Happy Veterans' Day / Remembrance Day - Page 2

GrayMouser · 11-12-2003, 08:40 AM

In Canada (British Columbia, anyway) Remembrance Day wasn't a holiday, but we did observe the two minutes silence at 11 o'clock. So thanks to my father, both grandfathers, a whole bunch of uncles and a couple of aunts, and all the other vets out there who fought the good fight.

Most famous poem from WWI

In Flanders Fields

In Flanders fields the poppies blow
Between the crosses, row on row
That mark our place; and in the sky
The larks, still bravely singing, fly
Scarce heard amid the guns below.

We are the Dead. Short days ago
We lived, felt dawn, saw sunset glow,
Loved and were loved, and now we lie
In Flanders fields.

Take up our quarrel with the foe:
To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

GrayMouser · 11-12-2003, 08:44 AM

And, in balance, my favourite anti-war song'

The Green Fields of France

Well how do you do Private William McBride,
Do you mind if I sit here down by your graveside?
And rest for awhile beneath the warm summer sun,
I've been walking all day and now I'm nearly done
I see by your gravestone you were only nineteen
When you joined the glorious fallen in 1916;
Well I hope you died quick and I hope you died clean,
Or, young Willie McBride, was it slow and obscene?

Refrain:
Did they beat the drum slowly,
Did they play the fife lowly?
Did they sound the Death March
As they lowered you down?
Did the band play
"The Last Post And Chorus?"
Did the pipes play
"The Flowers Of The Forest?"

Did you leave 'ere a wife or a sweetheart behind?
In some faithful heart is your memory enshrined?
And although you died back in 1916,
In that faithful heart are you forever nineteen?
Or are you a stranger without even a name,
Enclosed forever behind a glass pane,
In an old photograph, torn, and battered and stained,
And faded to yellow in a brown leather frame?
Refrain:

Ah the sun now it shines on these green fields of France,
The warm summer breeze makes the red poppies dance,
And look how the sun shines from under the clouds;
There's no gas, no barbed wire, there're no guns firing now.
But here in this graveyard is still No Man's Land,
The countless white crosses in mute witness stand
To man's blind indifference to his fellow man,
To a whole generation that was butchered and damned.
Refrain:

Ah, young Willie McBride, I can't help wonder why,
Did all those who lay here really know why they died?
And did they believe when they answered the call,
Did they really believe that this war would end war?
For the sorrow, the suffering, the glory, the pain,
The killing and dying were all done in vain,
For, young Willie McBride, it all happened again,
And again and again and again and again.
Refrain:

***Earniel*** · 11-12-2003, 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Sheeana
Earniel, do you know what's going on with the archaeological finds in Flanders field? I know that they're trying to build a motorway or something through it.

What kind of archaeological finds? Those of the two Wars? In that case, it's often difficult not to build a motorway through it as large parts of Flanders are covered with World War battlefields. Some of those sites that still exist today are often protected.

In any case, I believe the law dictates that in case of building motorways or that (brain-numbingly stupid, but you didn't hear that from me) high-velocity-train-railway they're pulling through half of Flanders, emergency excavations have to take place before or as soon as they find any artefact or indication of former buildings. It's definately not perfect, but at least something. But often very valuable things are lost because not enough time and resources were alotted to these emergency-excavations. And quite some material is already lost that way. In some cases the builders willfully destroyed archaeological items they found in order to prevent any necesary excavation that would slow down their precious construction-work. Very sad, but you know.... economy will always get the first-class treatment....

Ah, GrayMouser you beat me to posting 'In Flanders Fields'. I never hear 'The Green Fields of France' but I think it's very beautiful and touching.

The Gaffer · 11-12-2003, 11:38 AM

I find it really moving that each year there are less and less WWI soldiers in the Armistice Day service. That war has almost passed out of living memory.

All the more important that we continue to remember.

Sheeana · 11-12-2003, 05:15 PM

I'm not sure on this, but I think NZs last WWI veteran died recently, aged 105...

http://www.azmetro.com/nzanzac.html

We don't celebrate remembrance day, we have ANZAC day on April 25th, and we wear poppies, and remember those who died in that ghastly war.

Insidious Rex · 11-12-2003, 06:16 PM

In memory of Wilfred Owen who died in the trenches of Europe only 7 days before Armistace:

Bent double, like old beggars under sacks,
Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge,
Till on the haunting flares we turned our backs
And towards our distant rest began to trudge.
Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots
But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind;
Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots
Of tired, outstripped gas-shells that dropped behind.

Gas! GAS! Quick, boys! -- An ecstasy of fumbling,
Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time;
But someone still was yelling out and stumbling
And flound'ring like a man in fire or lime . . .
Dim, through the misty panes and thick green light,
As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.

In all my dreams, before my helpless sight,
He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning.

If in some smothering dreams you too could pace
Behind the wagon that we flung him in,
And watch the white eyes writhing in his face,
His hanging face, like a devil's sick of sin;
If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood
Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs,
Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud
Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues, --
My friend, you would not tell with such high zest
To children ardent for some desperate glory,
The old lie: Dulce et decorum est
Pro patria mori.

