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#41 | |
Elf Lord of the Grey Havens
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: somewhere else
Posts: 2,381
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Quote:
Who is Tom. B? I'm still looking. Any ideas? Why was gandalf so eager to see Tom after the RotK? What business was more urgent that the "shadow in the shire"?
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There exists a limit to the force even ther most powerful may apply without destroying themselves. Judging this limit is the true artistry of government. Misuse of power is the fatal sin. The law cannot be a tool of vengance, never a hostage, nor a fortification against the martyrs it has created. You cannot threaten any individual and escape the consequences. -Muad'dib on Law The Stilgar Commentary |
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#42 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: lurking on the edge of conversations
Posts: 924
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#43 | |
Númenorean
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 1,050
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Quote:
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Why can we not be sober.. |
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#44 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 1,286
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"For the less even as for the greater there is some deed that he may accomplish but once only; and in that deed his heart shall rest." - Fëanor |
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#45 | |
the Shrike
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: San Francisco, CA <3
Posts: 10,647
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"Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords |
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#46 | |
Númenorean
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 1,050
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Why can we not be sober.. |
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#47 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 1,286
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Cirdan, I doubt you'll find anything definite, but the Maiar theory is the generally accepted one.. though it has its flaws.
EDIT: See the Encyclopedia of Arda if you need more information... http://www.glyphweb.com/arda (hope that's not advertising)
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"For the less even as for the greater there is some deed that he may accomplish but once only; and in that deed his heart shall rest." - Fëanor |
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#48 | |
Elf Lord of the Grey Havens
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: somewhere else
Posts: 2,381
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Quote:
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__________________
There exists a limit to the force even ther most powerful may apply without destroying themselves. Judging this limit is the true artistry of government. Misuse of power is the fatal sin. The law cannot be a tool of vengance, never a hostage, nor a fortification against the martyrs it has created. You cannot threaten any individual and escape the consequences. -Muad'dib on Law The Stilgar Commentary |
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#49 | |
Elf Lord of the Grey Havens
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: somewhere else
Posts: 2,381
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Quote:
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__________________
There exists a limit to the force even ther most powerful may apply without destroying themselves. Judging this limit is the true artistry of government. Misuse of power is the fatal sin. The law cannot be a tool of vengance, never a hostage, nor a fortification against the martyrs it has created. You cannot threaten any individual and escape the consequences. -Muad'dib on Law The Stilgar Commentary |
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#50 | |
The Insufferable
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,333
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Quote:
![]() At the fords, frodo is slipping into the wraith world, and can see the nazgful clearly-but he also sees glorfindel 'a figure clothed in light'. So It's safe to assume that the unseen realm, in itself, is not evil. The spirit-fea-of men and elves in normally anchored or 'housed' in the body-hroa, matter. Upon death it is unhoused, and free to move on it's own. However, it no longer can interact with the physical world. Also, upon death an elven spirit is summoned to mandos, and to refuse that summons is an evil thing. Human spirits are summoned somewhere, but to refuse is likewise evil (although I'm not sure if most m,en had the power to resist). So it's safe to assume that any bodiless spirit is tainted-either deranged and having refused the summons, or under the thrall of some evil power. In that sense, the wraith world can be considered a rather evil place. However, the more spiritually powerful beings in arda (gandalf, glorfindel, etc) also have a strong presence in the unseen realm, and thus can act in it.
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Disgraced he may be, yet is not dethroned, and keeps the rags of lordship once he owned |
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#51 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: lurking on the edge of conversations
Posts: 924
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Ok, sounds good to me.
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#52 |
Númenorean
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 1,050
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lol, yea..good job wayfarer:P
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Why can we not be sober.. |
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#53 |
The Insufferable
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,333
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Bows not-quite humbly.
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Disgraced he may be, yet is not dethroned, and keeps the rags of lordship once he owned |
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#54 |
Long lost mooter
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Florida
Posts: 3,342
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Gandalf was very much attached to his body; I think Maia that took bodily form were. He got pleasure from smoking, he used his body language to convey his mood, he certainly didn't have the power to travel any differently than other worldly beings (Shadowfax notwithstanding). When he came back I think he was "refreshed" in the sense that he had been loosed from the physical body he had so long used, and when he came back he was as a result more connected to the other world ("Oh, yes, Gandalf, that's what I was called," etc.). That's what I meant by otherworldly, meaning more connected to that other place. he seems somewhat different. So it was just a thought, that losing the body then returning allows one to remain visible when wearing the ring...*ramble, ramble*....
As far as Tom, read this essay (I assume it's not advertising since I am using it to illustrate a point?): http://www.cas.unt.edu/~hargrove/bombadil.html This is the only essay I've read concerning his identity, but I think the guy makes a good case for his theory. The only thing that throws a wrench in it for me is calling Goldberry the Riverwoman's Daughter and saying he found her sitting by the river and all that. That doesn't quite mesh with it. |
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#55 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Searching desperately for a swan boat to take to Valinor
Posts: 1,231
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Nice link
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I take full responsibility for my actions, except for those that are somebody else's fault Having someone to blame is nearly as good as having a solution to the problem Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you are a mile away from them, and you habe their shoes. ![]() |
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#56 |
Elf Lord of the Grey Havens
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: somewhere else
Posts: 2,381
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The link was good. His research was better than the theory, though. Tolkien would have explained Tom B. on The Sil. if he had intended him to be understood. IMO it was a bit of capricious bit of sentimentality on JRRT's part to include a character based on his child's toy. I think he loved how the character represented what he wanted to say at that point in the story, and that he didn't want to recreate him. He may have thought it pretentious to include to in the grand scheme of the Silmarillion since he existed in a previous story.
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There exists a limit to the force even ther most powerful may apply without destroying themselves. Judging this limit is the true artistry of government. Misuse of power is the fatal sin. The law cannot be a tool of vengance, never a hostage, nor a fortification against the martyrs it has created. You cannot threaten any individual and escape the consequences. -Muad'dib on Law The Stilgar Commentary |
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#57 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 119
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No, the ring did not make souron invisible.
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