11-29-2006, 05:06 PM | #901 | ||
Advocatus Diaboli
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This is why things like rape and murder become so much more common during wartime, because there is often little chance of repercussion in a war torn area. Quote:
But, the existance of some good advice in the bible, or even a lot of good advice in the bible, doesn't mean that it is all good advice.
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11-29-2006, 05:09 PM | #902 | ||
Death of Mooters and [Entmoot] Internal Affairs
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If you can't believe I have any basis for my morals...well, that's your choice. I think I do (far beyond "it feels good/bad"), but then again you don't seem to be interested.
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Fëanor - Innocence incarnated Still, Aikanáro 'till the Last battle. Last edited by Falagar : 11-29-2006 at 05:11 PM. |
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11-29-2006, 05:17 PM | #903 | |||
Master of Orchestration President Emeritus of Entmoot 2004-2008
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Not all of them make sense if you wanted to do whatever you wanted. "Thou Shalt Now Covet" that is an "extra-earthly" commandment. Not exactly popular either, since the the reasoning would go "who can tell?" I suppose it's one of those "not good advice moments" eh?
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11-29-2006, 05:23 PM | #904 | ||||||
The Lovely Hobbit-Lass
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And to those who say that man did not evolve his morals, I might ask: Where then did he get them? Quote:
You see, Adam and Eve were told not to eat a fruit. Because they did, mankind fell from perfection. WHY? Because they ate a fruit? What is wrong with eating a fruit? It surely did not hurt anyone, including the willing parties that ate it. No, but because they rebelled against God. Not some moral system, but their Maker. God makes some choices purely choices; to simply choose to do as He says, or to not do as He says. It is possible that homosexuality is one of those choices: maybe it doesn't harm anyone (and that, I suppose, is debatable). But God said No. And I might repeat that God is the God of the secular as well as the religious. Now, I do not wish to impose my 'religion' on anyone. Like I said, it is your choice to even believe that God exists. If the people of this my democratic nation (the US of A) vote that gays can marry, I cannot stop them. But my vote will be against it.
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It's New Years Day, just like the day before; Same old skies of grey, same empty bottles on the floor. Another year's gone by, and I was thinking once again, How can I take this losing hand and somehow win? Just give me One Good Year To get my feet back on the ground. I've been chasing grace; Grace ain't so easily found One bad hand can devil a man, chase him and carry him down. I've got to get out of here, just give me One Good Year! |
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11-29-2006, 05:28 PM | #905 | |||
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11-29-2006, 05:44 PM | #906 | |
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Morality has always been a balancing act between doing what you want and doing what is good for the survival of society and oneself. And it has evolved in many ways over the years and will continue to.
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
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11-29-2006, 05:44 PM | #907 | |||||
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Fëanor - Innocence incarnated Still, Aikanáro 'till the Last battle. |
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11-29-2006, 05:53 PM | #908 | |||
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11-29-2006, 06:00 PM | #909 | ||
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It's still a set of rules supposed to guide you in this life though, the difference being how we perceive the world.
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Fëanor - Innocence incarnated Still, