07-07-2003, 02:09 AM | #141 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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07-07-2003, 02:14 AM | #142 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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07-07-2003, 02:18 AM | #143 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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I should be able to post every afternoon this week. And again, Lief was entirely correct to use the Bible in answering GrayMouser's (IIRC) question, since he was questioning the numbers given in .... the Bible.
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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07-07-2003, 02:28 AM | #144 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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(This subject might be dead now, but I"m just methodically working thru the thread. The Flood was a one-time catastrophic event (God said He would never flood the world like that again) with many important ramifications, and was not a mere ice-age meltdown. Again, answering a Biblical objection with a Biblical reference )
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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07-07-2003, 02:32 AM | #145 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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__________________
. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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07-07-2003, 02:34 AM | #146 | |
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
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Come back! Come back! To Mordor we will take you! "The only thing better than a great plan is implementing a great plan" - JerseyDevil "If everyone agreed with me all the time, everything would be just fine"- JerseyDevil AboutNewJersey.com New Jersey MessageBoard Another Tolkien Forum Memorial to the Twin Towers New Jersey Map Fellowship of the Messageboard Legend of the Jersey Devil Support New Jersey's Liberty Tower Peacefire.org AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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07-07-2003, 02:37 AM | #147 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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07-07-2003, 02:38 AM | #148 | |
Elf Lord
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Those were inventions. But judging by the rate with which we have invented things, (Before Christ, when our population was much less) inventions were taking place at a very rapid rate. Baskets also weren't an invention that happened once and then spread everywhere. They were developed all over the world. Painting style and the paints themselves, if the radiocarbon dates are correct (which there is strong evidence that they are not), would show that for 25,000 years there was no change in painting ability. So if you want to use paint as an example of man's ingenuity . . . (forgive me ) In any case, while I'll try to avoid belittling those inventions in making my point . . . it wouldn't take 2,000,000 years for those early inventions, and the other inventions, to take place. You know what Neanderthalls were capable of. Those were some of the earliest forms of humanoids. Judging by the awesome ingenuity humans have displayed over the past 5,000 years, and the skill and precision with which they operated 2,000,000 years ago, it is difficult to believe that those few discoveries were all that was made. The Neanderthalls seem to have been around as intelligent as humans. While agriculture might have been a limitation, your own evidence has demonstrated that plainly it wasn't that much of a limitation. You have shown yourself that 2 million years ago, men were just about as intelligent as we are now. We have seen within the last 5,000 years (since the beginning of writing) that we have awesome powers of learning and discovery, and even from scratch (the Aztecs, who, though they may have had agriculture in the start out, originally were slaves of the early tribes) can form awesome things. If men were that clever so long ago, then plainly technology should have been on their side. They had the time and skill- and the advantage of numbers. Since they had the time and skill, and could increase in numbers exponentially (as from mathematical data, we know they do) then there was no substantial limitation on their "spreading forth and inhabiting the world" as happened in the Bible, after Noah. A mess-up in dating is required by this change. There is strong evidence for a radiocarbon shift (see my notes on Page 2), which would have messed up the dating. Whether there are different dating problems for the fossils, I don't know, but it is plain that there are dating problems with those fossils. The mathematical problem with population growth rates further escalates the problem already demonstrated by lack of invention (which, as we know they can very definitely invent, IS lack of invention). So basically, we know men loved to learn and invent back then, and they love to learn and invent now. Within only a few thousand years, swords became outdated. Within only a few thousand years, horses became outdated. Within a few thousand years, ships have become outdated (we have planes). We have information that these were developments of recent man and were outdated by recent man. With recent man, we do have thousands of discoveries. With ancient man, we don't, despite his 2 million year skulking on the planet. So there lies the case, still unsolved. Cirdan, I'll have to open it to you to go after. If anyone else wants to come at it, they're welcome to. |
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07-07-2003, 02:40 AM | #149 | |
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Or at least we can have an interesting discussion on it
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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07-07-2003, 02:40 AM | #150 |
Elf Lord
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RÃ*an! I'm delighted to see you back . Glad to hear you had a pleasant July 4th, we did too. We're going through the series of video tapes, "Liberty," right now.
