06-16-2006, 05:03 PM | #81 | |
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Below I put some additions to that list. Let me opinionate on most important first. Most important is to create a good survey and position the pieces in time. At the library, do some taste testing as follows:
Start with the pre-Renaissance and the Troubadors and find which of those you like. Read the liner notes, of course. For me this turned up several compilation albums of merit, like the David Munrow albums. Eventually I came to realize what Guilaume de Machaut had done for humanity when he wrote that huge (for it's day) Mass in counterpoint, of all things. Then move to the full Rennaissance. It's possible to get lost there, so beware. At one end you have Dufay and Binchois. At the other you have Monteverdi. In the middle, there are a host of great forgotten composers. My personal favorite in the middle there is Josquin Des Prez. Then we get on to the Baroque. It's easy to confuse the early Baroque like Heinrich Schutz with the late Baroque like Buxtehude and Bach. If you think of them as totally different times, you'd probably do better. Vivaldi, Scarlatti, Frescobaldi, they all come out of the Monteverdian idea of a composer who is both secular and sacred. Bach comes later. Bach is my favorite composer. 'Nuff said? Then Classical. Well, Handel comes before Haydn and Mozart, and so it's not really fair to hold him up to them. In fact, he's kind of a contemporary of Bach so he was actually ahead of his time. Rossini is dated in the Romantic era, but musically he's classical. So then, and only then, play Beethoven. See, if you do all that before you hear Beethoven, you might find your jaw on the floor when the symphony is over. Then note that Schubert was a contemporary living in another city who died yound, and in that light, you see, Schubert is kind of the last classical composer. And then when you proceed the the middle Romantic era... Brahms, Schumann, Verdi, Berlioz, Tchaikofsky, Saint-Saens you have some way to compare. The Late Romantic works take their cue from Wagner. Bruckner's later pieces, and Mahler's Symphonies were unabashedly influenced by Wagner. Then comes post-Romanticism like Ravel, Debussy, Bartok, Stravinsky, etc. By that point you'll probably be ready to argue with Schoenberg, Berg, and Webern. And you might find you disagree with me about the direction of music after that. Personally, I stick with Britten and Vaugh Williams and avoid any atonal pieces or minimalism. But to each his own. Quote:
The dude also forget string quartets and other chamber pieces. none of the Adams Bach: St Matthew Passion (one of my desert island discs) Bach: Art of the Fugue, played on organ by Helmut Walcha none of the Barber Bartok: 6 String Quartets Beethoven: Missa Solemnis Beethoven: The Late Quartets Beethoven: The Complete Piano Sonatas (any opus number above 100 is essential!) Berlioz: Harold in Italy Berlioz: The Damnation of Faust Brahms: Double Concerto Brahms: Violin Concerto Brahms: Piano Quintet in Fm Britten: War Requiem Britten: er... um... that Good Samaritan piece (don't get old! hehehe) Bruckner: Symphony #9 not the Copland, puhlease... Debussy: Piano pieces, any and all! Debussy: Three Nocturnes Debussy: Jeux Poeme Danse Debussy: String Quartet not the Elgar, good gracious... Haydn: The Creation Liszt: Piano Concerto Mahler: Symphony of a Thousand (#8) Mozart: wow, so little Mozart there... first, The Clarinet Concerto Mozart: Piano Concerto #25 Mozart: The Haydn Quartets Mozart: Sonatas for Piano, played by Brendel on pianoforte, if you can still get that. Prokofiev: Lt. Kije Suite Prokofiev: Piano pieces like Sonatas, etc. He was a piano master. none of the Rachmaninoff, unless you need something to play when you have a girl over for dinner. ditch the Bolero, too Ravel: Piano Concerto for Left Hand Ravel: String Quartet Ravel: Tsigane Rossini... his contribution wasn't "overtures", but if you must have him, get a record of arias by a good soprano Schubert: Piano Sonata in C Schubert: Songs, there are several collections of them. It's what he did to buy food. These songs can sooth when nothing else will. why ANY J. Strauss? and why so much R. Strauss? All you need is Til Eugenspeigel and Zarathustra. But if you really like him, get some Wagner! Verdi: a good collection of overtures. Verdi operas that are core: Rigoletto, La Traviata, Il Trovatore OK, now I will add some