03-08-2007, 10:37 PM | #1 | |
Magnificent Master of Buckland
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Anti-Homeschool Germany
Has anyone one heard about the incident where a perfectly sane and normal homeschooled girl in Germany that was taken away from her parents? I think that its terrible, especially since I too am homeschooled.
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What are your guy's thoughts on this?
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03-08-2007, 11:16 PM | #2 | ||
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Well I heard about this story, I think they may have reacted a little harshly. But it is clearly noted that they were breaking the law. In principle I don't think the government should dictate education (as I've said before almost everything the govt. touches, turns not to gold but to crap). I'm a fan of free choice adn former homeschooler myself, that notwithstanding its against the law of that land so those people don't have a whole lot to go on with the exception that the Govt's response was rather disproportionate to the severity of the crime.
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03-09-2007, 12:11 AM | #3 |
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I think the way that it was done was very odd and overblown.
However I'm not a huge fan of home schooling, having been taught that way my entire life till I started university. |
03-09-2007, 01:38 AM | #4 | |
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But it is the way of my people to use light words at such times and say less than they mean. We fear to say to much. It robs us of the right words when a jest is out of place. -Meriadoc Brandybuck Is there anything I can do that wouldn't inconvenience me?.-Adrian Monk Hogan: What's a definate factor that we can count on? Newkirk: We don't know what we're doing. Do you wanna split a pineapple? -Shawn Spencer Last edited by Meriadoc Brandybuck : 03-09-2007 at 02:05 AM. |
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03-09-2007, 02:03 AM | #5 |
Thain of Randomness
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I think that that law is discriminating. Why did they keep it as a law even after Hitler? It's not like the parents are torturing their kids or something; they're just teaching them at home! There's nothing wrong with that (unless they somehow do it in a way that's against the law besides that it's illegal there.)
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03-09-2007, 04:12 AM | #6 |
The Chocoholic Sea Elf Administrator
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The article is somewhat slanted, and I feel like I'm missing some information to form a decent opinion on this. However, while I'm no big fan of homeschooling, it does sound like the system over-reacted big time. On the other hand, if they sent her to a psychiatry unit, I can't help but thinking some trauma must already have been present.
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03-09-2007, 06:30 AM | #7 |
Elf Lord
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I am much more worried by your posting this zealotry and militant fundamendalist army activism here on a tolkien board.
To say it is slanted is beyond recognition - and that is me being traditionally understated. What i hated was the 'WHAT YOU SHOULD DO NOW' part and the radical fundamentalist rally crys to defend and enlist what is effectively a dangerious splinter group, every bit as fundamental and dangerious to society as the Muslim fundamentalists that are causing havoc in the world. An actively enlisting and increasingly separatist christian movement looking to withdraw from the modern world and any form of state education and who utlimately wish to see the destruction of the west as we know it. (btw read what i actually say before replying - i shall say this only once - and that in a french accent! ) Last edited by Butterbeer : 03-09-2007 at 06:32 AM. |
03-09-2007, 01:08 PM | #8 | |||
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I disagree that there is a parallel to Islamic fundamentalist if it were islamofascists writing that it would say kill all German psychiatrists or something. Personally I don't like this idea of a bunch of americans petitioning a foreign country about a case that is fairly cut and dried, the idea that Germany would care about such a petition is ludicrous, and kind of stupid for a bunch of random people to get involved in, its up to Germany's legal system.
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03-09-2007, 01:43 PM | #9 |
Dreamweaver
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that is RIDICULOUS
i am not homeschooled, but some of my good friends are, and they are not in need of mental aid...that makes me angry...if i wasn't so apathetically inclined, i'd write a letter...
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03-09-2007, 02:33 PM | #10 | |
the Shrike
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03-09-2007, 02:43 PM | #11 |
Entmoot Attorney-General,
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Thanks for posting that BoP. The psychiatrist's opninion was just what I was interested in.
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03-09-2007, 03:24 PM | #12 | |
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Homeschooling should not be illegal, here is why
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http://www.chec.org/Legislative/News...#1091224571440 Here are 2 more great links: http:// www.reason.com/news/show/36566.html http://whyhomeschool.blogspot.com/20...rs-digest.html It's all about controlling the minds of the people, it's the thought police ok, that's all it is. That's why it was first introduced by hitler, social engineering; they want mindless uninformed none critical thinking sheep, so they can control them, that's it.
