Next Big Question...

***gdl96*** · 01-02-2003, 04:23 PM

Now that The Two Towers is all done with, it's time to start thinking about Return of the King. The big question for TTT for a while was how it would start off. Well, how do you think ROTK will start?

My theory is the flashback trend will continue in a way. The camera will travel down the river Anduin for a few moments until we come accross two fishing hobbits, Smeagol and Deagol. This scene was rumored to be in TTT, but because it wasn't, maybe it will be in ROTK (there are pictures of the scene, and Andy Serkis (Gollum) has said in an interview that he will be seen without the CG makeup as Smeagol in a flashback in the third movie). Then we will see the two hobbits fight over the ring, etc. And then I think the movie would go to the present time with Gollum leading Frodo and Sam to Cirith Ungol.

***azalea*** · 01-02-2003, 04:59 PM

Ohhhhh, that would be so cool!! Maybe they'll have the flashback at the moment when he almost becomes "good" again when the hobbits are asleep and he's looking at Frodo, and then Sam wakes up and yells at him and *poof* it's Shelob time!

But they will probably start the very beginning w/ a scene that was played out in TTT, as was done at the beginning of TTT. I can't think of which one it will be, though. Or maybe not, since that was really done to show another part of the story that we hadn't seen.

eowyngirl14 · 01-02-2003, 05:56 PM

I think that it would be neat if they showed a scene of Frodo being attacked by Shelob, to get the aduance's attention! And then go back and show how Gollum betrayed the hobbits... They probobly won't though, as that would confuse many many people.

Cirdan · 01-02-2003, 06:03 PM

I would think that they would need to pick up near where they left off but would want to get that "running start" feeling of TTT. I would say that picking up at Isengard with a phased in reprise of the ents destruction to the arrival of the Helm's Deep crew. They still need to pick up M&P and all the next action is new material. It gives them the continuity of plot and action. They would follow with some action scene at Osgiliath and then Frodo et al hiding from the witchking on the stairs to Cirith Ungol., IMO

Elfhelm · 01-02-2003, 06:19 PM

I want Flotsam and Jetsam!

claudia silver · 01-02-2003, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Elfhelm I want Flotsam and Jetsam!

Me too! But I think, if it's in at all, it will be a quick version, sort of scooping up the hobbits on the way to Isengard. In the book it is a lull between the big action scenes of Helm's Deep and the encounter with Saruman. I dont think PJ will start with a 'lull' somehow.

Maybe the missing Smeagol and Deagol scene will appear in the extended version of the TT, at the part when Gollum remembers his name.

***gdl96*** · 01-02-2003, 07:02 PM

Hmm, maybe it will start off showing the much talked about fate of Saruman. Spiked wheel, anyone?

WallRocker · 01-02-2003, 07:11 PM

Personally, I think PJ will start off with Frodo, Sam and Gollum. The they will walk to Shelob's lair and... the scene will cut to Isengard with Gandalf just arriving. Okay, so this probably won't happen(I'm doubting PJ will leave musch of the scene with Gandalf and Sarumon in it), but I think that'd be pretty cool. Also, who thinks even more wil be cut out from the RotK book? Just think of how much was cut from TTT that they have to put in RotK! I think most people who have read thebooks will be dissapointed with RotK, even more so then TTT.

Millane · 01-02-2003, 07:12 PM

i think it will start at isengard again because that didnt finish in helms deep and thats the only big thing happening at the moment coz frodo and sam have been let go and are just walking along and helms deep has finished and they are all just riding along but i dont know how that will start... i think it could startwith sam and frodo panning up the stairs at cirith ungol that would work pretty well... undoubtedly the way they opened TT was incredibly awesome and the best opening to a movie that ive ever seen

lacemkr90 · 01-02-2003, 09:14 PM

The story is in a lull at the end of TTT. It ends just before everyone gathers strength for the battle for Gondor. They could start with the host issuing from Minas Morgul. They way they can go straight to Frodo & company and the stairs. But that doesn't leave much time for the wizards to meet in Isengard. PJ has included so much with Saurman and Gandalf that I would be surprised if he cut that part.

