Where did Hobbits come from?

[Lord of the Mark]

I was just reading the Fellowship of the Ring for the fifth time and I came to In the House of Tom Bombadil, and there Tom's talking about how he was there when the first raindrop fell, the first acorn, and he made paths before the big people, and he saw the Little People arriving. The Little People arriving. That implies that Middle-Earth was there before Hobbits were, that also implies that Tom knows about goings on in all Middle-Earth, so if the Little People were "arriving" then that means that they must have come from somewhere over the Sea, but not from Numenor otherwise there would be a record, so that means that there's another island out there. The Home of the Hobbits.

Please voice your opinions

[Earniel]

It's a nice theory, but there is no island where all Hobbits came from.

If you read the Silmarillion you'll see that Men appeared, or rather 'woke up' on Middle-earth in the First Aera. Many of the tribes were on the move for very long, some came West and eventually received Númenor to live on.

But many others just stayed in Middle-earth. The Hobbits, as they are counted among Men, must have been among them. There just isn't much record of these more Eastern tribes. The Hobbits were only sighted when they popped up around the Anduin, from where they made their way to the Shire.

[Lord of the Mark]

Pffff, maybe.


Haha.

But I still don't get what Tom Bombadil meant by 'arriving'.

[Landroval]

According to Silmarillion:

At the first rising of the Sun the Younger Children of Iluvatar awoke in the land of Hildorien in the eastward regions of Middle-earth

Afterwards, they started migrating in waves towards the western regions. Since hobbits are a branch of Men they are included in this movement; according to the Tale of Years, LotR:

Year 1050:
Hyarmendacil conquers the Harad. Gondor reaches the height of its power. About this time a shadow falls on Greenwood, and men begin to call it Mirkwood. The Periannath are first mentioned in records, with the coming of the Harfoots to Eriador.

[Curubethion]

So...hobbits are really a bunch of fat midgets!

[trolls' bane]

Aha!
This question has been bugging me for years!

[Alcuin]

I don’t recall that Tolkien wrote any more than that the hobbits immigrated into Eriador from the Vales of Anduin. The Stoors were southernmost in the “upper vales of Anduin” and the Fallohides northernmost – these “crossed the [Misty] mountains north of Rivendell,” according to the Prologue of FotR. In Unfinished Tales, Tolkien seemed to be at some pains to distinguish the Drúedain from Hobbits, being careful about how he described their love of mushrooms, for instance (one wonders whether Tolkien himself was particularly fond of mushrooms), but there is some lingering question in my mind about whether the Drûgs were related to the hobbits, or whether both were separate subgroups of Men in general.

Hobbits (and Drûgs) were, like all Men, including the Númenóreans, native to Middle-earth, just as were Elves in their origins.

[Lord of the Mark]

Well, that just takes the biscuit.

[hectorberlioz]

Hobbits and Drugs...seems to fit together pretty well

[trolls' bane]

Originally Posted by hectorberlioz

Hobbits and Drugs...seems to fit together pretty well

Especially with those mushrooms.

[hectorberlioz]

Originally Posted by trolls' bane

Especially with those mushrooms.

Exactly..., and "pipeweed"...no wonder Gandalf loves their culture so much, he was sick of the strict rules of Wizard Academy

[trolls' bane]

Hmm...
I know some people I would gladly see off to the shire, and whom probably would not wish to return. *sinister plot*

[hectorberlioz]

Originally Posted by trolls' bane

Hmm...
I know some people I would gladly see off to the shire, and whom probably would not wish to return. *sinister plot*

It's basically like Holland in that respect...
Middle-earth Politicians "retire" there for vacation, too.

[trolls' bane]

Hmm...
You know, I find it odd that, being in a relatively dangerous region with only scattered "Rangers", that the Shire managed to thrive as it did.

[Alcuin]

The army of Arthedain and most its population were destroyed in the disastrous war of III 1974-5. Then Eärnur arrived by sea in Mithlond with the sending-force of Gondor, and together with the surviving Dúnedain of Arthedain, the Elves of Lindon, and the cavalry of Rivendell, the armies of Angmar were destroyed on the plains outside Fornost Erain. Angmar was utterly defeated, all its armies (of presumably both men and orcs) were completely destroyed, and only the Witch-king escaped. After that, the Nazgûl departed for the attack on and siege of Minas Ithil: Arthedain was destroyed so that only the royal house and a few other Dúnedain survived: it was no longer a threat to Sauron’s plans, or so he must have supposed.

I believe the Prologue of FotR says that the hobbits hid while the war of III 1974-5 passed over them, and afterwards, there were only the occasional incursions by orcs, trolls, and wolves to trouble them: they were on the border with Lindon, they were not a threat and so also not a target, it would seem. The Dúnedain continued to dwindle, in part, no doubt, due to incursions into their old territory, which they continued to defend with the Rangers. There were attacks on the region, but they were not in great numbers as in the days of Angmar in its wars with the daughter kingdoms of Arnor because that territory was no longer of any strategic importance once Arnor and its people died.

Besides, the hobbits could and did arise to their own defense from time to time, as they did under the leadership of Bandobras “Bullroarer” Took in III 2747 (SR 1147) at the Battle of Greenfields, and later in III 3119 (SR 1419) when Merry, Pippin, and Sam led them in their resistance against Saruman and his ruffians.

[Valandil]

Originally Posted by Lord of the Mark

:
:
But I still don't get what Tom Bombadil meant by 'arriving'.

I believe Tom's view of things was very much centered on his particular area of Middle Earth.

[trolls' bane]

Good point. I tend to agree.
Tom was meant to be an enigma, as I seem to remember someone whipping a quote from Tolkien saying so himself.

[Lotesse]

Where did hobbits come from? Hobbits came from they mamas. You see, the daddy hobbit and the mama hobbit get together in a close and intimate way, and nine months later, a baby hobbit issues forth. There. Question answered. Glad to be of service.

[GreyMouser]

Hobbits get along particularly well with the Men of Bree, who are already noticeably short... they probably originated among groups of Men who were trying to survive in turbulent times by hiding rather than fighting- their own legends say that they were once taller, and have dwindled (and it's implied that they continued to do so after the end of the Third Age.)

As such, small size would be an advantage, as well as the ability to move quietly- and would explain their propensity to live in holes. They also are very good at throwing stones, notably at small animals and birds, which would be a valuable food source- being in hiding they wouldn't be given much to husbandry, and their small size would eliminate the larger game animals.

Since they would be trying to survive in less desirable lands- thick forests or uplands- where food would often be scarce, it would be advantageous for them to be able to go without for long periods, and gorge themselves when supplies were abundant.

There are quite a few parallels in the modern folk mythology of writers like Mary Stewart and Rosemary Sutcliffe where the "Little People" hiding in the hills are actually supposed to be the remnants of the pre-Celtic inhabitants of Britain.

[trolls' bane]

Mouser, do you research every topic before you post regarding it?