Athrabeth Finrod Ah Andreth

[markedel]

To see more of numenorian and elvish friendship you can read aldarion and erendis

[BeardofPants]

Originally posted by Sister Golden Hair
BoP, you don't have to read them in order, because they don't all tie in together. For example, BoLTs 1 and 2 is the old mythology, then you have something like four books that are related to LotRs, and then you have Two books that are the Later Silmarillion. So it's not a big deal to do them in order.

Yes, I know that. But I want to. I'm not sure why you guys weren't sold on Lost Tales - I'm enjoying seeing where it all started; and if you guys found them boring, that only tells me that I have more to look forwards to! Of course, I haven't bought any of the Lord of the Rings histories yet, so I may yet skip them, and jump straight into the Later Silm. We'll see how burnt out I am after Lost Road.....

[Artanis]

Originally posted by Sister Golden Hair
About the feelings Elves had for Men. I think Finrod was more fond of Men then any other of the Eldar particularly because he was the first to meet them and sort of had a special bond with them. I think the Elves may have looked down on the race of Men for their mortality more then anything else. Later they just plain did not trust Men, especially after the Nirnaeth.

I agree with that. I also think they scorned them for their 'weakness', their tendency to readily be servants to Melkor, and later Sauron.

[Artanis]

BoP, the only reason I haven't bought Lost Tales is they were sold out. I'll buy them when the e-bookstore get them in again. In the meantime, there are 10 volumes on my desk waiting for me No, eleven, it's Letters too. My only problem is; when do I have time to read all this?

To see more of numenorian and elvish friendship you can read aldarion and erendis

For those who may wonder, the history of Aldarion and Erendis is in Unfinished Tales. Yes, it tells of the friendship between Numenoreans and the Elves in ME, but it's also a sad story of lost love, very different from Athrabeth. It is a story about a marriage that doesn't turn out very well. Could have happened today in fact. Recommended reading.

[Rían]

BoP - Morgoth's Ring ... Morgoth's Ring???? *heh heh* I was totally turned off to HoME, because the ones that I flipped through in the bookstore were filled with Trotter the Hobbit, which I found boring after a while. Then I found out about MR, WotJ, etc. I think you could probably skip around, too, as SGH said.

Lots of good comments, people - just had time for a quick read, through, and unfortunately I have to run off to work now. Hope to tune back in later tonight.

p.s. - Artanis, I sent you a PM a few days ago asking about your "little one" that is always up before 6 - do you have PM's enabled, or did you not know about them, or do you prefer not to get any PM's? (I didn't want to take up too much room on the thread with personal questions, although the radar part was fun!)

[Artanis]

I finally saw your PM RÃ*an, now you check yours.

[BeardofPants]

Originally posted by RÃ*an
BoP - Morgoth's Ring ... [i]Then I found out about MR, WotJ, etc. I think you could probably skip around, too, as SGH said.

*Shrug* I find the evolution of the stories very interesting, so as much as I'm eager to start on Morgoth's Ring, I'm also eager to read the rest as well. I'm thinking of skipping the LOTR histories and going to the later sil first, though. Don't worry, I'll be there in no time! Only taking about three days to get through the books: I'm one chapter short of finishing BoLT II, and then it's the lays!

[Sister Golden Hair]

Originally posted by BeardofPants
*Shrug* I find the evolution of the stories very interesting, so as much as I'm eager to start on Morgoth's Ring, I'm also eager to read the rest as well. I'm thinking of skipping the LOTR histories and going to the later sil first, though. Don't worry, I'll be there in no time! Only taking about three days to get through the books: I'm one chapter short of finishing BoLT II, and then it's the lays!

I think you'll really like the Lay of Lethien. Good stuff.

[Rían]

Originally posted by markedel
To see more of numenorian and elvish friendship you can read aldarion and erendis

That must be it - I've read it, and I guess I was thinking about those men when I was surprised by the elvish attitude. But I guess the Finrod comment was way before them. BTW, are there any good timelines around with First and Second age events? It's hard to piece one together. I like ones like the Third age one in the appendix at the end of RoTK - nice and straightforward.

BTW #2, does anyone else just want to grab Aldarion and Erendis and haul them over to a marriage counselor, or is it just me? Their daughter sure got hurt by the whole thing interesting but very sad story...

Also, I had forgotten about the tendency of men to fight upon both sides, as Artanis mentioned.

[Artanis]

Originally posted by RÃ*an
BTW, are there any good timelines around with First and Second age events? It's hard to piece one together. I like ones like the Third age one in the appendix at the end of RoTK - nice and straightforward.