Wonderful thread you have created here . . . during my past four days off (this is the last of a four day weekend for us), I have taken immense enjoyment in debating with our friends here and learning from my necessary background research. It's been fun . Unfortunately, I'll have to get off for a week. Samwise will be leaving too, because she's going on vacation. So though we've been plowing along in the thread, we're going to have to leave it to you. Sorry for supporting you like this . I've got vast amounts of school work on school days. If I'm very, very lucky, I might be able to get on during one of the school days, but the likelihood of that is extremely small. |
07-07-2003, 02:44 AM | #151 |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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Thanks, Lief It's always a pleasure posting with you, you are both intelligent and polite I'll miss you and Samwise Check in when you can! Why are you having school now?
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
07-07-2003, 02:44 AM | #152 | |
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
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And Happy July 4th Rian. Believe it or not I don't dislike you - I just highly disagree with you on this topic.
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Come back! Come back! To Mordor we will take you! "The only thing better than a great plan is implementing a great plan" - JerseyDevil "If everyone agreed with me all the time, everything would be just fine"- JerseyDevil AboutNewJersey.com New Jersey MessageBoard Another Tolkien Forum Memorial to the Twin Towers New Jersey Map Fellowship of the Messageboard Legend of the Jersey Devil Support New Jersey's Liberty Tower Peacefire.org AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide Last edited by jerseydevil : 07-07-2003 at 02:47 AM. |
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07-07-2003, 02:48 AM | #153 | |
Elf Lord
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So please answer those posts, while not using that argument. The prophesies, the witnesses, and corroborative evidence, all needs to be answered and explained. Meanwhile, so do all the Christian experiences with Christ, and the fact that he manipulates their circumstances so completely. Just today, for example, I shot up a prayer asking the Lord for a sign of his power to make abrupt changes in physical things, as well as things in the spiritual realm. Of course, I have observed him make and fulfill multiple prophesies to me personally, and I have huge evidence in my 200 or so page spiritual journal, but I wanted a sign of his miraculous power. As soon as the car stopped and my Grandma and I stepped out, she started talking to me about God's power over physical things as well as spiritual things, and how she had received healing for my sister, and she knew my sister would be healed of her spine curvature. I have yet to see whether that comes about, but the immediate answer to prayer is merely one of dozens and dozens of such experiences. Other Christians have spoken of much more powerful things, and I could as well. Simply wanted to bring up today's . So there are huge amounts of things that rational explanations must be given for. RÃ*an, it might be better if you saved that line of discussion for the Offshoot thread. |
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07-07-2003, 02:49 AM | #154 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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07-07-2003, 02:50 AM | #155 | |
Elf Lord
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07-07-2003, 02:51 AM | #156 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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I would indeed like to discuss that on the Offshoot thread when we're done here, and I hope you can join us, Lief, along with JD and Ruinel and Hobbit, who have all brought up similar objections.
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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07-07-2003, 02:52 AM | #157 | |
Elf Lord
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07-07-2003, 02:54 AM | #158 | |
I am Freddie/UNDERCOVER/ Founder of The Great Continent of Entmoot
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Again - I don't have time to respond to your whole post. I will respnd to this though...
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Come back! Come back! To Mordor we will take you! "The only thing better than a great plan is implementing a great plan" - JerseyDevil "If everyone agreed with me all the time, everything would be just fine"- JerseyDevil AboutNewJersey.com New Jersey MessageBoard Another Tolkien Forum Memorial to the Twin Towers New Jersey Map Fellowship of the Messageboard Legend of the Jersey Devil Support New Jersey's Liberty Tower Peacefire.org AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide |
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07-07-2003, 02:56 AM | #159 | |
Elf Lord
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Oh, and thank-you very much for recommending "The Case for Christ" to me . Although I can't say that it's entirely because of you that I read it (it was required for my learning at the Wednesday youth group), you were an influence, and I'm recommending it to other Christians as well. |
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07-07-2003, 03:04 AM | #160 | ||
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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And no one ever commented on if they thought I was pretty or not ....
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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