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01-10-2003, 11:03 AM | #1 |
Hobbit
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 22
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Elf children?
This is something I've never been able to understand. When elves are born, they're small, how long does it take for them to grow up? Thousand years or so I would guess. You never hear of them, somhow I just can't imagine little elves running around in Rivendell. Anyone who knows anything about this?
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01-10-2003, 11:19 AM | #2 |
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA
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Yeah, and what about Dwarves and Orcs? I asked this a while ago, and never got an answer.
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01-10-2003, 11:33 AM | #3 |
The Quite Querulous Quendi
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Oxon, UK
Posts: 638
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Yeah and while we're at it, why aren't there millions of the suckers running around? Or did they have their minds on higher pursuits than procreation for all those millenia?
(There's some stuff about Dwarves' breeding habits in the Appendices, I think. Basically there weren't many females and even then they had beards). |
01-10-2003, 12:02 PM | #4 |
Greatest Elven woman of Aman
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Location: Having way too much fun with Fëanor's 7
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In HoME 10, Morgoth's ring, it says that it takes between 50 and 100 years for an Elf to be full-grown. It is also stated that in the begetting and bearing of a child the mother and father put forth a lot of their strength into the child, and therefore the Elves have few children.
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01-10-2003, 12:03 PM | #5 | ||
Queen of Nargothrond
Administrator Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Akron, Ohio - USA
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Re: Elf children?
Quote:
Quote:
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"Whither go you?" she said. "North away." he said: "to the swords, and the siege, and the walls of defence - that yet for a while in Beleriand rivers may run clean, leaves spring, and birds build their nests, ere Night comes." AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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01-10-2003, 12:07 PM | #6 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Geilenkirchen, Germany
Posts: 192
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In the same source it ist stated that Elves do not beget children in time of war or when thier is any chance that the parents will be seperated during the first years of the child. Considering the situation in Middle-Earth it is possible that not verry much children were born after lets say 1300 ZZ.
Respectfully Findegil |
01-10-2003, 04:27 PM | #7 |
Enting
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 73
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LOTR
Yeah about a thousand years.
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Where now the horse and the rider? Where is the horn that was blowing? Where is the helm and the hauberk, and the bright hair flowing? Where is the hand on the harpsting, and the red fire glowing? Where is the spring and the harvest and the tall corn growing? They have past like rain on the mountain, like a wind in the meadow; The days have gone down in the West behind the hills into shadow. Who shall gather the smoke of the dead wood burning, or behold the flowing years from the Sea returning? Frodo lives |
01-10-2003, 04:37 PM | #8 |
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
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They just had a quote that said 50-100.
But does anyone know how long it takes Dwarves and Orcs to mature? I think I read somewhere that Dwarves are greybeards by their twelfth year, but I'm not sure if I did. Has anyone else heard of anything like this?
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Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle |
01-10-2003, 05:03 PM | #9 |
The Insufferable
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,333
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I had never heard that... and I'm not sure I'd trust anyone who made that claim.
Among the dwarves in the hobbit, colored beards were almost the norm rather than the exception.
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01-10-2003, 05:24 PM | #10 |
Hobbit
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 22
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Thanks! Really interesting
I've got to get those HoMe books! |
01-13-2003, 10:33 PM | #11 |
Doughy Elf
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,006
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If orcs where made from elves then wouldn't the orcs be the same age as the elves were when they where mutilated? So unless they captured an unmature elf then the orc that it was turned into would already be matured. But then did the orcs have babies or did they just capture more elves? Oh, now I'm confussing my self!
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01-13-2003, 10:41 PM | #12 | |
Queen of Nargothrond
Administrator Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Akron, Ohio - USA
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Quote:
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"Whither go you?" she said. "North away." he said: "to the swords, and the siege, and the walls of defence - that yet for a while in Beleriand rivers may run clean, leaves spring, and birds build their nests, ere Night comes." AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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01-14-2003, 05:26 AM | #13 |
Greatest Elven woman of Aman
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It is said that Orcs bred (is it bred or breeded? Or something else?) in the same manner as did Elves and Men.
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01-14-2003, 11:23 AM | #14 | |
Queen of Nargothrond
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Quote:
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"Whither go you?" she said. "North away." he said: "to the swords, and the siege, and the walls of defence - that yet for a while in Beleriand rivers may run clean, leaves spring, and birds build their nests, ere Night comes." AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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01-14-2003, 02:45 PM | #15 |
Sapling
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 9
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Okay, now I am confused. I thought I remembered reading in the Silmarillion that orcs were created from elves caught by Melkor (Morgoth). Which reference has Tolkien's discussion that they were from men or discusses that he changes his mind? Someone recently asked me about the genesis of orcs and I'd better be sure I didn't tell them something completely wrong. Better yet, I can tell them where they can look it up!
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01-14-2003, 03:12 PM | #16 | |
Queen of Nargothrond
Administrator Join Date: Feb 2001
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Quote:
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"Whither go you?" she said. "North away." he said: "to the swords, and the siege, and the walls of defence - that yet for a while in Beleriand rivers may run clean, leaves spring, and birds build their nests, ere Night comes." AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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01-14-2003, 04:01 PM | #17 | |
Lurker
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Lothlórien
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Quote:
I am probably wrong however...
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01-14-2003, 04:33 PM | #18 | |
Sapling
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 9
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Quote:
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01-15-2003, 02:46 PM | #19 |
Quasi Evil
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Maryland, US
Posts: 4,634
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And back to the elf thing.......
If elves dont age technically (other then growing up slowly) when do they reach their final stage of maturity and why is it some look older then others? I mean if Elrond and Arwen are both thousands of years old shouldnt they look about the same age now? Why does Arwen still look so much younger then Elrond? Hi this is my daughter Arwen. Shes only 2000.....
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01-15-2003, 03:07 PM | #20 | ||
Co-President of Entmoot
Super Moderator Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Canada
Posts: 8,397
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...And I'm a ripe old 5000...
Some people tend to look older than others, given their physical characteristics. Maybe this applies to elves. Except, we don't really know what any of the elves look like. The movie doesn't count, because Elrond only looks older than Arwen because Hugo Weaving is older than Liv Tyler.
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