***gdl96*** · 01-02-2003, 10:17 PM

PJ said that TTT deviates from the books the most out of the three movies, so I wouldn't expect it to stray too much from the book, Wallrocker

WallRocker · 01-03-2003, 12:29 AM

I hadn't heard that. Well, hopefully PJ' going to keep RotK close to the book. Hey, we heard that Scouring of the Shire was going to be left out of RotK, but since Sarumon didn't die in TTT, maybe it will still be in. Anyone know?

Gwaimir Windgem · 01-03-2003, 03:27 AM

Since PJ and crew think TTT was Tolkien's big screw-up, naturally that one would be the least accurate to the book.

Laurelyn · 01-03-2003, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gwaimir Windgem
Since PJ and crew think TTT was Tolkien's big screw-up, naturally that one would be the least accurate to the book.

*coughs*
"Screw-up" eh? Gah. Methinks I disagree.

markedel · 01-03-2003, 01:53 PM

His writers see it as a "tangent."

Elfhelm · 01-03-2003, 02:12 PM

I think the punishment of Saruman is dramatically necessary, and they have set up the motive of Grima, as discussed in another thread, to do what the book says he will do. So I don't think they're going to build all the way toward that without the retribution, and that can't happen until Gandalf does you know what. So I still hope for Flotsam and Jetsam. and some fine weed out of the South Farthing. Plus, you know, they showed the first fight scene between Gandalf and Saruman... that has to be balanced out with ... well there are a alot of potential spoilers if I keep brainstorming outloud here.

Cirdan · 01-03-2003, 03:25 PM

I doubt the context of flotsam and jetsam would survive. It was just a mechanism to recount the trashing of Isengard. I can't imagine PJ starting out with characters eating, smoking, and telling long stories. The recounting of the end of either helm's deep or the seige of isengard are likely since they were left without conclusion (what next, etc.) Frodo will show up after the opening at the crossroads and then have the encouter with the witchking. That will privide enough action to get through to the seige of gondor. I wouldn't be surprised to see a battle thrown in at osgiliath with faramir, either.

Will we see ghan-buri-ghan? the paths of the dead? Will sam and frodo have to pass as orcs? Will sam carry frodo up orodruin?

We know aragorn is king since we've seen his tomb in rath dinen.

***gdl96*** · 01-03-2003, 04:34 PM

What about when one of the hobbits (merry or pippen? I forgot) retrieve's Saruman's palantir? You think they'll leave that in?

Elf Girl · 01-03-2003, 04:38 PM

They'd better!!

Celebréiel · 01-03-2003, 05:13 PM

Im hoping that they get RoTk right, they messed up quite a bit on TT, changing to many characters personalitys and such but I think RoTK might be better. Im thinking it will start with either Frodo and Sam or Merry and Pippin. Im really wondering how their gonna have the hobbits meet up w/ Gandalf and crew. He might keep it a little how it was in the book (instead of over-dramtizing it like PJ seems to do alot) but the movies both have had a typical movie set up, the begining, the build up, a major climax and a wind down...so who knows, the begining could be peaceful...maybe......I really have no clue, im a moron.
~Celebréiel

01-02-2003, 04:23 PM	#1
*gdl96* the greg the admin Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: NJ Posts: 2,101	Next Big Question... Now that The Two Towers is all done with, it's time to start thinking about Return of the King. The big question for TTT for a while was how it would start off. Well, how do you think ROTK will start? My theory is the flashback trend will continue in a way. The camera will travel down the river Anduin for a few moments until we come accross two fishing hobbits, Smeagol and Deagol. This scene was rumored to be in TTT, but because it wasn't, maybe it will be in ROTK (there are pictures of the scene, and Andy Serkis (Gollum) has said in an interview that he will be seen without the CG makeup as Smeagol in a flashback in the third movie). Then we will see the two hobbits fight over the ring, etc. And then I think the movie would go to the present time with Gollum leading Frodo and Sam to Cirith Ungol.

