I feel naked.......

[ArwenEvenstar]

is it just me or when things that really matter get discussed on MB they end up having flaming in them???

[Lizra]

Everytime I'd start to read that thread I'd get frustrated, not knowing what to think. I need to hear all the intelligence reports! They aren't reporting to me though.......

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by ArwenEvenstar
is it just me or when things that really matter get discussed on MB they end up having flaming in them???

No - it's just arguments get heated sometimes. I wasn't going to sit by and just let someone say that America was the cause of the French Revolution. And yeah - I was sarcastic - especially my last comment.

[Sister Golden Hair]

Originally posted by ArwenEvenstar
is it just me or when things that really matter get discussed on MB they end up having flaming in them???

I think it's that certian topics are just very explosive, especially on a worldwide MB, and especially things of a political nature. Opinions will differ, and people get angry, and that may sometimes lead to flaming. It is normal, but that is what moderators are for. To keep the peace and the discussion running smoothly. When that becomes impossible, then the thread gets closed.

[Dúnedain]

Originally posted by Lizra
Everytime I'd start to read that thread I'd get frustrated, not knowing what to think. I need to hear all the intelligence reports! They aren't reporting to me though.......

Why would they report them to you specifically, go find them, they are out there on government and news sites...

[The Lady of Ithilien]

Originally posted by Sister Golden Hair
I think it's that certian topics are just very explosive, especially on a worldwide MB, and especially things of a political nature. Opinions will differ, and people get angry, and that may sometimes lead to flaming. It is normal, but that is what moderators are for. To keep the peace and the discussion running smoothly. When that becomes impossible, then the thread gets closed.

But I didn't notice anything different in the last posts by the "usual suspects" (I won't name names, but the JerseyDevil and Coney DoseyDo was going on per usual yet not even as heated IMO as it had sometimes gotten earlier) and then suddenly whammo -- a threat of closure, followed by some unrelated posts by folks I hadn't seen in the discussion before that were indeed heavily sarcastic, but not characteristic of the thread as a whole -- and then closure for that.

It had a chilling effect.

You see, everybody, the thing about political discussions is not that they get heated -- they always get heated -- but that any limitation on them that is not completely understandable to everybody in or out of the discussion, especially when done by the powerful, engenders bad feelings and fear.

What else is this title about: "I feel naked." Yeah. So do I, and I wasn't even very much involved in the thread, just checking in for a looksee and maybe a vent every 15 pages or so. I had also been looking forward to becoming an Elf Lord but wonder now how carefully I'm going to have to talk in my posts throughout Entmoot. That takes all the fun out of it.

BTW, this is not to say that closing the "Iraq" thread was done out of partiality; I don't know why it was done. It makes no sense to me. It is to say, if such things are going to happen, then no such discussions should ever be allowed.

So, for whatever it's worth (probably not much), my suggestion is: put a stop to discussion of all controversial topics here, even in General Messages, right now, just let's do it, or when something like this does come up, where it's not really clear to everybody why the thread had to be closed (and the Supreme Ent, whose opinion is most important and final, has not weighed in on it), then why not put it to a vote, whether the thread should be closed or, if already closed, opened?

[Sister Golden Hair]

Are you implying that I overstepped my bounds? You are more than welcome to appeal to Ben if you feel that I have acted inappropriately by closing the thread. This forum has three admins assigned to it who none, save Khamul was on line at the time of the incodent, and he came on after the fact. I think if you were to talk to the people that were involved, they would tell you that I closed the thread without partiality. I spoke with everyone of them either by PM or IM, and they were all very cooperative and understood. I don't think that you are going to find any well moderated forum on the web whose staff is going to put up with ignored warnings one after the other, and allow constant flaming and flame baiting, without taking action. Ben has asked his staff to do a job, and trusts there judgement and discretion. It is not about disallowing topics of a volatile nature, but about the posters adhereng to the rules that they agreed to when they registered. If a person cannot take part in discussion without flaming, and controlling their temper, then they shouldn't post. This is a Tolkien board, not a board made for personal attacks. The staff has allowed these threads as a courtesy to the boards members. It is up to the members to see to their behavior and to follow the rules. Again, if you feel that my actions were inappropriate, then feel free to contact Ben. That is your right as a member.

Btw, the next time you have any questions or comments about the actions of a moderator, drop them a PM or email, because it is against policy to question it in open forum.

[Dúnedain]

Originally posted by The Lady of Ithilien
What else is this title about: "I feel naked."

Oh, it means many things

[ArwenEvenstar]

i dont want to think about 'Mooters naked!!!!! ahhh


*runs out of thread screaming my poor virgin eyes*

[wahine]

Originally posted by ArwenEvenstar
i never posted much in the Iraq thread, but why was it closed?

Immature men who felt a need to test their testosterone levels?

Same old-Same old. *wicked laughter* MUahahahah

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by The Lady of Ithilien
But I didn't notice anything different in the last posts by the "usual suspects" (I won't name names, but the JerseyDevil and Coney DoseyDo was going on per usual yet not even as heated IMO as it had sometimes gotten earlier)

Yeah - it wasn't a serious argument. not as heated as others in my opinion either. But oh well - life goes on (whether you want it to or not).

[Lizra]

Originally posted by Dúnedain
Why would they report them to you specifically, go find them, they are out there on government and news sites...

That was a joke. Ha Ha! You think I'd believe the government and news stuff! I want the real facts, not something filtered. Besides, the intelligence reports are not being "reported". I want to hear what is whispered in George Bush's ear!