guys. Bellini: a collection of arias Binchois: probably will have to stick with a selection on a renaissance compilation Bocherini: Cello Concerto Buxtehude: Organ music, if J.S. Bach would WALK 75 MILES to hear it, it had to belong on this list! Dowland: Lute Music, try to find it played on lute, not guitar. Bream plays him. Dufay: maybe you can find him on the same disk as Binchois Dukas: if you like the lighter stuff, then get the Sorceror's Apprentice Faure: Requiem Franck: Organ Music Gershwin: Rhapsody in Blue Gershwin: Porgy and Bess Gounod: Romeo and Juliette Gregory: well, he only wrote it down, but you have to have some chant, it's the only music there was for hundreds of years. Josquin (De Prez): Missa Ave Maris Stella Josquin (De Prez): Marian Motets Leoncavallo: I Pagliacci (it changed opera) Machaut: Mass Monteverdi: Madrigals (he invented opera!) Monteverdi: The Coronation of the Pope Palestrina: Song of Songs Part: Passio Puccini: La Boheme Scarlatti, D.: Sonatas (some of the earliest ever) Sor: Guitar pieces (played by Segovia, of course!) Szymanofsky: Symphony #2 Vaughn Williams: Dona Nobis Pacem Vaughn Williams: A Sea Symphony Villa-Lobos: Guitar pieces (again, played by Segovia!) Wolf: Songs (there are only two record's full, he died young) |
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06-16-2006, 05:11 PM | #82 |
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by the way, that was from memory, so forgive any lapses. If we had a saturday, I could walk you through all that with audio examples
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06-16-2006, 08:47 PM | #83 | |
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Wow...thanks...I will now begin to digest all your information
I agree on throwing out Adams, adding Vaughan Williams...I love a bunch of those guys. I'm taking an opera course starting in July--and so will understand that a lot better then. That's one thing I'll wait on. And organ--As I'm an organist (and soon to be organ major), I'm sure I'll wind up with plenty. Quote:
Anyone listen to the Vaughan Williams' Oboe Concerto? I love that piece.
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06-16-2006, 08:52 PM | #84 | ||||
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Quote:
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06-19-2006, 07:09 PM | #85 | |
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Quote:
Hector's horrible but friendly criticism: 1) Poppea is NOT "Pope", it is simply: Poppea, a name. Rem that "pope" in italian (even old italian) is "Pape" A more accurate (and smart alecky) translation of "L'incoronazzion de Poppea" would be "The Throne-usurping Poppea". 2) J.Strauss is worth having, but only as much as the rest of his family. Get a disc or two, but really no more is needed. 3)Nothing wrong with Elgar or Copland. 4)Elfhelm left out two major Berlioz items: the Requiem, and Les Troyens. And even the Te Deum is essential if you're going to have Monteverdi as well... 5) Here's some essential Barber, which you might even find all on one dis: Adagio, Violin Concerto, Knoxville (which is truly his best work IMO, so much better that the overrated Adagio and Symphonies). 6) Monteverdi's Vespro della Beat Vergine, needed.
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06-19-2006, 07:19 PM | #86 | |
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AMEN! here too... And I actually did but the VW Oboe Concerto...EMI/Vernon Handley. Excellent stuff, and I like the "Partita for strings" a lot too... Btw, RVW's Festival Te Deum is wonderful also...imposing organ accompaniment you'll love too...
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06-19-2006, 07:25 PM | #87 | |
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Quote:
not only the "Reformation" but the overtures "Hebrides" "Ruy Blas" "Calm Sea&Prosperous voyage", as well as his Third and Fourth Quartets... Well, Messiaen should be JUST as represented as Barber Penguin Guide is nothing compared. I've looked through the penguin guide, and it is muddle in comparison with the Gramophone guide.
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06-19-2006, 07:43 PM | #88 |
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Btw,
Added: Isaac: Sacred music Vaughn Williams: Oboe Concerto/Partita f. Strings Vaughn Williams: Hymns and Choral Music Chopin: The Piano Sonatas/Leif Ove Andsnes Did you guys read my list of women composers?
