hang out in General for a while until your inspiriation returns or leave. If there was no General then all the breaking regulars/oldbies would leave (and we all know that half the people that leave never come back, even if they originally meant too), what does that leave you with? An increased ratio of newbies.

05-07-2002, 04:52 PM	#23
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	hey rogue elf we could all just move to the crossroads of arda __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer.

05-07-2002, 05:07 PM	#25
StrawberryIcecream Elf Lord Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: In my jeans Posts: 915	it is human nature to go off subjecta little bit anyway. i like the idea of a vote though. after all we ARE the entmoot! maybe set up twothrdsentitled yes and no. and then simply see whichone hasthe most replies. and no one has answered my question. what is a newbie? when does a newbie no longer have to be called idiot? __________________ www.foolofatook.com for all you pippin's out there.

05-07-2002, 05:10 PM	#26
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	it is a rare day I agree with you emplynx ps are you truly 6'7' at age 16 i thought I was tall when i was 6' at 13 topped out at 6'2' __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer.

05-07-2002, 05:22 PM	#28
Darth Tater The man Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: MA Posts: 4,572	There will be no vote. You should feel lucky we let you know we're even considering it. __________________ Visit the worlds greatest webpage! No, not The Tolkien Trail! Just click this! The Tolkien Trail ~Camelot

05-07-2002, 05:38 PM	#29
crickhollow The Buckleberry Fairy/Captain Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Washington State again (I miss Texas). Posts: 1,345	a haven for spammers it surely is at times, but if you close GM the spammers may spread the spam to other threads. I like GM b/c I can start a thread about almost anything, and someone will reply. Likewise, there are valid discussions going on that would not fit in any other category on the moot. When get on a kick where I feel like avoiding the rampant silliness that goes on in General Messages, I stick to the Gen Lit and the Tolkien areas. So, my opinion is: leave the spammers a place to spam, and they will leave the rest of the moot in peace. PS according to my current rate of posts, I don't think I'm considered a spammer anymore __________________ A day will come at last when I Shall take the hidden paths that run West of the Moon, East of the Sun.

05-07-2002, 04:43 PM	#22
Rána Eressëa The Rogue Elf Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 1,722	Nooooo! We cannot lose the lovable GM forum! I say we vote on it as a community!

05-07-2002, 04:55 PM	#24
emplynx Self-Appointed Lord of the Free Peoples of the General Messages Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 1,214	Let me compare Entmoot to a church picnic. Why do people go to a church picnic? To talk to people who share beliefs with them and socialize. They will probably have some conversations with people about God, Jesus, and The Bible, but they really just like being with people like them. Why do people come to Entmoot? To talk to people who share beliefs with them and socialize. They will probably have some conversations with people about Sauron, Gandalf, and The Balrog, but they really just like being with people like them. Thank you.

05-07-2002, 05:20 PM	#27
Rána Eressëa The Rogue Elf Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 1,722	Ooh . . . good idea, afro-elf. evil snicker

05-07-2002, 07:32 PM	#33
*azalea* Long lost mooter Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Florida Posts: 3,342	I don't think spam is the only problem. I think they don't want this to be just a place for people to hang out and yak (although I love to yak myself). I think they want to keep it a special place devoted to Tolkein's works, rather than just any old message board. I agree that I like to discuss many things with everyone here, but I'm just looking at it from their perspective. As harsh as it sounds, this board was not created for our personal (meaning individual) enjoyment, and I'll bet that some of them might be thinking if we want to talk about insert Tolkein-irrelavent subject example here, we should start our own. (THIS WAS NOT MEANT TO OFFEND OR TO BE RUDE. I just want to mention my thoughts about why this might be happening. If it were just spam, it would be dealt with as they've done, so that's why I suspect it's more than that). I guess I'm considered a newbie, but I hope I've not been annoying, but rather excited to find a place to post my opinions on different Tolkein debates, ideas, etc., and to read others' opinions and ideas. I don't want GM to be closed, but if it doesn't fit with the admn's vision for the board, so be it. I'll still have plenty to say (all appropriate of course).

