05-06-2004, 10:06 AM | #141 | |
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Since this thread is old, I am going to repost the part of the story that Nolendil had posted, and I am adding the rest on that takes us to the end of the story. I don't think it is much of a spoiler, but gives even those who do not have Morgoth's Ring, a chance to participate in the discussion. The part from the book I am posting is only relevant to the topic discussion.
From Morgoth's Ring, volume 10, The Histories of Middle-earth series. Quote:
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05-06-2004, 10:09 AM | #142 | |
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continued...
Quote:
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"Whither go you?" she said. "North away." he said: "to the swords, and the siege, and the walls of defence - that yet for a while in Beleriand rivers may run clean, leaves spring, and birds build their nests, ere Night comes." AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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05-06-2004, 01:29 PM | #143 |
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Wow. Stirring.
Is any hint of this in 'The Silmarillion'? It's been a while since I read it and I don't recall - but also they (Aegnor and Andreth) are apparently peripheral rather than central characters. I see too where the line in your sig comes from, SGH!
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05-06-2004, 02:45 PM | #144 | |
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One thing that is hinted at in the Sil though, is the darkness that Men were fleeing from. Beor talks to Finrod vaguely about it. The Athrabeth discusses this at length, especially in the Tale of Adanel, explaining somewhat how the Gift of Iluvatar became tainted.
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"Whither go you?" she said. "North away." he said: "to the swords, and the siege, and the walls of defence - that yet for a while in Beleriand rivers may run clean, leaves spring, and birds build their nests, ere Night comes." AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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05-06-2004, 03:10 PM | #145 | |
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Quote:
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05-06-2004, 03:25 PM | #146 | |
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I think it's helpful to view the Elves as being as imperfect as we are in both making judgements and taking actions. Or nearly so, anyway... their years and insights may make them a little better, but they are still capable of 'guessing wrong'. Especially when dealing with Humans... whose viewpoint they may try to imagine, but cannot really 'connect' with. This might have been better for Andreth (but then again, maybe not... who knows what response such a 'talk' may have triggered?) - but that may not have occured to Aegnor. Down, dooby-doo, down-down, Breakin'-up is hard... to-oo-ooo do! Or - from the rest of the story, is this more like a 'break-up' or are we looking for a ' "let's just be friends" talk'? Those can be hard to bear as well.
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05-06-2004, 03:25 PM | #147 | |
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Quote:
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"Whither go you?" she said. "North away." he said: "to the swords, and the siege, and the walls of defence - that yet for a while in Beleriand rivers may run clean, leaves spring, and birds build their nests, ere Night comes." AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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05-06-2004, 03:27 PM | #148 |
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Anyway... makings of a GREAT tragic love story!
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05-06-2004, 03:29 PM | #149 | |
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Quote:
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"Whither go you?" she said. "North away." he said: "to the swords, and the siege, and the walls of defence - that yet for a while in Beleriand rivers may run clean, leaves spring, and birds build their nests, ere Night comes." AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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05-06-2004, 03:36 PM | #150 | |
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If someone lets you down and says that they don't love you... it hurts, but at least you can move on. It's harder to imagine ever 'moving on' if you knew that the person 'letting you down' loved you as you loved them. Perhaps Aegnor erred in his decision (and I see you point too SGH - about not wanting to 'get caught up in the moment' if they would meet again) - but if so, his error came from an imperfect knowledge by Elves of Humans. Wonder if Elvenkind 'took notes' on the outcome and would know to let humans down with a little 'talk' after THIS little episode.
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05-06-2004, 05:39 PM | #151 | |
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Quote:
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"Whither go you?" she said. "North away." he said: "to the swords, and the siege, and the walls of defence - that yet for a while in Beleriand rivers may run clean, leaves spring, and birds build their nests, ere Night comes." AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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05-07-2004, 01:58 AM | #152 | |||
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I also wonder how old (or young ) she was when they met. Andreth was about 48 years old when she talked to Finrod. The battle of Sudden Flame took place another 46 years later. So, from HER pov they could have spent many good years together, though they didn't know at the time how long the siege would last. Quote:
Quote:
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05-07-2004, 09:18 AM | #153 | |||
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Quote:
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"Whither go you?" she said. "North away." he said: "to the swords, and the siege, and the walls of defence - that yet for a while in Beleriand rivers may run clean, leaves spring, and birds build their nests, ere Night comes." AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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05-07-2004, 09:34 AM | #154 | ||
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Quote:
Quote:
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05-07-2004, 09:51 AM | #155 | |
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Quote:
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"Whither go you?" she said. "North away." he said: "to the swords, and the siege, and the walls of defence - that yet for a while in Beleriand rivers may run clean, leaves spring, and birds build their nests, ere Night comes." AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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05-07-2004, 10:05 AM | #156 | ||||
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
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05-07-2004, 10:10 AM | #157 | |
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05-07-2004, 10:24 AM | #158 | ||
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Quote:
Quote:
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"Whither go you?" she said. "North away." he said: "to the swords, and the siege, and the walls of defence - that yet for a while in Beleriand rivers may run clean, leaves spring, and birds build their nests, ere Night comes." AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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05-07-2004, 10:42 AM | #159 | |
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I was just THINKING Dorthonion was that (ED: mountainous) part of Beleriand north of Doriath (without checking a map - book at home) plus Beor's House was associated with Finrod, right? From the time they first met and Finrod sang and played his harp!
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05-07-2004, 10:47 AM | #160 |
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A stray thought here: I've heard often that Tolkien wrote about 'Beren and Luthien' to celebrate his own love with his wife Edith (including his views of her - putting her 'on a pedestal' so to speak, in making her an Elven princess). Was this perhaps reflective of any other situation in Tolkien's life? Perhaps one of his friends who died in the trenches of WW1 - and didn't make it back to the girl he loved? In this case, he'd be giving greater honor to the friend, making him a great Elf...
Just a thought. Nothing to go on - but that he likely wrote these things in the 1920's (right?) and the losses of his friends would still be quite fresh in his mind, I suppose.
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