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06-20-2006, 06:11 PM | #89 | |
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Quote:
I can't believe I left out the Requiem! What a thrill to sing. Didn't know that about Poppea. Guess I should have read the liner notes! hehe |
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06-21-2006, 02:23 PM | #90 | |
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Alright people: here's what's coming my way. Shostakovich: Symphony No.4/ Sir Simon Rattle even though I have Haitink's version in a copied disc, there's so many things wrong with it I just hate to listen to the messed up transition from track one to two...and this Rattle performance was recommended over Haintink's in the guide....I still love Haitink's though...perhaps the rattle will be better or worse. Shostakovich: Symphony No.10/Herbert von Karajan unusual conductor for this music, but apperantly this has been a classic for years. I've never heard Shosty's no.10, so I'm really looking forward to this... Shostakovich: Symphony No.11/Mstislav Rostropovich I actually almost bought this at Borders once. But Buxtehude, Reger organ music and Penderecki's "St Luke Passion" swayed me... Also recommended by the guide, naturally, as well as the Karajan above...
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06-21-2006, 04:00 PM | #91 |
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hm... three Shostakovich symphonies. Maybe the J. Strauss has a purpose after all!!! You'll need some bonbons after those huge depressing works.
Actually, I don't have 11. I should look into it. I have HvK's 10th. I agree it's the best. They remastered it, so you'll probably see an ADD on the CD. I've never heard the un-re-mastered one, but my friend who lives a few thousand miles away says his old record sounds better. And if you don't want that Haitink, I'll take it. (j/k) I agree with your choice of the Rattle, but a lot of people say the Haitink is great. btw, cool that you are a DS fan. he's...er... not for everybody. But my wife and I both love him. |
06-21-2006, 06:07 PM | #92 |
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An updated list. Somethings are individual pieces I want, just because I do--not because they are the foundations for a good collection
------------------- Albinoni: Oboe Concertos Bach: Art of the Fugue Bach: B-minor Mass Bach: Brandenburg Concertos Bach: Goldberg Variations Bach: Orchestral Suite no. 3 Bach: St. Matthew’s Passion Barber: Adagio for Strings Barber: First and Second Essays Barber: Knoxville, Summer of 1915 Barber: Medea’s Meditation and Dance of Vengeance Barber: Overture to The School for Scandal Barber: Symphony no. 1 Barber: Adagio Barber: Violin Concerto Bartók: Concerto for Orchestra Bartók: Divertimento for Strings Bartók: Miraculous Mandarin Suite Bartók: Music for Strings, Percussion and Celesta Bartók: Romanian Dances Bartók: Six String Quartets Beethoven: Missa Solemnis Beethoven: Piano Concerto no. 5 Beethoven: Symphonies no. 3, 5, 7, & 9 Beethoven: The Complete Piano Sonatas Beethoven: The Late Quartets Beethoven: Violin Concerto in D major Bellini: Arias Berg: Violin Concerto Berlioz: Harold in Italy Berlioz: Roman Carnival Overture Berlioz: Symphonie fantastique Berlioz: The Damnation of Faust Berlioz: Requiem Bernstein: Symphonic Dances from West Side Story Biber: Sonatas “Rosary” for Violin and Continuo Binchois: Bizet: Carmen Suites 1 & 2 Bloch: Concerto Grosso no. 1 Bocherini: Cello Concerto Bocherini: Quintets for Guitar and Strings Bodorové: Judas Maccabeus Brahms: Double Concerto Brahms: Piano Quintet in F minor Brahms: Symphonies no. 1, 2, 3, & 4 Brahms: Violin Concerto Britten: A Ceremony of Carols Britten: Cantata Misericordium Britten: Six Metamorphoses after Ovid Britten: War Requiem Britten: Young Person’s Guide to the Orchestra Bruckner: Symphonies no. 3 & 5 Buxtehude: Copland: Appalachian Spring Copland: Fanfare for the Common Man Corelli: Concerto Grossi Op. 6 Corigliano: Symphony no. 1 Couperin: Mass for