Where have all the Dragons gone?

fatclown · 09-20-2001, 11:11 PM

ok, I know after the downfall of anacagalon and morgoth at the war of wrath the dragons fled to the grey mountains. I also know that only 2 were mentioned after that, Scatah the worm, and Smaug in the third age. But why aren't they a more predominant force in LOTR? I get the impression that they were quite numerous up there. Had they been fighting unwritten battles with the dwarves of the iron mountains? Why didn't Sauron call the dragons to his aid if he had almost the same power as Melkor. If they were seperated from Saurons power did they remain after his power was destroyed in the fourth age? Give me your imput

ringbearer · 09-20-2001, 11:18 PM

Welcome to Entmoot, fatclown! This is an interesting topic, but I have no theories. Perhaps they were all destroyed by this time.

Captain Stern · 09-21-2001, 09:14 AM

"Before the rising of the sun Earendil slew Ancalgon the Black, the mightiest of the dragon-host, and cast him from the sky;and he fell upon the towers of Thangorodrim, and they were broken in his ruin. Then the sun rose and the host of the Valar prevailed and well nigh all the dragons were destroyed."

Kyote Fields · 09-21-2001, 11:47 AM

You quotin' som'thin'?

Captain Stern · 09-21-2001, 01:13 PM

Yes, sorry I didn't make it clear.

It's at the end of the chapter called "Of the Voyage of Earendil and the War of Wrath" in "The Silmarillion".

fatclown · 09-21-2001, 04:13 PM

all the dragons in anacagalon's horde were destroyed! Did you know that Anacagalon didn't breathe fire! No he was so large he could basically tear almost anything/anyone apart. Glaurung was the greatest fire-breather.

Agburanar · 10-10-2001, 09:23 AM

Smaug wasn't the only Dragon left at the time of the Hobbit, Scorba, Bairnach, Scatha and Earlaxe were still around Withered Heath (although Earaxe spent a lot of time in the southern seas near Khand) and of course Agburanar is talking to you now!

Ñólendil · 10-10-2001, 05:15 PM

Pardon?

Agburanar · 10-11-2001, 04:44 PM

Of course these are all from Tolkien's notes (see Middle Earth CCG- The Dragons)

Comic Book Guy · 10-11-2001, 04:54 PM

Middle Earth CCG is not canon, I would only guess they made them up to make up the numbers for their cards. CCG also made up the names of the Nazgul.

Ñólendil · 10-11-2001, 05:00 PM

CCG? Is that something from ICE? If so than certainly the names of those Dragons was them expanding upon published material. As far as I know there are only four Dragons in Tolkien's 'Eän' writings that are named: Glaurung, Ancalagon, Scatha and Smaug.

afro-elf · 10-11-2001, 05:05 PM

1) who were the dragon slayers in Tolkien?

2) who at the time of the LOTR do you think could fight a dragon?

Magi= Gandalf/ Galadriel ?

Elven Warriors ( primary skill) Gildor, Glorfindel, Elrond, Cirdan?

Men Aragorn with Andruil/ Eomer, Imrahil, Faramir, Eowyn?

Any Dwarves of Note? What about Dain?

Ñólendil · 10-11-2001, 06:33 PM

Anyone could, though I think most would die miserably

.

I know that Túrin slew Glaurung, and Eärendil slew Ancalagon, and Fram slew Scatha, and Bard II slew Smaug. All mortals, save Earendil, who was Half-elven in blood and Elven in Fate. But in a late note (published in Vol. XII of HoMe in Of Dwarves and Men), the slayer of Ancalagon is oddly named as Túrin returned from the Dead for the Last Battle (of the Wars of Beleriand).

UnStashable · 10-11-2001, 10:24 PM

The dwarves bested Glaurung and a host of acompying dragons at the 5th battle. As far as i know that makes them the only ones east of the great sea to do harm or beatback dragons in any large scale battles.

Agburanar · 10-12-2001, 01:12 PM

How many dwarves does it take to change a lightbulb? seven on each others shoulders or one standing on a large, dead dragon with the other fifty resposible for killing the beast wondering how much longer it's gonna take!

09-20-2001, 11:11 PM	#1
fatclown Hobbit Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 30	Where have all the Dragons gone? ok, I know after the downfall of anacagalon and morgoth at the war of wrath the dragons fled to the grey mountains. I also know that only 2 were mentioned after that, Scatah the worm, and Smaug in the third age. But why aren't they a more predominant force in LOTR? I get the impression that they were quite numerous up there. Had they been fighting unwritten battles with the dwarves of the iron mountains? Why didn't Sauron call the dragons to his aid if he had almost the same power as Melkor. If they were seperated from Saurons power did they remain after his power was destroyed in the fourth age? Give me your imput

09-20-2001, 11:18 PM	#2
ringbearer Elf Lord Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: St. Louis, Mo. USA Posts: 561	Welcome to Entmoot, fatclown! This is an interesting topic, but I have no theories. Perhaps they were all destroyed by this time. __________________ Ringbearer Hide Witch, hide! The Good Folks come to burn thee! Their keen enjoyment hid behind A Gothic mask of duty!

