12-05-2006, 07:12 PM | #1 | |
Entmoot's Drunken Uncle
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EDIT: This thread is continued from this thread: homosexual marriage
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There have been homosexuals for centuries, and most people turned a blind eye because the rich homosexuals were just "eccentric" and not hurting anyone. Now that homosexuals want to have rights the same as heterosexuals the world despises them. Is changing the definition of marriage so very harmful? Last edited by Earniel : 12-06-2006 at 04:48 PM. |
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12-05-2006, 07:50 PM | #2 | ||||||||||||||
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I don't think that Religion and Science are opposed either, and perhaps some forms of evolutionary creation...that's not the problem. The problem is that evolution, no matter what scientist says "you can still believe in God!" (as if we needed THEIR permission), it is a theory that says it can account for the universe without a god. And it has taught it THIS particular way. And it's not that us brainwashed christians think "if only" evolutiuon hadn't come along, all would be well. We believe something MORE about the way we came into being, not less, than evolutionists. Nor do we think it was "God-magicked" the way Merlin makes the brooms and mops dance. As for Extremist Creationist types, there aren't too many of them, most believing people have gotten behind the Intelligent Design theory (which is NOT a form of Extreme Creationism, btw)...which does NOT, as the "Extreme Evolutionist Community" would have you believe, throw rocks at evoltuion as a whole, or at science at all. They believe in a god/higher power in general, and they happen to think he created the world on purpose...and they also know just as much about biology and stuff as evolutionists. Where's the big deal? Quote:
From now on, I'll be better and make sure I don't chase all of you on the other side into the same door... Quote:
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In other words, you could prove science's auto stats "wrong" about might makes right, such as in the case of Hannibals lesser numbers beating out Rome. "The problem with the world is not that is is unreasonable, nor that it is reasonable. The problem is that is almost alwasy reasonable, but not quite... ...We have just enough confidence to pursue adventure, and just enough doubt about ourselves to make it adventurous."~Chesterton (Loosely quoted) Quote:
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The answer to that closing question Rex, is that while physical pain is Unpleasant, it is not necessarily bad. Maybe the shot was not a bad thing for the two year old thought she might have felt it was murder, but at least she won't sit in a frying pan and not notice! And you know, I'm kinda grateful to God that he didn't make one of the Ten Commandments "Get the shot, you need it." How on earth are we supposed to interpret THAT in days when we didn't even have vaccines? Quote:
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12-05-2006, 07:52 PM | #3 |
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
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There have been homosexuals for millenia; I imagine as long as or nearly as long as the human race has existed. People turned a blind eye because they were able to, but that is not the case anymore. They were much more homophobic in the old days; how likely is an agnostic these days to hate "buggers" as virulently as Queensberry did?
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12-05-2006, 07:53 PM | #4 | |
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12-05-2006, 08:01 PM | #5 | |
Entmoot's Drunken Uncle
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Things have already changed though. Humans wear a lot less than what used to be "acceptable" for one thing. Other things such as BDSM are almost mainstreem these days. For anything to progress things have to change and I think a lot of people are scared of that. That is why we have so many traditions and past to cling onto because in America we have no real culture. We stole culture from our ancestors, and instead of taking the risk of change that our ancestors did, we cling to the only things that made them different. This is not a religious problem, for there are many religious people who support gay marriage, this is a problem encompasing the whole of humanity! |
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12-05-2006, 09:58 PM | #6 | |||
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And anyway, modesty is an issue among some, even these days. Quote:
We have plenty of culture in America. Take one look at another country (say Canada for instance), and you will quickly see that America is distinct. And as for stealing its culture: what nation does not have ties to its origin, may I ask? It's part of who we are as humans to remember where we came from, good, bad, or indifferent. So your argument for 'progress' is that it has to be 'different' from our ancestors? Quote:
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It's New Years Day, just like the day before; Same old skies of grey, same empty bottles on the floor. Another year's gone by, and I was thinking once again, How can I take this losing hand and somehow win? Just give me One Good Year To get my feet back on the ground. I've been chasing grace; Grace ain't so easily found One bad hand can devil a man, chase him and carry him down. I've got to get out of here, just give me One Good Year! Last edited by Rosie Gamgee : 12-05-2006 at 09:59 PM. |
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12-05-2006, 10:00 PM | #7 | |||||
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Change is a very ambiguous thing, but if you have enough of it, you can buy a candy bar....ok, bad joke. Quote:
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12-05-2006, 10:17 PM | #8 | |
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12-05-2006, 10:24 PM | #9 |
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
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No, I'm sorry, but katt is right. America has no real culture of its own. The only thing we really have is Thanksgiving.
