Polygamy

[Insidious Rex]

Originally posted by RÃ*an
Is that "ok" an agreement that I have clearly grasped your argument?

or is it an "ok" about my "I'll discuss the rest of the post when you are satisfied that I clearly understand what you are saying."

um... yes?

[Insidious Rex]

Originally posted by Daisy Baggins
It is you opinion that it is discriminatory, but I totally disagree with you. I think that gay marriage would be a disaster for this society.

ah and here we get to the heart of the matter. you feel that gays lead to disaster. therefor they should NOT be given certain freedoms that non gays have. THIS, my dear ms. daisy, is BY DEFINITION discriminatory. You cannot say another person isnt allowed to have a freedom you have simply because they are different from you.

[GrayMouser]

Originally posted by jerseydevil
I would like to get married - but I think I'm too difficult to get along with. j/k

Hey, Condi Rice is still available... a true meeting of minds

[GrayMouser]

Some Muslim women have been making the argument against polygamy by saying that Mohammed stressed that a man must treat all his wives exactly equally, including sexually; since this is impossible (for anyone except the Prophet himself, of course- don't want to get blasphemous), monogamy is the way to go.

Even in cultures where polygamy is permitted most people are monogamous; polygyny is generally reserved for the wealthy and powerful.

Compare with the "trophy wife" in our society.

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Originally posted by RÃ*an
You're cute, though! And I think you're a softy underneath (but I won't tell anyone)

You just did.

[Valandil]

Originally posted by GrayMouser
Compare with the "trophy wife" in our society.

*psst! careful there... i think most of the married ladies on entmoot are 'trophy wives'!*

[Ruinel]

Can you imagine how the legalization of polygamy would change the divorce laws in the US? In Texas, 1/2 of everything you own when you are married is owned by you and the other half is owned by your spouse. This is for things you aquire while married. I don't know what the laws are for stuff you owned before you got married, though.

[Valandil]

Originally posted by Ruinel
Can you imagine how the legalization of polygamy would change the divorce laws in the US? In Texas, 1/2 of everything you own when you are married is owned by you and the other half is owned by your spouse. This is for things you aquire while married. I don't know what the laws are for stuff you owned before you got married, though.

My guess is the lawyers would LOVE it... and end up with a lot more of the spoils of war themselves!!

[GrayMouser]

Well they're cracking down in Malaysia anyway

The Malaysian cabinet has promised to change the country's laws to discourage men from divorcing their wives by means of electronic messages.

The PM's religious adviser had endorsed text message divorce
An Islamic court in the country declared last week that a Muslim man had legally ended his marriage by sending his wife a mobile telephone text message.

.

[Rían]

Originally posted by Valandil
My guess is the lawyers would LOVE it... and end up with a lot more of the spoils of war themselves!!

Sad but true ...

and the text messaging thing is disgusting Does it go both ways? Can the wife divorce her husband that way?

[Gwaimir Windgem]

In the Muslim countries, I doubt it...it's more likely in Malaysia, though, I should think.

[Rían]

Originally posted by Gwaimir Windgem
You just did.

Oh silly me!

[GrayMouser]

Originally posted by Gwaimir Windgem
In the Muslim countries, I doubt it...it's more likely in Malaysia, though, I should think.

Well, even though 40% of the population is non-Muslim (mostly Chinese and Indians) Malysia is officially a Muslim country.

Muslims are married under Muslim law; everybody else goes by civl law patterned after the British system

Under Shariah Law a husband can divorce his wife by saying "I divorce you" three times, though it should be done over an extended period to avoid actions done in momentary anger.

Women can initiate divorce too, but it's a lot harder.

Actually, women had more legal rights under Islamic Law than in most European countries until the 19th Century

[GrayMouser]

If you ever get a chance to see it, a great movie about polygamy is Zhang Yimou's "Raise the Red Lantern", starring Gong Li (sigh).

It's about all the scheming that goes on as each wife tries to improve her own position by gaining favor with her husband- the title comes from the practise of putting a red lantern in front of the room of whichever wife the husband has decided to spend the night with.

In Chinese with English subtitles, but an excellent film.

As for me, any man who marries four wives deserves it
(Just had a spat with my own wife)

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Personally, I prefer my oriental movies in the original language with subtitles. IMO, it helps to preserve the spirit.

[azalea]

Originally posted by GrayMouser


As for me, any man who marries four wives deserves it
(Just had a spat with my own wife)

I love this!

I skimmed the thread, and decided to add a couple of things:
responding to the original thread poster --
the benefits for the man are obvious, but there are reasons I think women enter willingly into this (that is, women who are over the age of 18 who do so by their own choice). I'm speaking more about polygamy in this country (illegal, as in the case of that guy that was being prosecuted out west), rather than in other cultures that have different customs (as in the Asian film mentioned).
The main reason the first wife might have is that she gets to "keep" her husband, by letting him have another woman/ women under their roof like that. Secondly, since becoming an "at-home" mom, I can see where it would be nice to have a couple of extra pairs of hands to help with the kids, housework, errands, etc. (But rather than "sister wives," I'd like my extra pair of hands to be those of a housekeeper! )
I think it's a way for a man who has religious beliefs to fool himself into thinking he's doing the moral thing by "marrying his mistresses" or something. I wonder what they do with the line in the marriage vows that says "...and forsaking all others?"

I saw a PBS special on polygamy a few years ago, and they did have one example of polyandry. There was a (pitiful, IMO) young woman (teens, I guess) that was married to several brothers. The reason was because it in a desolate region (somewhere like the Afghan countryside) where there was a shortage of women of childbearing age. So the brothers shared her, so they could all have children. But they said polyandry is extremely rare. They also gave the example that there were high ranking women in ancient times that had more than one husband (maybe Egypt?).

Also, that one case I mentioned where the polygamist out west is being prosecuted: he kept having all these kids with his four wives, but they had to be on public assistance because he couldn't afford to support them all, and the wives couldn't work because of the religious beliefs. So that is one of the main reasons the authorities didn't just look the other way, as I guess they do in most cases of polygamy: the taxpayers were paying for this guy and his wives to live like that.

The odd thing is that if the guy was just LIVING with all of them, it wouldn't be against the law. And I thought that LEGALLY the other marriages would be null and void, since the law only recognizes the first marriage. So TECHNICALLY how is it a prosecutable offense? (Not that I'm upset he was prosecuted, the jerk -- purposely bringing children --I'm talking like twenty-something -- into the world that he can't support financially, then having the gall to rely on public assistance! Very irresponsible! At least have a couple of the "wives" get a job! )
I'd be interested to know what his kids -- the ones who by this time are grown -- think of the situation, and if they will follow by being polygamous themselves.

[Ruinel]

Originally posted by GrayMouser
If you ever get a chance to see it, a great movie about polygamy is Zhang Yimou's "Raise the Red Lantern", starring Gong Li (sigh).

It's about all the scheming that goes on as each wife tries to improve her own position by gaining favor with her husband- the title comes from the practise of putting a red lantern in front of the room of whichever wife the husband has decided to spend the night with.

In Chinese with English subtitles, but an excellent film.

As for me, any man who marries four wives deserves it
(Just had a spat with my own wife)

I saw it. One of the wives does not love her husband but falls in love with someone else, has an affair, one of the wives tells on her and the husband has her tied up by the male servants and thrown off the roof of one of the buildings in secret. And one of the wives goes crazy, if I remember correctly.

[zinnite]

Originally posted by azalea
Also, that one case I mentioned where the polygamist out west is being prosecuted: he kept having all these kids with his four wives, but they had to be on public assistance because he couldn't afford to support them all, and the wives couldn't work because of the religious beliefs. So that is one of the main reasons the authorities didn't just look the other way, as I guess they do in most cases of polygamy: the taxpayers were paying for this guy and his wives to live like that.

The odd thing is that if the guy was just LIVING with all of them, it wouldn't be against the law. And I thought that LEGALLY the other marriages would be null and void, since the law only recognizes the first marriage. So TECHNICALLY how is it a prosecutable offense?

If I'm thinking of the same case (I believe I saw it on "City Confidential" on A&E), the guy was committing fraud; it was a lot of complicated tax stuff, and he had the women claim different men as fathers. I wish I could remember more, but I saw it a few years ago. It was a really shady situation, and basically he was using the women and the kids as a source of income by keeping the state and federal assistance monies.

[Insidious Rex]

Originally posted by Ruinel
I saw it. One of the wives does not love her husband but falls in love with someone else, has an affair, one of the wives tells on her and the husband has her tied up by the male servants and thrown off the roof of one of the buildings in secret. And one of the wives goes crazy, if I remember correctly.

oh gee thanks Ruinel. Guess I wont need to see that movie now.

[Ruinel]

Originally posted by Insidious Rex
oh gee thanks Ruinel. Guess I wont need to see that movie now.

no no... see it, really! What I said is only a small bit of the movie, not nearly all. It's quite complicated, and much more of the story lies untold here.