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by Lizra
That was a joke. Ha Ha! You think I'd believe the government and news stuff! I want the real facts, not something filtered. Besides, the intelligence reports are not being "reported". I want to hear what is whispered in George Bush's ear!

And how do we know you're not in cahoots with the enemy? You can be an iraqi spy.

[Lizra]

Exactly! I'm paranoid!

[The Lady of Ithilien]

Originally posted by Sister Golden Hair
Are you implying that I overstepped my bounds?

Oh no, sister, you won't find me looking for a doseydo; Buddhists can't dance.

Anyway, I never imply anything; time is too short to waste it in such a way. And there is all the difference in the world between describing something as it actually is, which is what was done, and interpreting it, which I could not do, as I didn't and still don't understand it.

You are more than welcome to appeal to Ben if you feel that I have acted inappropriately by closing the thread.

I wouldn't want to put him in such a difficult spot by acting so directly. One assumes he reads the threads and that he is silent on this by choice, and I respect that.

Btw, the next time you have any questions or comments about the actions of a moderator, drop them a PM or email, because it is against policy to question it in open forum.

Now that I find myself wondering about the correctness of my actions, well, there goes all the fun. Paranoia, indeed. How dull. Time to move on, I guess. Bye.

[markedel]

I think this is the beauty and horror of these kinds of boards-you can speak far more freely without having to actually deal with "people" but in intense conversations that odds of civility ending are high.

[Coney]

Originally posted by markedel
I think this is the beauty and horror of these kinds of boards-you can speak far more freely without having to actually deal with "people" but in intense conversations that odds of civility ending are high.

This is true, the high level of anonymity granted by the internet often encourages some social elements that would be frowned upon in real life........it's both a blessing and a curse I suppose, freedom to express yourself without any fear of an acutual repercussion. (give or take the odd computer virus).

When I used to dabble in chatrooms I used to be amazed at the rude/ignorant way people would address each other. Until I realised that for a lot of sad people the internet was just a place where they could flex their ego's.

Personally I'm gratefull that people are willing to spend the time (not to mention patience) editing/deleting post's here and if my post's are edited, then so what? The 'moot has rules and codes of conduct and if I break them, action will be taken...We all knew this when we joined up. They are the same rules that keep the 'moot an enjoyable place.

In my experience unmoderated/laxly moderated forums go one of two ways. They either become a spam-fest, which can be funny but does get a little boring after a while. Or individual threads are flooded by a small group of people, who reply to every single post, which becomes even more boring and does nothing to encourage free discussion.

To be honest the initial post of this thread surprised me. I think that everyone knows that I enjoyed a bit of a "doseydo" (great word that) every week or so in the Iraq thread....and yep, I'll miss it but it was just one thread amongst the thousands in the 'moot. The aftershock of it being closed is just amazing (and a little worrying), there are a multitude of message boards out there solely centered around politics, there are even a few that only concentrate on the Iraq' situation. Why is so much fuss being made about the closure of this thread on a Tolkien-centered board when there are so many options out there for this kind of discussion?

To me the 'moot is about variety, I regularly post in a half dozen threads and I occasionally post in about a dozen more (these numbers obviously change along with the nature of current threads). The Iraq thread was closed but that hasn't changed my opinion of the 'moot, it simply means that next time I feel like discussing the Iraq' situation I'll visit a message board that is centered towards that. Where as on the 'moot I'll continue to enjoy the threads that are active.

Besides I'm sure there will be other political discussions in the future

[Rían]

Originally posted by Coney
Well, the conversation had degenerated into sacarsm......a complete breakdown of civilised conversation

Oh, and Rian went into labour

ROTFL!!! Hey, I made medical history - went into labor w/o being pregnant!




I think it's great that the 'volatile' topics can go so long here, like Smaug was saying. It must be because Tolkien fans are unusually intelligent, courteous and considerate, as well as amazingly handsome and beautiful Go us!!

And SGH - you go, girlfriend!! I think that your salary should be doubled!!!!! (let's see - 2 times $0 is what? ) - thanks again for keeping the board a great place to post!

[Sister Golden Hair]

Well said Coney. And there is no doubt that there will be other political discussions on Entmoot. The closing of the "Iraq" thread does not imply a ban on political discussion or the discussion of Iraq. It was a way to stop the flames, and calm some tempers. All I have asked of everyone since its closure, is to have a cooling off period before any such discussion is brought back.

I have taken a lot of heat for closing that thread, but I want everyone to understand that eventhough things may have seemed worse at other points in it, and it was allowed to remain open, there is a limit, and the last straw. You know, in most cases it is the conduct of the posters themselves that will determine the fate of a thread. In this case, it was IMO becoming explosive and off topic, and was no longer conducive to the discussion. In short, it was spinning out of control as it had before.

I am sure that everyone's withdrawl will be short lived, and If any new discussions surface in the near future, that all will exercise more self-control, because the next time you know what will happen and that thread may not last for 55 pages, or even 10. That will be up to the participants, and I for one, do not wish to be on the other side of the fence as this last time.

[Sister Golden Hair]

Originally posted by RÃ*an
ROTFL!!! Hey, I made medical history - went into labor w/o being pregnant!




I think it's great that the 'volatile' topics can go so long here, like Smaug was saying. It must be because Tolkien fans are unusually intelligent, courteous and considerate, as well as amazingly handsome and beautiful Go us!!

And SGH - you go, girlfriend!! I think that your salary should be doubled!!!!! (let's see - 2 times $0 is what? ) - thanks again for keeping the board a great place to post!

Thanks for the suuport Rian.