03-05-2002, 09:13 PM | #1 |
'Sober' Mullet Frosh
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Queen's
Posts: 1,245
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Gah politics!
I rarely gripe about such matters on this forum, but frankly matter in the middle east have shaken me out of my usual cynicism. So here I sit and I say GAH!
I also figure any response I get will be far more rational then die arab/zionist maggots. Ah usenet!
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"Earnur was a man like his father in valour, but not in wisdom" |
03-05-2002, 09:33 PM | #2 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Wilmore, KY
Posts: 269
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I personally am very much in support of Israel. The way things are going, I don't think the situation can last very long as it is. Something is going to happen. I don't think peace is going to happen in the area any time soon. Both sides ask for things that the other can't give
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Sometimes I wonder how many monkeys with typewritters it would take to reproduce what I just wrote. |
03-05-2002, 09:34 PM | #3 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Slow down and I sail on the river, slow down and I walk to the hill
Posts: 2,389
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::runs away from this potential flame spot::
Let's just not have another pyre of Denethor, me-eh?
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“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.” –Bertrand Russell |
03-05-2002, 09:51 PM | #4 |
Halfwitted Queen of Lothlorien
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Far off in a dream
Posts: 1,166
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Well if they're not gonna find bin Laden any time soon, why keep talking about it? Every day on the news, it's: "Authorities say they are no closer to finding bin Laden and suspect he has fled to neighboring Pakistan..." or something to that effect. Quite frankly, it's getting on my nerves!
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The beuatiful mind/The beautiful heart/Doesn't deserve the pain/How can I stop the rain? -How Can I Stop the Rain? by Kessid, my new favorite band +Every good thing that comes into my life is only a reflection of the greatest gift of all; the offering of yourself, dear Son of God+ Always remember, you're uniqe, just like everybody else! "The one constant through all the years has been the Trombone. America has rolled by like an army of steamrollers. Its been erased like a blackboard, rebuilt and erased again, but the Trombone has marked the time. This field, this section, this band is a part of our past. It reminds us of all that once was good, and could be again. Oh, people will come . . . people will most definitely come." |
03-05-2002, 09:55 PM | #5 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Valinor, right next to Telperion . . . what did you expect, Michigan?
Posts: 1,315
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Re: Gah politics!
Quote:
And I can't see the use of Bush's "War on Terror" . . . he's waging a war against what's left of the Taliban, not terrorism. I'm thinking that half the point of fighting it is to quell the bloddthirstiness of the millions of Americans who have been thoroughly p*ssed off by the 9/11 incident (heck, we've got a right to be mad, and upset, but I myself see no use in going and killing more poeple than have already been killed). *looks at all she's just written*Gah . . . and I said I thought politics were baffling . . . excuse me while I get off my soapbox.
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The Third Age of Entmoot has begun. Angel of music, guide and guardian! Grant to me your glory! The country I eat and spend the day in is by no means the country I sleep and dream in. Define patriotism. Hold the boat, you spastic monkey! ~ Elenka Last edited by Laurelyn : 03-05-2002 at 09:56 PM. |
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03-05-2002, 10:28 PM | #6 |
'Sober' Mullet Frosh
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Queen's
Posts: 1,245
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I wasn't interested in debating (way too much fire) I was venting and this a place where you can vent without starting an itense debate over arab land rights in pre-mandate palestine or some such. Unless the admins get you nwah ha ha
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"Earnur was a man like his father in valour, but not in wisdom" |
03-05-2002, 10:38 PM | #7 |
Halfwitted Queen of Lothlorien
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Far off in a dream
Posts: 1,166
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Well, sorry, but if you make a threaf such as this, you're gonna get replies, and there's gonna be a debate...it's kinda inevitable.
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The beuatiful mind/The beautiful heart/Doesn't deserve the pain/How can I stop the rain? -How Can I Stop the Rain? by Kessid, my new favorite band +Every good thing that comes into my life is only a reflection of the greatest gift of all; the offering of yourself, dear Son of God+ Always remember, you're uniqe, just like everybody else! "The one constant through all the years has been the Trombone. America has rolled by like an army of steamrollers. Its been erased like a blackboard, rebuilt and erased again, but the Trombone has marked the time. This field, this section, this band is a part of our past. It reminds us of all that once was good, and could be again. Oh, people will come . . . people will most definitely come." |
03-06-2002, 12:29 AM | #8 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Canada
Posts: 479
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Laurelyn, I was in the same situation. The newspapers will not give you the background. You read them, they will just confuse you. If you want to figure out who's fighting who and why, you'd be better off going to some modern history book that explains the sequence of events. You better try several different versions, because with stuff this recent, there's bound to be bias, so you gotta sort through that. I eventually had to get my history buff friend to explain it all the me ( the modern part. If we had started with biblical times, it would take forever). After hearing that, I've decided that both sides (Israeli and Palestinian) are in the wrong somewhere in the whole process, but the power balance just shifts from one group to the other depending on different things. So frustrating. There's never going to be peace in that area. It boggles the mind. How can people live in that kind of world? It's so sad.
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03-06-2002, 02:07 AM | #9 |
Hoplite Nomad
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 3,931
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as the old posters here know, I work I Saudi Arabia.( and no I am NOT in the military and never was)
I think that the Zionist and Islamic Fundamentalist ( notice I didn't say Muslims and Jews) should have one of those white trash death cage matches like in wrestling and they could just kill each other off. Then, maybe, the level headed members could find a solution. Being here in the thick of things I see that the hatred between both groups is beyond comprehension. I do find the Saudis can not understand that there is difference between a Jew and a Zionist. But guess some people think all Muslims are suicidial,homocidial,militants
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About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer. |
03-06-2002, 06:37 AM | #10 | |
Hoplite Nomad
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 3,931
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Quote:
just poking fun at what wayfarer might say
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About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer. |
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03-07-2002, 08:54 PM | #11 | |
Enting
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: urban Oklahoma
Posts: 73
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Re: Re: Gah politics!
Quote:
The Taliban are terrorists. They committed a horrific terrorist act against the U.S. They want to wipe us off the planet. If we don't fight them, they will conclude that the Americans don't bother to fight their enemies, and will therefore be easy to destroy. Then they'll attack us even more. We have to teach the terrorists that America is a force to be reckoned with. Wanting to save lives is admirable -- America is trying to do just that. And BTW, I don't think I'm bloodthirsty.
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He who loves a pure heart and whose speech is gracious will have the king for his friend. -Proverbs 22:11 |
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03-07-2002, 09:15 PM | #12 |
'Sober' Mullet Frosh
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Queen's
Posts: 1,245
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Well my views have swung from relatively dovish to bomb the west bank to rubble. Not that the leaders on all sides aren't all idiots, its just that I can't think another way to get terrorists attention.
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"Earnur was a man like his father in valour, but not in wisdom" |
03-07-2002, 10:04 PM | #13 |
Hoplite Nomad
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 3,931
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Anyone see Swordfish?
Don't recall the exact wording but it was like: They take a church we take 10 of theirs They take an airplane we take an airport ...Blah Blah Blah.. something and we tactically nuke a city to make the thought of terrorism too costly i don't think that I am as pro-american as Alethes seems to be. We do have our problems and sins , However, I am against terrorism which I define as attacking civilians. I feel that you cross a line there then I believe in the above statement from swordfish HOWEVER there is one big problem, groups are terrorist not countries also should we invade northren ireland to stop the terrorism there? one the saudis here said the only way to sovle the problem is for the the jews and muslims in the middle east to for them to nuke each other off of the face of the Earth I am no supporter of Isreal;however, whenever they stop hostilities some fundamentalist breaks the truce, inwhich Isreal will attack and the cycle just continues
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About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer. |
03-08-2002, 12:39 AM | #14 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: utumno and angband
Posts: 241
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these people have been fighting for thousands of years, lets just let them finish it. whoever wins gets the country. sounds simple enough for me.
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"........and his name is Melkor, Lord of All, Giver of Freedom, and he shall make you stronger than they."- sauron talking to ar pharazon. |
03-08-2002, 12:41 AM | #15 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Canada
Posts: 479
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Not going to happen.
