04-19-2017, 07:31 PM | #1 |
High King at Annuminas Administrator
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Driving Sauron from Dol Guldor
Not especially fond of the Hobbit Movie Trilogy, but the last one - Battle of Five Armies - has been playing on TV a lot lately, and I've been watching now and then.
As I watched the scene in Battle of Five Armies, where the White Council drives Sauron from Dol Guldor... I started thinking that JRRT gives us very little about how it would have happened. What do you think of Peter Jackson's depiction of the event? All the main characters are there: Gandalf, Galadriel, Elrond, Saruman... plus Radagast. Maybe Celeborn should have been included. Do you think there would have been an Elvish army, or just the heavy-weights? And... what do you think about the portrayal of the combat? And how the outcome was shown?
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04-22-2017, 09:36 PM | #2 |
Elf Lord
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JRRt gives us very little because a little has happened.
Actually, according to Tolkien, it went on quite peacefully. His words “Sauron, having made his plans, abandons Dol Guldur “(“LOTR“, App.B) imply that he was not “driven out”, as the White Council wanted everyone to believe, but just unhurriedly retreated in accordance with his own plans. Jackson hugely overdid the event, bringing in such a crowd. Tolkien asserts that Galadriel alone seems effortlessly razed Dol Guldur after the surmount of the fortress, then what had held her hands to do it at the time of the stand? No need of the Elvish army. Jackson's interpretation was entertaining and on a borderline of being comical. Made a more interesting movie from an otherwise plain story .
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04-26-2017, 09:09 AM | #3 | |||
Elven Warrior
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Quote:
Suaron's plans are revealed here a well: that the Nine had gone before him to make ready for his return, so that his [Sauron's] flight was a feint, and he returned to Mordor. And in the longer version of Appendix B [which Tolkien had to be talked out of, and even noted in The Fellowship of The Ring that the published Appendix B was, in part, a truncated version] it's again said that the Sorcerer was "driven out", which again implies force to me, despite that Sauron himself had plans to reoccupy Mordor. Quote:
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04-26-2017, 01:54 PM | #4 | ||
Elf Lord
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Quote:
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Sauron already made his mind about moving, but was procrastinating, so, Saruman speeded him up by demonstrating to him the work of his ingenious gadget.
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Uruk-hai, or the journey to there. Last edited by Olmer : 04-26-2017 at 02:26 PM. |
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04-27-2017, 07:16 AM | #5 | ||
Elven Warrior
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Quote:
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Last edited by Galin : 04-27-2017 at 05:30 PM. |
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05-04-2017, 09:35 AM | #6 |
The Chocoholic Sea Elf Administrator
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Olmer generally believes in a let's call it... more original reading of the texts than some of us.
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05-05-2017, 07:30 AM | #7 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Sep 2008
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I've traded posts with Olmer before, and read some of his opinions. Here, he starts with a seemingly sure "nope" to respond to my brief paraphrasing of something Tolkien wrote, JRRT's fuller version being:
"But their stroke was too late. For the Dark Lord had forseen it, and he had long prepared all his movements; and the Ulairi, his Nine servants, had gone before him to make ready for his coming. Therefore his flight was but a feint, and he soon returned, and ere the Wise could prevent him he re-entered his kindom in Mordor and reared once again the towers of Barad-dur." So, besides spelling Sauron incorrectly for some reason I think I did pretty well with my summation... "Suaron's plans are revealed here a well: that the Nine had gone before him to make ready for his return, so that his [Sauron's] flight was a feint, and he returned to Mordor." |
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