the Monasteries Couperin: Mass for the Parishes Debussy: Jeux Poeme Danse Debussy: La Mer Debussy: Piano works Debussy: Prelude to the Afternoon of a Faun Debussy: String Quartet Debussy: Three Nocturnes Dowland: Lute music Dufay: Dvořák: Cello Concerto in B minor Dvořák: Serenade for Strings in E major Dvořák: Serenade in E-flat major Dvořák: Symphony no. 9 (New World) Elgar: Enigma Variations Falla: Three Cornered Hat: Three Dances Faure: Requiem Franck: Organ music Franck: Symphony in D minor Gershwin: American in Paris Gershwin: An American in Paris Gershwin: Piano Concerto in F Gershwin: Porgy & Bess Gershwin: Rhapsody in Blue Gorecki: Symphony no. 3 Gounod: Romeo and Juliette Gregory: Chant Grieg: Peer Gynt Suite no.1 Grieg: Piano Concerto in A minor Handel: Concerto Grosso Handel: Messiah Handel: Water Music Haydn: London Symphonies Haydn: Symphony no. 104 in D major Haydn: Symphony no. 94 (Surprise) Haydn: The Creation Hindemith: Mathis der Maler Symphony Holst: The Planets Ives: Symphony no. 2 Ives: The Unanswered Question Janáček: Taras Bulba Josquin (De Prez): Marian Motets Josquin (De Prez): Missa Ave Maris Stella Kodaly: Dances of Galanta Kodaly: Peacock Variations Leoncavallo: I Pagliacci Liszt: Hungarian Rhapsody no. 2 Liszt: Piano Concerto Mahler: Rückertlieder Mahler: Symphonies no. 1, 2, 4, 5, 8 & 9 Mendelssohn: Symphony no. __ Mendelssohn: Symphony no. 3 (Scottish) Mendelssohn: Symphony no. 4 (Italian) Mendelssohn: Symphony no. 5 (Reformation) Messaien: Milhaud: Chamber Music Monteverdi: Madrigals Monteverdi: L'incoronazzion de Poppea Monteverdi: Vespro della Beat Vergine Mozart: Oboe Concerto Mozart: Piano Concerto in C minor Mozart: Piano Concerto no. 21 Mozart: Piano Concerto No. 25 Mozart: Sonatas for Piano Mozart: Symphony no. 40 in G minor Mozart: The Haydn Quartets Mozart: Violin Concerto no. 5 in A major Mussorgsky-Ravel: Pictures at an Exhibition Nielsen: Symphony no. 3 (Sinfonia espansiva) Nielsen: Symphony no. 4 (The Inextinguishable) Orff: Carmina Burana Palestrina: Song of Songs Part: Part: Passio Poulenc: Chamber music Prokofiev: Lt. Kije Suite Prokofiev: Piano Sonatas Prokofiev: Romeo and Juliet Prokofiev: Scythian Suite Prokofiev: Symphony no. 1 (Classical) Prokofiev: Symphony no. 5 Purcell: Dido and Aeneas Purcell: Trio Sonatas for Strings and Continuo Rachmaninoff: Piano Concerto no. 2 & 3 Rachmaninoff: Rhapsody on a Theme of Paganini Rachmaninoff: Symphonic Dances Rautavaara: Cantus Arcticus Ravel: Daphnis and Chloé Ravel: La Valse Ravel: Piano Concerto for Left Hand Ravel: Rhapsodie espagnole Ravel: String Quartet Ravel: Tsigane Reicha: Wind Quintets Respighi: Fountains of Rome Rimsky-Korsakov: Capriccio Espagnol Rimsky-Korsakov: Sheherazade Rodrigo: Concierto de Aranjuez Rossini: Operas Rutter: Requiem Saint-Saëns: Carnival of the Animals Scarlatti, D.: Sonatas Schoenberg: Gurrelieder Schoenberg: Verklärte Nacht Schubert: Piano Sonata in C Schubert: Songs Schubert: Symphony no. 5 in B-flat major Schubert: Symphony no. 8 Schumann: Symphony no. 2 in C major Shostakovich: Symphony no. 1 & 5 Sibelius: Finlandia Sibelius: Symphonies no. 1 & 2 Sibelius: Violin Concerto Smetana: The Moldau (second tone poem from Ma Vlast I) Sor: Guitar pieces Strauss, J.: Blue Danube Waltz Strauss, R.: Also sprach Zarathustra Strauss, R.: Till Eulenspiegel’s Merry Pranks Stravinsky: Firebird Suite Stravinsky: Petrushka Stravinsky: Pulcinella Suite Stravinsky: Rite of Spring Szymanofsky: Symphony #2 Tchaikovsky: Nutcracker Suite Tchaikovsky: Symphony no. 6 Tschaikovsky: Piano Concerto no. 1 in B-flat major Tschaikovsky: Romeo and Juliet Tschaikovsky: Symphonies no. 4 & 5 Tschaikovsky: Violin Concerto in D major Vaughan Williams: A Sea Symphony Vaughan Williams: Dona Nobis Pacem Vaughan Williams: Fantasia on a Theme of Thomas Tallis Vaughan Williams: Lark Ascending Vaughan Williams: Pastoral Symphony Verdi: Overtures & Operas Verdi: Requiem Villa-Lobos: Guitar pieces Vivaldi: Concerto for Four Violins Vivaldi: Four Seasons Vivaldi: Guitar Concerto in D major Wagner: Flying Dutchman Overture Wagner: Rienzi Overture Wagner: Tannhäuser Overture Wagner: Tristan and Isolde Weber: Der Freischütz Overture Webern: Passacaglia, opus 1 Wolf: Songs