There is also a SA timeline in the RoTK appendix, don't you like that one? I don't remember whether there is a FA timeline there.

The Athrabeth sure takes place way before the tale of Aldarion and Erendis. Finrod dies in the First Age, and Aldarion and Erendis live in Numenor in the Second Age.

[Rían]

Yes, but the SA timeline in RoTK isn't detailed enough for me - I want day-by-day, like the TA one!

Yes, I suppose when Finrod was talking, the elves hadn't been in contact with men all that long (in elvish time, at least), and were also in contact with "lesser" men, too. And men weren't all that powerful yet, either.

[Sister Golden Hair]

Yes, I suppose when Finrod was talking, the elves hadn't been in contact with men all that long (in elvish time, at least), and were also in contact with "lesser" men, too. And men weren't all that powerful yet, either.

Well, doesn't Finrod say in the begining of the Athrabeth that it had been something like a hundred years or so since he had met Beor and now he, and his sons, and his sons sons had died, but he says it seemed a short time to him, telling Andreth that the passing of her people seemed swift. Also, the Silmarillion says that before Finrod met Men, they had only met the Dark Elves in the wild lands, and that the Edain were the first to come into Beleriand. When Beor died in Nargothrond, he was 93. At the end of that chapter it says that the Edain learned swiftly from the Eldar all that they could and surpassed all others of Mankind that still dwelt east of the mountains and had not looked into the faces that had beheld the light of Valinor.

I hate trying to figure out timelines.

[Rían]

Me, too - I like them all nice and laid out for me. I'm too lazy to do one myself.

[Artanis]

Eärniel, have you started reading?

[Earniel]

Well.... I couldn't help myself. I started reading BOLT first. I know it doesn't really matter in which order I read them but it just didn't seem right to start Morgoth's Ring right away. They were standing next to one another on my shelf (they're the only books I got from HOME so far) and I spend a quarter standing before it doubting, biting my nails indecisively and wondering which one to read first. I know, I'm pathetic.

[BeardofPants]

Originally posted by Eärniel
...and wondering which one to read first. I know, I'm pathetic.

I did the same thing. Now I've decided to read them in order and not skip to Morgoth's ring.... I think. I WAS going to skip the LOTR histories, but now that I've just finished reading Turin version #213452523 I think I'm about ready for a break from the first age.

[Lefty Scaevola]

Originally posted by BeardofPants
but now that I've just finished reading Turin version #213452523

LOL!!!!, You could stand it a little better if he was not such self centered boor in all the versions.

[Rían]

Eärniel and BoP - You guys are funny! What a happy dilemma to be in, though - I just have Bolt 2 and Morgoth's ring out of the HoME Series...

Well, SGH and I think we've probably just about picked this one apart, so maybe you can just resurrect this thread when you have waded through the other HoME books and reached M's Ring, and I'll peek back in. Unless Artanis has anything else to say....

BoP - shall I PM you with the answer to what Morgoth's ring is, or do you want to find out yourself? (And Eärniel, too, if you're interested).

SGH - there are so many people here reading the HoME books now, and the ME forum is really crowded - do you think it would be a good idea to start a new forum, something like "Other JRR Tolkien writings" that would be any of his writings besides Hobbit, LoTR and Sil? I know someone has brought up the Letters of JRR Tolkien thread, and that could also go in that forum.

[Sister Golden Hair]

Originally posted by BeardofPants
I did the same thing. Now I've decided to read them in order and not skip to Morgoth's ring.... I think. I WAS going to skip the LOTR histories, but now that I've just finished reading Turin version #213452523 I think I'm about ready for a break from the first age.

Well you two, if you are going to read the HoMe in order, it may take a while before we will be able to discuss Morgoth's Ring with you. I may be senile by then. Have a good time though, they are great reads.

[Sister Golden Hair]

Originally posted by RÃ*an


SGH - there are so many people here reading the HoME books now, and the ME forum is really crowded - do you think it would be a good idea to start a new forum, something like "Other JRR Tolkien writings" that would be any of his writings besides Hobbit, LoTR and Sil? I know someone has brought up the Letters of JRR Tolkien thread, and that could also go in that forum.

Well, a long time ago, before I was a staff member I had suggested a HoMe forum. Ben thinks the Middle-earth forum is adequate and now that I moderate, I don't see a real problem with crowding. It seems to workout ok. Besides, when the movie comes out in December this forum will probably slow down a bit and the movie forum will pick up along with the LotRs book forum.