09-10-2005, 11:51 PM | #81 |
of the House of Fëanor
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What are you doing here, Lief? Shoo! Shoo! Go back to the theology threads, this is out of your jurisdiction here!!!
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Few people have the imagination for reality.
~Johann Wolfgang von Goethe |
09-11-2005, 12:00 AM | #82 |
Elf Lord
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(Sticks out a meter long tongue)
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If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
09-11-2005, 12:25 AM | #83 |
Elf Lord
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Aw, Lief, don't be so crude! Just remind them that THEOLOGY is the queen of the sciences and philosophy is jealous!
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Inked "Aslan is not a tame lion." CSL/LWW "The new school [acts] as if it required...courage to say a blasphemy. There is only one thing that requires real courage to say, and that is a truism." GK Chesterton "And there is always the danger of allowing people to suppose that our modern times are so wholly unlike any other times that the fundamental facts about man's nature have wholly changed with changing circumstances." Dorothy L. Sayers, 1 Sept. 1941 |
09-11-2005, 12:43 AM | #84 |
Elf Lord
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About tongues
I might remind you that you just stuck your tongue out at me , Mr. Pot .
What person can change the size of his tongue?
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If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
09-11-2005, 12:48 AM | #85 |
Elf Lord
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The Toad, as I recall, from the X-men! (Hey, wait, isn't X=Christian? What's up with that? ) No, there's Dudley after the Ton-tongue Toffee in HP!
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Inked "Aslan is not a tame lion." CSL/LWW "The new school [acts] as if it required...courage to say a blasphemy. There is only one thing that requires real courage to say, and that is a truism." GK Chesterton "And there is always the danger of allowing people to suppose that our modern times are so wholly unlike any other times that the fundamental facts about man's nature have wholly changed with changing circumstances." Dorothy L. Sayers, 1 Sept. 1941 Last edited by inked : 09-11-2005 at 12:50 AM. |
09-11-2005, 12:52 AM | #86 |
Elf Lord
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And there's the character I'm currently playing on the RPG forum. I was pretending to be him, with the tongue thing. Lotesse and I are in the same RPG at present, and I've been criticized some about my character, so I was teasing her .
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If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
09-11-2005, 08:57 AM | #87 | |
"The Bomb"
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Quote:
I guess I don't understand the question.
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Could it be that one path to enlightenment leads through insanity? |
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09-11-2005, 10:17 AM | #88 |
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Lotesse, you may wish to not read this post. I love analyzing and discussing/debating, but I know you don't, so just to be merciful on yourself, you may wish to not attempt following my train of thought .
Bombadillo, in trying to define meaning, here are some of the words that immediately come to my mind. Purpose. Relevance. Impact. Importance. I can't see how meaninglessness fulfills any of these. Impact is the only one a non-believer can hope for, and even then it is only hope. As Solomon said in Ecclesiasties 9:15, "I saw a wise man who through his wisdom saved a city, yet no one remembered him." Give a generation or two, and this applies to most people. I can remember my grandparents, but my great grandparents little, and my great great grandparents not at all. Impact can still be sometimes felt through the works of one's hands. If one president focuses on improving the environment, he can end his term pleased that he has succeeded in something good. However, the president that comes after him may tear down all the works of his hands in a second. The same can happen for most good works. Only of the pyramids can one truly argue differently. In view of all this, I think that meaninglessness hardly offers meaning.
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If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
09-11-2005, 12:14 PM | #89 | |
of the House of Fëanor
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Quote:
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Few people have the imagination for reality.
~Johann Wolfgang von Goethe Last edited by Lotesse : 09-11-2005 at 12:41 PM. |
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09-11-2005, 01:08 PM | #90 |
An enigma in a conundrum
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The wise man says, "you can't handle the meaning of life"
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Vizzini: "HE DIDN'T FALL?! INCONCEIVABLE!!" Inigo: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
09-11-2005, 01:48 PM | #91 | |
Elf Lord
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Quote:
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If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
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09-12-2005, 04:15 AM | #92 | |
Elf Lord
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Nothing could be further from the truth. If a believer believes in something which is false, then not only have they missed the point of existence but they've wasted their time with an elaborate delusion. Consider a beautiful garden. Is it not enough to experience, enjoy and nurture its beauty without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it? This is the fallacy of religious belief: it artificially separates the physical world from the spiritual. Material things are "downgraded". Suffering, disease, poverty etc are mere fleeting distractions from the real stuff, which is the hereafter. We see ourselves as separate from our environment To me, life is meaningless in an objective sense. However, it is all about the construction and experience of subjective meaning which is intimately tied to making sense of the physical world we live in. Religious belief is a cop-out and distraction from what really matters. Here's an interesting essay about the consequences of religious belief (as we currently practice it) upon our environment: http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/st...566820,00.html |
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09-12-2005, 04:10 PM | #93 | ||
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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Interesting thread! I was the second poster on it, back when Millane started it. I miss him! IMO, he was a very clear thinker.
Perhaps it might be useful to have us define what we mean by "philosophy". The definitions that interest me the most are the first and second one in my dictionary: Quote:
Quote:
(does that make sense? ) (and Lotesse - I'm sure Lief wasn't patronizing you, altho I can see how you took it that way - he wasn't saying that you couldn't follow his train of thought, he was saying that he thought you wouldn't wish to, and he's prob. right, right?) Now I have a lot of philosophical #2 sense type comments to make on Gaffer's post, but I have to work on the candy sale some more first...
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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09-12-2005, 04:12 PM | #94 |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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and Bomb, could you please elaborate on your beauty statement?
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
09-12-2005, 04:34 PM | #95 | |
Advocatus Diaboli
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Quote:
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
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09-12-2005, 04:46 PM | #96 | |||||
Advocatus Diaboli
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he really had a great way of addressing the basic points in life and how they tie in the the multitude of belief systems that exist in our world a few great quotes by campbell... Quote:
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
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09-12-2005, 05:03 PM | #97 | ||
Friendly Neigborhood Sith Lord
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The meaning of life, the universe, everything is .... 42 according to douglas adams one of the funniest authors i ever read
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I was Press Secretary for the Berlioz administration and also, but not limited to, owner and co operator of fully armed and operational battle station EDDIE Quote:
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09-13-2005, 12:20 AM | #98 | ||||
Elf Lord
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Quote:
Quote:
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Look at Operation Blessing's (Pat Robertson's organization) outreach to the hurricane victims of Katrina. Look at how Christians and many caring people of other religions respond swiftly and compassionately to those in need. These are people that do believe in an afterlife. This belief does not involve declaring the material to be irrelevant, but rather gives a new purpose to our behavior in this world. We don't downgrade the evils of life, but rather refuse to admit that that's all there is. While we experience fully the horrible things, we (we including people from just about all major religions) see beyond them. Quote:
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If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
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09-13-2005, 03:08 AM | #99 |
Elf Lord
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Thanks for replying, Lief.
I agree that many of the greatest moralists have been religious, and that Jesus was probably the greatest of them all. I also agree that religion can be a great force for good in the world. I was trying to show you how lack of belief does not necessarily imply that existence is pointless: if anything, it's the other way around because it's up to us as individuals to do what's right. |
09-13-2005, 09:28 AM | #100 | ||
Advocatus Diaboli
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Quote:
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
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