***Valandil*** · 11-12-2003, 06:22 PM

I-Rex - That's something... really can't add words to it. Just interesting to think that our beloved JRRT lived through those kinds of horrors - and lost most of his friends to them.

Sheeana - sad in a way, yet I would LOVE to reach 105! Maybe even eleventy-one!

Sheeana · 11-12-2003, 06:37 PM

I should clarify: I'm not sad that he reached the ripe old age of 105 (or however old he was), I'm sad that we've lost the last source of information on NZ veterans.

The Gaffer · 11-13-2003, 05:38 AM

* sniff * two things can make me weep just by thinking about them: the holocaust and the trenches. Not sure why; I suppose the imagery and details of the experiences are so embedded in our culture.

Maybe it's to do with the industrialised scale of the slaughter, and the cold despite of those that directed it. I've often wondered if that was where JRRT derived much of his inspiration for Saruman.

I see that they're re-releasing the original version of All Quiet on the Western Front. A must-see. I'll be howling in the front row.

***Valandil*** · 11-13-2003, 10:09 AM

Oh Sheeana - not to worry, I think I understood you... that's why I said it was sad in a way. There's always some regret at losing those "living links" - but it's a by-product of the passage of time in this world. I was only adding that I hoped to be around awhile myself (taking that NZ vet as an example)... got a little bit of a later start having children - yet I'd love to bounce great-grandkids on my knee one day - provided I have reasonable health, sound mind and haven't gotten unbearably cranky.

Radagast · 11-16-2003, 01:04 PM

My favourite British war poem:

If I should die, think only this of me:

That there’s some corner of a foreign field

That is forever England. There shall be

In that rich earth a richer dust concealed;

A dust whom England bore, shaped, made aware,

Gave, once, her flowers to love, her ways to roam,

A body of England’s, breathing English air,

Washed by the rivers, blest by suns of home.

And think, this heart, all evil shed away,

A pulse in the eternal mind no less

Gives somewhere back the thoughts by England given;

Her sights and sounds; dreams happy as her day;

And laughter, learnt of friends; and gentleness,

In hearts at peace, under an English heaven.

Rupert Brooke

gollum9630 · 11-16-2003, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by GrayMouser
[B]In Canada (British Columbia, anyway) Remembrance Day wasn't a holiday, but we did observe the two minutes silence at 11 o'clock.

actually it was a holiday in Canada (and BC for sure). For as long as i can remember there has been nothing open, no schools or work places on Remembrance Day. Everypne gpoes to memorials, and i was once in a soccer tourny for some odd reason and those are always during holidays.

GrayMouser · 11-17-2003, 01:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by gollum9630
actually it was a holiday in Canada (and BC for sure). For as long as i can remember there has been nothing open, no schools or work places on Remembrance Day. Everypne gpoes to memorials, and i was once in a soccer tourny for some odd reason and those are always during holidays.

Must be my memory playing tricks...it's been a loooong time.
I can remember having memorial services at school, and doing the two minute silence- could have been the day before.

11-12-2003, 08:40 AM	#21
GrayMouser Elf Lord Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Ilha Formosa Posts: 2,068	In Canada (British Columbia, anyway) Remembrance Day wasn't a holiday, but we did observe the two minutes silence at 11 o'clock. So thanks to my father, both grandfathers, a whole bunch of uncles and a couple of aunts, and all the other vets out there who fought the good fight. Most famous poem from WWI In Flanders Fields In Flanders fields the poppies blow Between the crosses, row on row That mark our place; and in the sky The larks, still bravely singing, fly Scarce heard amid the guns below. We are the Dead. Short days ago We lived, felt dawn, saw sunset glow, Loved and were loved, and now we lie In Flanders fields. Take up our quarrel with the foe: To you from failing hands we throw The torch; be yours to hold it high. If ye break faith with us who die We shall not sleep, though poppies grow In Flanders fields. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- __________________ Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill

11-12-2003, 08:44 AM	#22
GrayMouser Elf Lord Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Ilha Formosa Posts: 2,068	And, in balance, my favourite anti-war song' The Green Fields of France Well how do you do Private William McBride, Do you mind if I sit here down by your graveside? And rest for awhile beneath the warm summer sun, I've been walking all day and now I'm nearly done I see by your gravestone you were only nineteen When you joined the glorious fallen in 1916; Well I hope you died quick and I hope you died clean, Or, young Willie McBride, was it slow and obscene? Refrain: Did they beat the drum slowly, Did they play the fife lowly? Did they sound the Death March As they lowered you down? Did the band play "The Last Post And Chorus?" Did the pipes play "The Flowers Of The Forest?" Did you leave 'ere a wife or a sweetheart behind? In some faithful heart is your memory enshrined? And although you died back in 1916, In that faithful heart are you forever nineteen? Or are you a stranger without even a name, Enclosed forever behind a glass pane, In an old photograph, torn, and battered and stained, And faded to yellow in a brown leather frame? Refrain: Ah the sun now it shines on these green fields of France, The warm summer breeze makes the red poppies dance, And look how the sun shines from under the clouds; There's no gas, no barbed wire, there're no guns firing now. But here in this graveyard is still No Man's Land, The countless white crosses in mute witness stand To man's blind indifference to his fellow man, To a whole generation that was butchered and damned. Refrain: Ah, young Willie McBride, I can't help wonder why, Did all those who lay here really know why they died? And did they believe when they answered the call, Did they really believe that this war would end war? For the sorrow, the suffering, the glory, the pain, The killing and dying were all done in vain, For, young Willie McBride, it all happened again, And again and again and again and again. Refrain: __________________ Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep. Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them? "I like pigs. Dogs look up to us, cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals."- Winston Churchill

11-12-2003, 06:16 PM	#26
Insidious Rex Quasi Evil Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Maryland, US Posts: 4,634	Dulce et Decorum Est In memory of Wilfred Owen who died in the trenches of Europe only 7 days before Armistace: Bent double, like old beggars under sacks, Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge, Till on the haunting flares we turned our backs And towards our distant rest began to trudge. Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind; Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots Of tired, outstripped gas-shells that dropped behind. Gas! GAS! Quick, boys! -- An ecstasy of fumbling, Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time; But someone still was yelling out and stumbling And flound'ring like a man in fire or lime . . . Dim, through the misty panes and thick green light, As under a green sea, I saw him drowning. In all my dreams, before my helpless sight, He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning. If in some smothering dreams you too could pace Behind the wagon that we flung him in, And watch the white eyes writhing in his face, His hanging face, like a devil's sick of sin; If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs, Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues, -- My friend, you would not tell with such high zest To children ardent for some desperate glory, The old lie: Dulce et decorum est Pro patria mori. __________________ "People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." Last edited by Insidious Rex : 11-12-2003 at 06:18 PM.

11-16-2003, 01:04 PM	#31
Radagast Elven Warrior Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Merry old England Posts: 413	My favourite British war poem: If I should die, think only this of me: That there’s some corner of a foreign field That is forever England. There shall be In that rich earth a richer dust concealed; A dust whom England bore, shaped, made aware, Gave, once, her flowers to love, her ways to roam, A body of England’s, breathing English air, Washed by the rivers, blest by suns of home. And think, this heart, all evil shed away, A pulse in the eternal mind no less Gives somewhere back the thoughts by England given; Her sights and sounds; dreams happy as her day; And laughter, learnt of friends; and gentleness, In hearts at peace, under an English heaven. Rupert Brooke __________________ Take up the White Man's burden-- The savage wars of peace-- Fill full the mouth of Famine, And bid the sickness cease; And when your goal is nearest (The end for others sought) Watch sloth and heathen folly Bring all your hope to nought.

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11-12-2003, 11:38 AM	#24
The Gaffer Elf Lord Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: In me taters Posts: 3,288	I find it really moving that each year there are less and less WWI soldiers in the Armistice Day service. That war has almost passed out of living memory. All the more important that we continue to remember.

11-12-2003, 05:15 PM	#25
Sheeana Lord of the Pants Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,382	I'm not sure on this, but I think NZs last WWI veteran died recently, aged 105... http://www.azmetro.com/nzanzac.html We don't celebrate remembrance day, we have ANZAC day on April 25th, and we wear poppies, and remember those who died in that ghastly war.

11-12-2003, 06:22 PM	#27
*Valandil* High King at Annuminas Administrator Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Wyoming - USA Posts: 10,752	I-Rex - That's something... really can't add words to it. Just interesting to think that our beloved JRRT lived through those kinds of horrors - and lost most of his friends to them. Sheeana - sad in a way, yet I would LOVE to reach 105! Maybe even eleventy-one!

11-12-2003, 06:37 PM	#28
Sheeana Lord of the Pants Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,382	I should clarify: I'm not sad that he reached the ripe old age of 105 (or however old he was), I'm sad that we've lost the last source of information on NZ veterans.

11-13-2003, 05:38 AM	#29
The Gaffer Elf Lord Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: In me taters Posts: 3,288	* sniff * two things can make me weep just by thinking about them: the holocaust and the trenches. Not sure why; I suppose the imagery and details of the experiences are so embedded in our culture. Maybe it's to do with the industrialised scale of the slaughter, and the cold despite of those that directed it. I've often wondered if that was where JRRT derived much of his inspiration for Saruman. I see that they're re-releasing the original version of All Quiet on the Western Front. A must-see. I'll be howling in the front row.

11-13-2003, 10:09 AM	#30
*Valandil* High King at Annuminas Administrator Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Wyoming - USA Posts: 10,752	Oh Sheeana - not to worry, I think I understood you... that's why I said it was sad in a way. There's always some regret at losing those "living links" - but it's a by-product of the passage of time in this world. I was only adding that I hoped to be around awhile myself (taking that NZ vet as an example)... got a little bit of a later start having children - yet I'd love to bounce great-grandkids on my knee one day - provided I have reasonable health, sound mind and haven't gotten unbearably cranky.