05-07-2002, 07:45 PM	#34
Khadrane Elf Lord Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Middle Earth (I wish) Posts: 670	What emplynx said. I really don't think you should close GM. I'd give you some great argument, but I stink at that kind of stuff. P.S.- 6'7" at sixteen? Do you play basketball? __________________ Few know whither their road will take them till they come to its end. -Legolas FRODO LIVES! ABORTION IS HOMICIDE

05-07-2002, 08:34 PM	#36
*Ben* Retired Ent Join Date: Sep 1999 Posts: 60,631	I think emplynx has the right idea. There is only so much that one can say about Tolkien. The movies have revitalized interest, but after a time, most discussion will be exhausted. Especially due to our strictly-enforced "redundant thread" policies, it is becoming increasingly difficult for the new or casual Tolkien fan to find anything original or interesting to discuss. Even the seasoned Tolkienites would have to think hard to come up with something never mentioned once in the past 2 and a half years. For someone who is worn out (at least temporarily) by coming up with more comments on everyone's favorite story, there are two options. One is to leave, and the other is to join the community here in General Messages. I think the latter is preferable, because it keeps the board going. As emplynx said, it's nice to chat with people with similar interests. The board was certainly started to discuss the works of J.R.R. Tolkien. However, it was also created in the spirit of the Jedi Council - where all the "regulars" had long since stopped being regulars in the actual Star Wars forums, and instead congregated in the miscellaneous area. Tater himself founded an RPG/chat series in which he was Emperor. The only way that themed message boards can remain successful is by balancing the distinguishing "real" content with the needs of a growing virtual community. Has this forum had more than its share of inane and pointless messages? Sure. Just as we can't expect everyone discuss Tolkien 24/7, we can't expect you to participate in intellectual debates all the time either (which tend to degenerate into flame wars anyway, but I digress ) I think that some of the suggestions in this thread are valid. An official welcome thread would certainly cut down on the amount of new threads, but the others don't really need to be shoved into one topic, imo. __________________ ---Ben formerly known in the forums as bmilder Owner of The Tolkien Trail and Entmoot. Buy Entmoot shirts and mugs!

05-07-2002, 08:54 PM	#37
Renille Elven Lady of Speed-posting Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the cheese state Posts: 988	Okay, as usual, I'm here after everything of value has been said. But also as usual, I'm going to put in my 2 cents anyways. Entmoot may be primarily for Tolkien. But even if you deleted this forum, don't you think people would discuss Tolkien non-related subjects elsewhere, anyway? Unless the administration plans on being extremely busy, this is almost inevitable. I think it was wise to include this forum just to talk. Expanding on emplynx's church picnic thing...Entmoot is like school. You come here to learn and teach, but you also meet great people. Please don't close this forum down. I probably won't argue if it is closed, because I understand the reasoning. But I will be dissapointed. __________________ Oh the thinks you can think! Think and wonder and dream...far and wide as you dare! When your thinks have run dry, in the blink of an eye, there's another world there... (from Seussical the Musical. Listen to it...watch it...really.)

05-07-2002, 09:13 PM	#38
galadriel88 Halfwitted Queen of Lothlorien Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Far off in a dream Posts: 1,166	I basically agree with most everyone here, and I think emplynx sums it up pretty well. I'm not sure what i'll do if you do decide to close GM, I might stay, but like Ben said, there's only so much to discuss before it's all been said. Especially considering that I'm a new Tolkein fan and haven't even finished ROTK yet, I don't have much to contribute to the Tolkein related forums. Yeah, I drop by and post on a few threads occasionally, but I don't want to spoil anything for myself, and of course I can't make a single comment in The Silmarillon. That being said, if I stay, I won't post very often, at least until i finish some more of Tolkein's works. The alternative? Leave, which I don't really want to do, because every other mb I've been to hasn't been as well organized, kept up, and frequented as this one. (No offense to emplynx and RE.) I have alot of fun here, and leaving would definitely make my mom happy, but my hope is that the admins and mods will seriously consider an alternative to closing GM. That's all I've got to say for now. __________________ The beuatiful mind/The beautiful heart/Doesn't deserve the pain/How can I stop the rain? -How Can I Stop the Rain? by Kessid, my new favorite band +Every good thing that comes into my life is only a reflection of the greatest gift of all; the offering of yourself, dear Son of God+ Always remember, you're uniqe, just like everybody else! "The one constant through all the years has been the Trombone. America has rolled by like an army of steamrollers. Its been erased like a blackboard, rebuilt and erased again, but the Trombone has marked the time. This field, this section, this band is a part of our past. It reminds us of all that once was good, and could be again. Oh, people will come . . . people will most definitely come."

05-07-2002, 10:20 PM	#40
Menelvagor Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: lurking on the edge of conversations Posts: 924	Well, I won't be inciting a riot is GM is closed, but I strongly agree with Ben in that without the break from Tolkien that GM provides a lot of people would post less. There are some times when you just can't talk anymore about Tolkien, and when that happens you can either hang out in General for a while until your inspiriation returns or leave. If there was no General then all the breaking regulars/oldbies would leave (and we all know that half the people that leave never come back, even if they originally meant too), what does that leave you with? An increased ratio of newbies.

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