No one is ever going to admit defeat. Things are just going to cycle until the sun becomes a red giant and engulfs us all. |
03-08-2002, 03:44 PM | #16 |
'Sober' Mullet Frosh
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Queen's
Posts: 1,245
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It won't last that long, if this continues I give Israel 15 years tops.
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"Earnur was a man like his father in valour, but not in wisdom" |
03-08-2002, 04:16 PM | #17 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Valinor, right next to Telperion . . . what did you expect, Michigan?
Posts: 1,315
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Re: Re: Re: Gah politics!
Quote:
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The Third Age of Entmoot has begun. Angel of music, guide and guardian! Grant to me your glory! The country I eat and spend the day in is by no means the country I sleep and dream in. Define patriotism. Hold the boat, you spastic monkey! ~ Elenka |
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03-08-2002, 08:30 PM | #18 | |
Hoplite Nomad
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 3,931
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Quote:
With the exception of 9-11 which was sheer brilliance ( through a logistics POV) the arabs are a HIGHLY disorganized people. look at the precariou sitaution Isreal has been in for years. Surrounded and outnumbered. I work in the "heart of Islam" and national differences are stronger than their religions ones ( I really wanna go into a religious tirade BUT i'll refrain) There is heirachy and division that is apalling. The saudis AS A WHOLE treat others with a thinly veiled disdain. The "WHITE" Arabs are next to the saudis( egypt, jordan, syria, tunisia etc) then the Black Arabs (sudan etc) then Philipinos and educated Indians, then regular indians, pakis, and people from bagladesh other SE asian countries ( ps when i say black muslim it means non- saudi blacks. but even though have rights here as saudis they still seem to be a tad less equal than the "white" saudi" The latter ,those after the black arabs, are little more than slaves here they really have no rights several of my students have called them animals However they're all Muslims ( this could be applied to all religions, however the focus is islam now) I forgot about the turks they are at the paki level. ( i guess that when the ottomans fell the saudis never forgave them) the point being is that the only organized efforts seemed to have been 9-11 The only time that the religion seems to do anything is violence ( yes I'm exaggerating) I't would take and co-ordinated arab attack on israel which I don't see happening. Isreal with US help could probably take it. They are to well organized unlike the arabs. a MAJOR terrorism act like a nuclear explosion would do the trick however I think the israeli mind set would be to counter strike with nukes there's my early morning vent
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About Eowyn, Does anyone know what her alias Dernhelm means? She was kown as dernhelm because of her exclaimation when she realized that the rider's headgear was heavy and obscured her sight. 'Dern Helm" Culled from Entmoot From Kirinski 57 and Wayfarer. |
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03-09-2002, 08:08 PM | #19 |
The Buckleberry Fairy/Captain
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Washington State again (I miss Texas).
Posts: 1,345
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Wow, a-e, thanks for the complicated but interesting breakdown. At least, I found it interesting, but it sound like I'm [one of] the only polisci/hist/current events junkie[s] on the moot. From what I've seen (from my relatively limited perspective), Islam is not a strong enough uniting factor to rule out the interests of various groups (six day war?)
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A day will come at last when I Shall take the hidden paths that run West of the Moon, East of the Sun. |
03-09-2002, 08:36 PM | #20 |
'Sober' Mullet Frosh
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Queen's
Posts: 1,245
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Israel has 15 years because
Israel can only stop this terrorist warfare with full reoccupation of the territories and killing lots of palestinians. Now this happens to palestinians every 20 years or so. Unfortunetly Israel is restrained and so it will suffer until it a) collapses because of unending terrorism that destroys the fabric of the country or b) negotiates with the palestinians into pre-1967 borders. The palestinians who seem to show no desire to do anything but kill Israelis (as a nationalist movement) use their mini-state as a terrorist haven, and commence to do a). Or if they're lucky get right of return of wipe Israel off the face the Earth through demographics. Sure it takes longer then conventional warfare, but I have more faith in the palestinian ability to wage terrorist warfare then the world's ability to care about a bunch of Jews. And that's how I feel about the situation.
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"Earnur was a man like his father in valour, but not in wisdom" |
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