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06-21-2006, 07:12 PM | #93 |
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I actually have an issue with the Webern selection. I would say, the heck with Opus 1. It's not what Webern was about. It was a student piece. Webern's complete works can fit on a few disks. I know there is an Emerson Quartet Webern pieces for String Quartet. That would be better than his Opus 1. He was famous for his atonal music, not his one student work.
Check out one of those online stores that let you listen to snippets. It's twelve tone music, so you might want to think about it before you buy it. And you can often get the Mozart Clarinet Concerto together with the Carl Maria von Weber Clarinet Concerto. Last edited by Elfhelm : 06-21-2006 at 07:19 PM. |
06-21-2006, 09:08 PM | #94 |
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Ok. Will do.
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06-22-2006, 08:01 PM | #95 | |
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Quote:
Why do you say depressing? Btw, have you heard his Piano Concertos? Excellent stuff, though I dare say No.2 is slightly better than the more famous No.1...
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06-22-2006, 08:12 PM | #96 | |
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1)Forget trying to get specific concertos of Vivaldi. Much easier and much better is getting a certain opus set of concertos. For instance Opus.8 is the set of 12 violin concerti that also include The Four Seasons. They fit comfortably on two discs, and Nichoals Kraemer on Virgin Classics is an excellent choice, IMO, and probably cheap. (I bought it used, so I dont know...) 2) I don't know about any Part except a piece called "Credo" on a disc with Helene Griamaud playing whatever she wants blah blah blah...and the one thing I know about that piece is that it contains a "black spot" for the performer to make up, which might be why the music is such idiot crap, and I suspect that Helene Griamaus has everything to do with it. SO when you see her name, banish your eyes from it. 3) There is a set from Naxos, a three disc set of all Villa-Lobos's Bachianas Brasileiras. And can you guess the performers? None other than the Nashville Symphony Orchestra! Led by the inimitable (and now deceased) Kenneth Schermerhorn! I havent got it yet myself, but I am looking forward to it... great reviews at amazon btw... 4) Cantus Articus by Rautavaara is a decent enough piece, but his Tone Poem "Isle of Bliss" was far more impressive, IMO. 5) You really ought to add Shostakovich Syms. 4, 8 and 13 to your list.
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06-22-2006, 08:59 PM | #97 |
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1. Good Vivaldi advice.
2. Will do. My dad already has lots of Part though, so I have some reference points as to what editions. 3. Oh really? Ok. 4. I added Cantus Articus just because I wanted to . Don't know Tone Poem though. I'll look for it. 5. Noted.
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06-24-2006, 05:54 AM | #98 |
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*crashes through the adjoining Teacup Cafe kitchen, falling through a large rack of pots and pans*
I got it! I got it! I got Esa-Pekka Salonen's Wing on Wing! What's more, I also have his Insomnia (perfect for right now!) and Foreign Bodies.
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06-26-2006, 05:06 PM | #99 |
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Wow, I didn't realize Shosty was missing until you mentioned it, hb. *nod* Good point.
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07-01-2006, 11:43 AM | #100 | ||
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Quote:
Just kidding. Please do tell us about the pieces! Quote:
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