01-02-2003, 05:56 PM	#3
eowyngirl14 i don't know what i am talking about either, so don't ask Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 1,353	I think that it would be neat if they showed a scene of Frodo being attacked by Shelob, to get the aduance's attention! And then go back and show how Gollum betrayed the hobbits... They probobly won't though, as that would confuse many many people. __________________ 'The coming of dawn is ever the hope to the heart of men' -Aragorn 'Then I will die as one of them' -Aragorn TTT movie “They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little safety deserve neither liberty nor safety” - Benjamin Franklin arms are made for hugging avatar from the avatar shop! made by Eowyn, Lady of Rohan

01-02-2003, 06:03 PM	#4
Cirdan Elf Lord of the Grey Havens Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: somewhere else Posts: 2,381	I would think that they would need to pick up near where they left off but would want to get that "running start" feeling of TTT. I would say that picking up at Isengard with a phased in reprise of the ents destruction to the arrival of the Helm's Deep crew. They still need to pick up M&P and all the next action is new material. It gives them the continuity of plot and action. They would follow with some action scene at Osgiliath and then Frodo et al hiding from the witchking on the stairs to Cirith Ungol., IMO __________________ There exists a limit to the force even ther most powerful may apply without destroying themselves. Judging this limit is the true artistry of government. Misuse of power is the fatal sin. The law cannot be a tool of vengance, never a hostage, nor a fortification against the martyrs it has created. You cannot threaten any individual and escape the consequences. -Muad'dib on Law The Stilgar Commentary

01-02-2003, 06:19 PM	#5
Elfhelm Marshal of the Eastmark Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 1,412	I want Flotsam and Jetsam! __________________ cya

01-02-2003, 07:11 PM	#8
WallRocker Elven Warrior Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: At the computer... Posts: 376	Personally, I think PJ will start off with Frodo, Sam and Gollum. The they will walk to Shelob's lair and... the scene will cut to Isengard with Gandalf just arriving. Okay, so this probably won't happen(I'm doubting PJ will leave musch of the scene with Gandalf and Sarumon in it), but I think that'd be pretty cool. Also, who thinks even more wil be cut out from the RotK book? Just think of how much was cut from TTT that they have to put in RotK! I think most people who have read thebooks will be dissapointed with RotK, even more so then TTT. __________________ Do one thing every day that scares you ~Anonymous~ <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <><<>< <>< <>< <>< I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America And to the Republic for which it stands One nation UNDER GOD with liberty and justice for all

01-02-2003, 04:59 PM	#2
*azalea* Long lost mooter Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Florida Posts: 3,342	Ohhhhh, that would be so cool!! Maybe they'll have the flashback at the moment when he almost becomes "good" again when the hobbits are asleep and he's looking at Frodo, and then Sam wakes up and yells at him and poof it's Shelob time! But they will probably start the very beginning w/ a scene that was played out in TTT, as was done at the beginning of TTT. I can't think of which one it will be, though. Or maybe not, since that was really done to show another part of the story that we hadn't seen.

01-02-2003, 07:02 PM	#7
*gdl96* the greg the admin Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: NJ Posts: 2,101	Hmm, maybe it will start off showing the much talked about fate of Saruman. Spiked wheel, anyone?

01-02-2003, 07:12 PM	#9
Millane The Dude Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: at the altar of my ego Posts: 1,685	i think it will start at isengard again because that didnt finish in helms deep and thats the only big thing happening at the moment coz frodo and sam have been let go and are just walking along and helms deep has finished and they are all just riding along but i dont know how that will start... i think it could startwith sam and frodo panning up the stairs at cirith ungol that would work pretty well... undoubtedly the way they opened TT was incredibly awesome and the best opening to a movie that ive ever seen __________________ Ill heal your wounds, ill set you free,

01-02-2003, 09:14 PM	#10
lacemkr90 Hobbit Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Ithilien Posts: 44	The story is in a lull at the end of TTT. It ends just before everyone gathers strength for the battle for Gondor. They could start with the host issuing from Minas Morgul. They way they can go straight to Frodo & company and the stairs. But that doesn't leave much time for the wizards to meet in Isengard. PJ has included so much with Saurman and Gandalf that I would be surprised if he cut that part.