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03-09-2007, 04:25 PM | #13 |
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I've never been a big fan of home schooling, or private schooling for that matter. I don't think it's so much a matter of grades as a matter of experience. The greatest thing we all learn from those twelve years of our lives isn't reading, writing or mathematics, it's learning to deal and live with peers in an environment outside of parental involvement.
I think public school is the best forum for this, because it lets you experience the widest base of peers. From smart kids, to dumb kids, from nice kids to mean kids, from good teachers to bad teachers. If you grow up in an atmosphere that is too "perfect", you simply aren't going to be ready for the real world when you get older. I know a lot of adults who grew up in such a controlled environment and simply can't deal with the stress when things go wrong, and can't deal with people they don't get along with in a productive way. Many of them are very intelligent, due to being very well-taught while growing up, but they lack that experience with the darker side of life. I can understand how parents think they are doing their kids a favor by making their childhood as productive and protective as possible, but I think that their actions ultimately produce adults that aren't as adaptable to the real world as they could be.
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03-09-2007, 04:37 PM | #14 |
Elf Lord
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Here's the problem, imo.
Grade standards are averages. So if this child indeed is (as I don't see proved here) a year off a standard, that's statistically likely. The Economist just discussed a study done on medical statistics showing that poorly run statistics "proved" Scorpio's were more likely to break a wrist, and suchlike. If this psychiatrist tested (and tested doubleblind, as opposed to having an unwilling patient delivered by the state) all the children in the school, they wouldn't all be "grade level".
The essential issue with compulsory schooling, to me, is that it's compulsory. We've determined that the state has a right to incarcerate people, due to their birth year. Why people who are otherwise all about human rights consider that normal is a mystery to me. |
03-09-2007, 04:49 PM | #15 | |
Elf Lord
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I think it's interesting
That you seem to be accepting 'age peer' and "peer' as identity. Here on the Entmoot, for example, other things than birthdays define who is a peer. It's only in the context of first accepting the separation of children by age from larger society that it's possible to view public school as the great leveler.
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03-09-2007, 04:53 PM | #16 |
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I'd be interested in the psychiatric evaluation of some of those white supremecist kids in Germany - seems to me that they're more of a problem than a young girl who's a bit behind the curve scholastically and nervous of going to a public school (a pretty normal thing, IMO).
And why would this psychiatric evluation be available on the Internet? That seems kinda weird.
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03-09-2007, 04:59 PM | #17 |
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Too much of a slant on this article for me to tell. What site did you get it from?
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03-09-2007, 06:58 PM | #18 |
Elf Lord
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I am not per se against homeschooling - but rohirrim TR calls it straight and true when he says there are laws and rules in any country.
These may be just or not - but i do not see any case on that argument. This is not America. This is Germany. Nor do i care much either for the German authoritarian approach in this case. Full stop. I take that Expert child-psychiatric opinion quoted, very lightly indeed - but, frankly - what was posted here, on a tolkien board - THAT i take with utter disgust and quite frankly rather some hostility. it is the exact equivalent from the honest mirror of what the radicalised christians are as to the fundamentalist Muslims. ...and we see this hate mongering propaganda posted here? Right or left, liberal or Conservative ... who cares - but say NO to Armegedonists from BOTH sides! ... and do not good christian, nor good atheist, alike, let them play on your fears or diasagreement to turn this world into a living Hell, or fulfill their extremist 'Armegeddon' wishes. |
03-09-2007, 08:13 PM | #19 | |
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03-09-2007, 10:18 PM | #20 | |
Elf Lord
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I saw this
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It's clearly a biased account, straight from email, I'd assume. But one of the difficulties with the homeschool debate in NA is that so much of it is left to the fundamentalists. Yet, fundamentalists are far from the only homeschoolers. I don't know about Germany in general, but I do know that a lot of American service people there homeschool for reasons other than religious fundamentalism. Where are secular homeschoolers to build support, if everyone's notion is that it's a fundamentalist rejection of Western Civilization and open dialog? |
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