ADD & ADHD in kids- bad parenting? - Page 6

BeardofPants · 05-06-2004, 06:24 PM

[random comment]I went to school with someone who was highly violent. One day he got expelled for dragging a younger kid's face down a rough brick wall. Two years later, I read about him in the newspaper. He'd hacked his flatmate to death with a machete. Because he was off his meds that he was taking for schizophrenia. Scary thing is, I had a run-in with him myself in drama class just before he was expelled. [/random comment]

Cirdan · 05-08-2004, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BeardofPants
[random comment]I went to school with someone who was highly violent. ... Because he was off his meds that he was taking for schizophrenia.... [/random comment]

This is the area where people fail to realize the consequences in cases where medication is the only real solution. Too often the focus is on marginal cases where medication seems to be a convenience rather than a neccessity. The best conpromise is a few over-medicated people in order to provide a climate for a more stable society overall.

Allowing a few atrocities or even personal tragedies for the sake of a " drug free society" aesthetic is irresponsible and short-sighted.

Elvengirl · 05-10-2004, 11:11 AM

randon links -
Kids responsible for school shootings on medication for "mental" disorders.
another random link

Ragnarok - Yes, it is the person's own decision. But there are school where young children are being put on medications without even consulting the parents.
I'm not forcing anyone to stop taking medication. I am stating my opinions and giving the data I have to back them up.

Cirdan, I'm not saying I want to live in a society of disfunctional people. For some taking drugs is the only solution they have, but when there's a choice to be happy and healthy without the use of drugs then wouldn't that be a better solution?

brownjenkins · 05-10-2004, 11:33 AM

i agree, as i probably mentioned earlier in this thread...

in the US there is a tendency to use medication as a first choice, as opposed to a final one... medicine whose effects are sometimes no more understood than the disease itself

there is also very little serious thought given to drug interactions until very recently

and worst of all, there are tremendous financial incentives for doctors to use certain medications... this is never a good thing

take what you have to... but only when you know you have no alternative... and be sure to do your own research

The Gaffer · 05-10-2004, 01:11 PM

THe problem with that is that there is a whole bunch of stuff on the internet, precious little of it is based on good quality research and it's almost impossible to tell which is which. As a result, people often tend to select information that backs up their prejudices.

There's no substitute for client, parent or carer and care professionals sitting down and coming to an informed choice based on the best available evidence from systematic research. What works for some people may not work for others.

Here's a link to a good quality summary by York University based on this article in the Canadian Journal of Psychiatry

brownjenkins · 05-10-2004, 02:20 PM

i agree, but the more research you do, the more you will be able to weed out the good from the bad

there is so much out there it is difficult for even the specialists to know every angle on a given product... my wife had a quite serious drug interaction between an antibiotic and prednisone (something she found later documented on the internet, on the drug company's own site)... the neuro-specialist who prescribed it was aware of the fact that she was taking antibiotics at the time, but either did not know a reaction was possible, or did not mention it

two specialists she saw afterwards questioned the fact that she was even prescribed the prednisone... her bloodtests signalled a possibility of lupus, but she had shown no outward symptoms, and lupus is such an unknown quantity, that most would forestall treatment in the absence of symptoms

i can understand the difficultly with all that is on the market today, but that is all the more reason why the consumer should educate themselves on any particular affliction they may have

The Gaffer · 05-10-2004, 02:53 PM

Well, you're right there. It's been estimated that just in general (internal) medicine (never mind the specialties) you'd need to read 19 journals a day every day to keep up with all the important research. They can't be expected to know everything.

Sadly, too many docs regard this as a threat to be covered up rather than an opportunity to engage with the patient, and they often don't know how to tell good quality research from bad either.

Your drug interaction story sounds serious. That sort of thing ought to be listed in standard formularies available to all prescribers.

05-06-2004, 06:24 PM	#101
BeardofPants the Shrike Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA <3 Posts: 10,647	[random comment]I went to school with someone who was highly violent. One day he got expelled for dragging a younger kid's face down a rough brick wall. Two years later, I read about him in the newspaper. He'd hacked his flatmate to death with a machete. Because he was off his meds that he was taking for schizophrenia. Scary thing is, I had a run-in with him myself in drama class just before he was expelled. [/random comment] __________________ "Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords

05-10-2004, 11:11 AM	#103
Elvengirl Mirthful Maiden Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Rivendell Posts: 1,252	randon links - Kids responsible for school shootings on medication for "mental" disorders. another random link Ragnarok - Yes, it is the person's own decision. But there are school where young children are being put on medications without even consulting the parents. I'm not forcing anyone to stop taking medication. I am stating my opinions and giving the data I have to back them up. Cirdan, I'm not saying I want to live in a society of disfunctional people. For some taking drugs is the only solution they have, but when there's a choice to be happy and healthy without the use of drugs then wouldn't that be a better solution? __________________ The Elves represent, as it were, the artistic, aesthetic, and purely scientific aspects of the Humane nature raised to a higher level than is actually seen in Men.~ J.R.R. Tolkien Wanna play? www.thievesguild.com

05-10-2004, 11:33 AM	#104
brownjenkins Advocatus Diaboli Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Reality Posts: 3,767	i agree, as i probably mentioned earlier in this thread... in the US there is a tendency to use medication as a first choice, as opposed to a final one... medicine whose effects are sometimes no more understood than the disease itself there is also very little serious thought given to drug interactions until very recently and worst of all, there are tremendous financial incentives for doctors to use certain medications... this is never a good thing take what you have to... but only when you know you have no alternative... and be sure to do your own research __________________ Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever.

05-10-2004, 02:20 PM	#106
brownjenkins Advocatus Diaboli Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Reality Posts: 3,767	i agree, but the more research you do, the more you will be able to weed out the good from the bad there is so much out there it is difficult for even the specialists to know every angle on a given product... my wife had a quite serious drug interaction between an antibiotic and prednisone (something she found later documented on the internet, on the drug company's own site)... the neuro-specialist who prescribed it was aware of the fact that she was taking antibiotics at the time, but either did not know a reaction was possible, or did not mention it two specialists she saw afterwards questioned the fact that she was even prescribed the prednisone... her bloodtests signalled a possibility of lupus, but she had shown no outward symptoms, and lupus is such an unknown quantity, that most would forestall treatment in the absence of symptoms i can understand the difficultly with all that is on the market today, but that is all the more reason why the consumer should educate themselves on any particular affliction they may have __________________ Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever.

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05-10-2004, 01:11 PM	#105
The Gaffer Elf Lord Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: In me taters Posts: 3,288	THe problem with that is that there is a whole bunch of stuff on the internet, precious little of it is based on good quality research and it's almost impossible to tell which is which. As a result, people often tend to select information that backs up their prejudices. There's no substitute for client, parent or carer and care professionals sitting down and coming to an informed choice based on the best available evidence from systematic research. What works for some people may not work for others. Here's a link to a good quality summary by York University based on this article in the Canadian Journal of Psychiatry

05-10-2004, 02:53 PM	#107
The Gaffer Elf Lord Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: In me taters Posts: 3,288	Well, you're right there. It's been estimated that just in general (internal) medicine (never mind the specialties) you'd need to read 19 journals a day every day to keep up with all the important research. They can't be expected to know everything. Sadly, too many docs regard this as a threat to be covered up rather than an opportunity to engage with the patient, and they often don't know how to tell good quality research from bad either. Your drug interaction story sounds serious. That sort of thing ought to be listed in standard formularies available to all prescribers.