09-21-2001, 09:14 AM	#3
Captain Stern Elven Warrior Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 319	RE "Before the rising of the sun Earendil slew Ancalgon the Black, the mightiest of the dragon-host, and cast him from the sky;and he fell upon the towers of Thangorodrim, and they were broken in his ruin. Then the sun rose and the host of the Valar prevailed and well nigh all the dragons were destroyed."

09-21-2001, 11:47 AM	#4
Kyote Fields Elven Warrior Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: California Posts: 218	You quotin' som'thin'? __________________ No longer posting. If you'd like to write to me I can be reached at kyote_fields@hotmail.com. It was nice knowing all of you.

09-21-2001, 01:13 PM	#5
Captain Stern Elven Warrior Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 319	RE Yes, sorry I didn't make it clear. It's at the end of the chapter called "Of the Voyage of Earendil and the War of Wrath" in "The Silmarillion".

09-21-2001, 04:13 PM	#6
fatclown Hobbit Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 30	all the dragons in anacagalon's horde were destroyed! Did you know that Anacagalon didn't breathe fire! No he was so large he could basically tear almost anything/anyone apart. Glaurung was the greatest fire-breather.

10-10-2001, 09:23 AM	#7
Agburanar Elf Lord Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Dorset Posts: 608	Smaug wasn't the only Dragon left at the time of the Hobbit, Scorba, Bairnach, Scatha and Earlaxe were still around Withered Heath (although Earaxe spent a lot of time in the southern seas near Khand) and of course Agburanar is talking to you now!

10-10-2001, 05:15 PM	#8
Ñólendil Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: California Posts: 60,865	Pardon? __________________ Falmon -- Dylan

10-11-2001, 04:44 PM	#9
Agburanar Elf Lord Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Dorset Posts: 608	Of course these are all from Tolkien's notes (see Middle Earth CCG- The Dragons)

10-11-2001, 04:54 PM	#10
Comic Book Guy Best Ex-Administrator ever Join Date: May 2001 Location: Ireland Posts: 60,547	Middle Earth CCG is not canon, I would only guess they made them up to make up the numbers for their cards. CCG also made up the names of the Nazgul.

10-11-2001, 05:00 PM	#11
Ñólendil Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: California Posts: 60,865	CCG? Is that something from ICE? If so than certainly the names of those Dragons was them expanding upon published material. As far as I know there are only four Dragons in Tolkien's 'Eän' writings that are named: Glaurung, Ancalagon, Scatha and Smaug. __________________ Falmon -- Dylan

10-11-2001, 05:05 PM	#12
afro-elf Hoplite Nomad Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 3,931	1) who were the dragon slayers in Tolkien? 2) who at the time of the LOTR do you think could fight a dragon? Magi= Gandalf/ Galadriel ? Elven Warriors ( primary skill) Gildor, Glorfindel, Elrond, Cirdan? Men Aragorn with Andruil/ Eomer, Imrahil, Faramir, Eowyn? Any Dwarves of Note? What about Dain? __________________ About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer.

10-11-2001, 06:33 PM	#13
Ñólendil Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: California Posts: 60,865	Anyone could, though I think most would die miserably . I know that Túrin slew Glaurung, and Eärendil slew Ancalagon, and Fram slew Scatha, and Bard II slew Smaug. All mortals, save Earendil, who was Half-elven in blood and Elven in Fate. But in a late note (published in Vol. XII of HoMe in Of Dwarves and Men), the slayer of Ancalagon is oddly named as Túrin returned from the Dead for the Last Battle (of the Wars of Beleriand). __________________ Falmon -- Dylan

10-11-2001, 10:24 PM	#14
UnStashable Enting Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 52	The dwarves bested Glaurung and a host of acompying dragons at the 5th battle. As far as i know that makes them the only ones east of the great sea to do harm or beatback dragons in any large scale battles. __________________ This elevator only goes to the basement, and sombody made an awful mess down there

10-12-2001, 01:12 PM	#15
Agburanar Elf Lord Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Dorset Posts: 608	How many dwarves does it take to change a lightbulb? seven on each others shoulders or one standing on a large, dead dragon with the other fifty resposible for killing the beast wondering how much longer it's gonna take!

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