01-02-2003, 10:17 PM	#11
*gdl96* the greg the admin Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: NJ Posts: 2,101	PJ said that TTT deviates from the books the most out of the three movies, so I wouldn't expect it to stray too much from the book, Wallrocker

01-03-2003, 12:29 AM	#12
WallRocker Elven Warrior Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: At the computer... Posts: 376	I hadn't heard that. Well, hopefully PJ' going to keep RotK close to the book. Hey, we heard that Scouring of the Shire was going to be left out of RotK, but since Sarumon didn't die in TTT, maybe it will still be in. Anyone know? __________________ Do one thing every day that scares you ~Anonymous~ <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <>< <><<>< <>< <>< <>< I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America And to the Republic for which it stands One nation UNDER GOD with liberty and justice for all

01-03-2003, 03:27 AM	#13
Gwaimir Windgem Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA Posts: 10,820	Since PJ and crew think TTT was Tolkien's big screw-up, naturally that one would be the least accurate to the book. __________________ Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle

01-03-2003, 01:53 PM	#15
markedel 'Sober' Mullet Frosh Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Queen's Posts: 1,245	His writers see it as a "tangent." __________________ "Earnur was a man like his father in valour, but not in wisdom"

01-03-2003, 02:12 PM	#16
Elfhelm Marshal of the Eastmark Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 1,412	I think the punishment of Saruman is dramatically necessary, and they have set up the motive of Grima, as discussed in another thread, to do what the book says he will do. So I don't think they're going to build all the way toward that without the retribution, and that can't happen until Gandalf does you know what. So I still hope for Flotsam and Jetsam. and some fine weed out of the South Farthing. Plus, you know, they showed the first fight scene between Gandalf and Saruman... that has to be balanced out with ... well there are a alot of potential spoilers if I keep brainstorming outloud here. __________________ cya Last edited by Elfhelm : 01-03-2003 at 02:15 PM.

01-03-2003, 03:25 PM	#17
Cirdan Elf Lord of the Grey Havens Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: somewhere else Posts: 2,381	I doubt the context of flotsam and jetsam would survive. It was just a mechanism to recount the trashing of Isengard. I can't imagine PJ starting out with characters eating, smoking, and telling long stories. The recounting of the end of either helm's deep or the seige of isengard are likely since they were left without conclusion (what next, etc.) Frodo will show up after the opening at the crossroads and then have the encouter with the witchking. That will privide enough action to get through to the seige of gondor. I wouldn't be surprised to see a battle thrown in at osgiliath with faramir, either. Will we see ghan-buri-ghan? the paths of the dead? Will sam and frodo have to pass as orcs? Will sam carry frodo up orodruin? We know aragorn is king since we've seen his tomb in rath dinen. __________________ There exists a limit to the force even ther most powerful may apply without destroying themselves. Judging this limit is the true artistry of government. Misuse of power is the fatal sin. The law cannot be a tool of vengance, never a hostage, nor a fortification against the martyrs it has created. You cannot threaten any individual and escape the consequences. -Muad'dib on Law The Stilgar Commentary

01-03-2003, 04:34 PM	#18
*gdl96* the greg the admin Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: NJ Posts: 2,101	What about when one of the hobbits (merry or pippen? I forgot) retrieve's Saruman's palantir? You think they'll leave that in?

01-03-2003, 04:38 PM	#19
Elf Girl Lurker Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Lothlórien Posts: 3,419	They'd better!! __________________ There's antimony, arsenic, aluminum, selenium...

01-03-2003, 05:13 PM	#20
Celebréiel Elven Warrior Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: A house! Posts: 376	Im hoping that they get RoTk right, they messed up quite a bit on TT, changing to many characters personalitys and such but I think RoTK might be better. Im thinking it will start with either Frodo and Sam or Merry and Pippin. Im really wondering how their gonna have the hobbits meet up w/ Gandalf and crew. He might keep it a little how it was in the book (instead of over-dramtizing it like PJ seems to do alot) but the movies both have had a typical movie set up, the begining, the build up, a major climax and a wind down...so who knows, the begining could be peaceful...maybe......I really have no clue, im a moron. ~Celebréiel __________________ Peace Yeah, Your an individual...just like everyone else. http://cartalien.deviantart.com/ - Arty goodness

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