Nasty Spiders

[webwizard333]

With every generation descended from Ungoliante, the spiders seem to have shrunk in size. So, does that mean they eventually became normal sized spiders?

[Ñólendil]

Nah, I bet they eventually just died out. For there were normal sized spiders while the Great ones were around. I bet Morgoth used normal spiders as a basis to make the Great ones.

[webwizard333]

I hope they were all squished by one of the mysertious giants.

[UnStashable]

I thought the the giant Spiders wern't created my Melkor but decendents of Ungoliant and other "fell" and probably evil creatures, but not bound to Melkor in aside from the fact that he may have had corrupted thier sires long ago

[Finmandos12]

I think that's right. It says there were other spirits in the shape of spiders that Ungoliant mated with.

[Varda]

Was Ungoliant a "real" spider or didn't she just take spider shape? Her kind weren't at all related to the spiders in Mirkwood, were they? Since they were actual spiders?

[olorin]

If I remember right, Ungoliant was a powerful Maia who took spider shape, destroyed the 2 trees, then mated with other 'fell things', as was said. Also, Shelob was a descendent of Ungoliant too, if I'm not mistaken. But weren't the large Mirkwood spiders just something that developed, so to speak there? After all, even the squirrels were black.

[Galadriel2002]

i thought shelob and ungolainte where the same?!?!

[Ñólendil]

but not bound to Melkor in aside from the fact that he may have had corrupted thier sires long ago

Yeah, I don't see how I said anything against that.

There were two batches of Spiders we know about unrelated to Ungoliant: the ones Ungoliant found, devoured and breeded with in Nan Dungortheb, and the ones Shelob found, devoured and breeded with in the Shadowy Mountains. I don't believe these were spirits incarnated like Ungoliant, just beasts 'made' by Morgoth (but the Shadowy Mt. ones may have been Sauron's). The Mirkwoodian Spiders were definitely of Shelob's brood.

Galadriel2002, nope. Shelob was one of Ungoliant's numerous children. Sam would have had no chance whatsoever against Ungoliant. The Light in the Phial would have done nothing to her, she would have attempted to devour it with Sam. After all, she sucked that same unsullied Light from the Trees long ago and tried to devour the Silmarilli, one of which bore that particular portion of light passed on in part to the Phial.

[Finmandos12]

Originally posted by Inoldonil
The Mirkwoodian Spiders were definitely of Shelob's brood.

For once the Bestiary was right! I read that there and figured it was just another of Day's assumptions.

[ArwenEvenstar]

if they did die out when would that have happened? since they were evil did they mysteriously die when the Ring was destroyed?

[Ñólendil]

I haven't a clue. It seems wholly illogical for any Race of insects (or whatever they are) to just 'die out', giant or not. Perhaps with the increase of Men in the world, eventually they had little room for themselves. Most of Shelob's brood perhaps were hunted down and destroyed by the Gondorians, and the Mirkwoodians driven out of their long home altogether. Over a period of many years, perhaps they were found out and destroyed.

Or if you like. the disturbing theory that some are still around might be used. In such a case, however, the idea must be like the original one posted here: they have greatly decreased in size. Perhaps still uncommonly large, yet much less intelligent than their old wicked selves.

[UnStashable]

I think one (of the nastier ones too) escaped to New York and became senator.