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12-05-2006, 10:27 PM | #10 | |||
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Thousands of years of human history does not prove it, certainly not as a whole. The pagan romans threw christians to the lions, and then then romans (generally) became christians, but they did not throw pagans to the lions. Quote:
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12-05-2006, 10:37 PM | #11 | |
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12-05-2006, 11:01 PM | #12 | |||
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Seriously answering that though, I would admit that some steps were tacken backwards, but there were many steps FORWARD. Quote:
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12-06-2006, 12:36 AM | #13 | |||
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I believe that we have progressed beyond the people we were born from. Quote:
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(Oh, and we also have the Fourth of July, a great holiday celebrated by getting drunk and blowing stuff up. ) Do you notice that most Americans celebrate holidays by overeating more than usual? And drinking more than usual as well... |
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12-06-2006, 02:23 PM | #14 |
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Because of course that IS our distinct culture: over consumption!
Have you finished your christmas shopping? Pass the pumpkin pie...
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12-06-2006, 02:31 PM | #15 |
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Do you guys read "Geography of Nowhere" like the Bible or what!
If you have read it: I agree with [Howard] Kunstler's view about our architecture being crap etc...but it just seems to me that he HAS to compare the best of Europe to the worst of the U.S. Not an objective comparison at all. I don't disagree that we center things around big business, I disagree that we have [good] culture. I think we do have it, but I think we trample over it a lot. I'll have a bit of that Pumpkin Pie myself, please NOTE TO MODS: Since we've gotten off-subject AND passed the "finish line" of 1000 posts, perhaps you could break off this discussion about culture, and make a new thread for it
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12-06-2006, 03:55 PM | #16 | ||||||||||||||
Quasi Evil
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The bottom line is rape is “ok” at any time if its worth while undertaking (evolutionarily). It will appear horrible TO US because of our perspective on it and because of the culture weve both been raised in but that doesn’t take away from its usefulness. But again remember that its probably a rare thing to develop as a “norm” in any given population because of its very nature. It happens. But not the majority of the time. Quote:
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"People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." |
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12-06-2006, 04:46 PM | #17 | |||||||||||||||
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The "more" is that believers can account for existence itself, not just the universe. Quote:
They realized they were coming off more and more as buffoons by touting creationism seriously and they were losing court case after court case so they changed their tactics and decided a more stealth approach would be better.[/quote] Nevermind that this form of creationism was around before Darwin (or the other chaps before Darwin who got there first).... IMO, it's the evolutionists who feel really threatened. Their grasp on people's minds might actually be coming to a close, and they're not sure if they can live with it! Quote:
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12-07-2006, 12:41 AM | #18 | |
Advocatus Diaboli
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Telling someone they are giving a "blueprint" answer means that you don't really want to talk about the details of that answer and would rather brush it off. I don't give blueprint answers. I think deeply about what I post, usually. As far as sources on my comment about rape being mostly accepted, and society, not religion, changing this morality (eventhough it has a long way to go), this book is a good resource to start with: Misogyny: The World's Oldest Prejudice
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
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12-07-2006, 04:50 AM | #19 |
Entmoot's Drunken Uncle
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Well, thanks for having me in on this discussion, but I'm not cut out for this sort of debating.
I support anyone who wants to get married, even to their dog. Well, not to their dog because that's just trying to con the government. Marrage should be for everyone. Thank you. Good night and good luck. |
12-07-2006, 02:56 PM | #20 | |||||||||||
Quasi Evil
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"People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." |
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