04-07-2003, 01:55 AM | #81 |
Incharge: neighbourhood security
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my neighbour's Dog is as evil as evil can be. He has bitten my mom once. really nasty bite.
I would still agree with animals having littel to do with feeelings, and the emotion of evil too strong for them to comprehend and muster. But i tell you, that neighbour of mine, trains his dog, as if it was a war machine. You should look at his teeth. his paws, and claws. And the eyes, they are like two tiny volcanoes fuming with lava. He barks the hell outta him evrytime he sees me. In my opinion, I dont think you have to be evil to commit bad acts like this stupid dog. you can just as be cruel as any evil person if you have a BAD TRAINER!
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04-07-2003, 02:05 AM | #82 |
Elf Lord
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Oh yes, I don't think any of us are coming from the position that any of us are in the start-out better than any others of us.
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04-07-2003, 02:31 AM | #83 | ||
Elf Lord
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Alas, that's about as far as we've gotten so far, where we're all in agreement . Quote:
He could say, "you can't do that, that's wrong." I might say, "Why is it wrong?" "Well," he might answer, "would you want me to kill you? It's just the same." And I could answer, "I don't care whether you might kill me- it doesn't affect me at the moment. I'm the one holding the gun." I've ignored my morals, then. Morals should be followed because it's right to follow them. "Why is it right?" "Because it makes everybody happier if we follow them." "But why is making everybody happier right? It doesn't make me happier in the short term." "Because it's best that everyone be happy." "But if I'm just an animal and morals are things that we choose to have, why can't I just forego those when I want to?" "Because it's wrong for others that you should do so." You see, there is no real reason why we should follow these morals, because they go in a loop. Morals are right, because they make everyone happy and do everyone good. But if people are just creatures, they have no reason to care about other people's feelings. Therefore we must ask yourselves, what is right? Why do we, and why should we follow it? |
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04-07-2003, 03:00 AM | #84 | |||||||
Corruptor
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IMO we base our perceptions of good & evil on our own experience. What might be 'evil' in my eyes would be totally acceptable to others (or vice versa).
This leads me to question whether or not there is ABSOLUTE good and ABSOLUTE evil. Or are there varying degrees of the two based on circumstances surrounding the events (presuming of course that we are referring to deeds / events which would be the physical manifistation of the thoughts)? And in fact, are the thoughts not as bad as the actions themselves? Even if we can hide those from other people, surely we cannot hide them from our Gods? And do the gods not also take into account the purity of thought (seeing how thought necessarily leads to action (or the lack thereof) in the case of human beings, after all that is one of the things that seperates us from the animals - the ability to rationalise & decide which actions to take rather than depend on instinct)? If in fact there are varying degrees of good & evil, or the classification of the two depends on individual recognition thereof, who's good & evil should we use as guidelines for the "after life" (if in fact that does exist)? Quote:
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04-07-2003, 03:16 AM | #85 | |
the Shrike
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04-07-2003, 03:24 AM | #86 | |
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Don't wet yourself with excitement. Last edited by Baby-K : 04-07-2003 at 03:29 AM. |
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04-07-2003, 03:45 AM | #87 |
the Shrike
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No, I don't think it makes them evil, because "evil" is a human construct. I was just asserting that animals DO kill beyond necessity.
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"Binary solo! 0000001! 00000011! 0000001! 00000011!" ~ The Humans are Dead, Flight of the Conchords |
04-07-2003, 09:16 AM | #88 | |
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
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BTW, it sounds to me like you're saying there's nothing wrong with a woman doing this. Are you? I don't remember specifics, except those. But I seem to remember a case of a grizzly, though that's all I remember as far as specifics goes.
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04-07-2003, 09:44 AM | #89 | |
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Please note the use of the term you in no way means to implicate Gwaimer Windgem as a rapist or anything of the sort, it was used in a general sense, referring to the excuses often used by men. Oh & GW - if it was not so that women had the right to say no when they no longer feel safe, the problem of date rape would never have been identified & no steps would have been taken to ensure that women can lay charges against guys like that (who commit date rape).
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Don't wet yourself with excitement. |
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04-07-2003, 09:53 AM | #90 | |||
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
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Don't "necessarily" think it's right? If she does that, then most likely she is toying with him, basically seeing how far she can push him, using him as a toy. Of course, not all of the time would this be the case, but more often than not.
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Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle |
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04-07-2003, 10:13 AM | #91 | ||||
Corruptor
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Do you realise that that is exactly the sentiment that has prevented women the world over from reporting rapes etc, because rape is the only crime in the world where the victim is put on trial rather than the perpetrator? Such ideas doesn't really help with the irradication of these crimes. Would you sentence a man who only raped one woman (after a few drinks together) to fewer years in jail than a guy who raped 3 women? If so, why - is the one's future more important than the other? If the woman is a thriving member of society & positively contributes to the country's economy etc. should her rapist be treated with respect and given a lighter sentence, just because she might have flirted a bit too much? Quote:
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04-07-2003, 10:52 AM | #92 |
Queen of Nargothrond
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Is there such a thing as "justifiable evil" Can you commit evil intentionally to further a cause for a greater good?
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04-07-2003, 11:28 AM | #93 |
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
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Sorry, gotta run to work, can't reply, will try when get home.
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Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle |
04-07-2003, 12:27 PM | #94 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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I think GW brings up very good point, altho it is probably rather politically uncorrect - and yes, folks, he said, and I say, that rape is ALWAYS WRONG!!! - but the girls/women that lead a guy on are in the wrong, too, because it's selfishly using someone else for your own pleasure. There's a Bible verse about this idea somewhere, tho I can't recall it at the moment. And of course the 'positive' verse about this whole thing is:
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! Last edited by Rían : 04-07-2003 at 12:28 PM. |
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04-07-2003, 12:30 PM | #95 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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Quick answer would be 'absolutely not', but modified by 'things aren't always as black-and-white as we would like them to be' ... rats! *takes 2 more aspirin*
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! Last edited by Rían : 04-07-2003 at 12:31 PM. |
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04-07-2003, 01:37 PM | #96 | |
Quasi Evil
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"People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." |
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04-07-2003, 01:49 PM | #97 | |
Quasi Evil
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But anyway what i was getting at was that "morals" as we call them are simply the reflection of our instincts against killing (and other things) because A) its just plain dangerous to kill another living creature and B) its setting a real bad precedent within a species and C) it takes away from the altruistic benefit of being a social species which is a big factor in the survival of our genes - and that people is what its all about. Of course as I said above this hinges all on the fact that you can accept evolution as a tool in our formation. I know for a number of you this is not an option you will entertain because of the limits of the rules of your religion so perhaps this is as far as we can go with it.
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"People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." Last edited by Insidious Rex : 04-07-2003 at 01:51 PM. |
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04-07-2003, 02:27 PM | #98 | ||
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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In my opinion, IR, YOU (and others who believe that the theory of evolution is correct in its current form) are limited by what the THEORY of evolution asserts! (on some very doubtful evidence, IMO). But I'll do you the courtesy of assuming that you have brought your intelligence to bear on the question of whether or not it appears to be a valid theory, and have come to the conclusion that it IS, IYO. Perhaps you didn't mean it that way, IR, but I just really get irritated when Christians are perceived as putting their brains aside when their religious beliefs are involved - we DON"T!! (at least I don't, and the Christians I see represented on this thread don't, IMO).
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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04-07-2003, 03:42 PM | #99 | |
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
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2) Respectfully disagree. 3) Not necessarily. Maybe your brain doesn't work. I know mine doesn't. 4) Agree. 5) No comment, for whatever reason...
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Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle |
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04-07-2003, 03:52 PM | #100 | |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Not where I want to be ...
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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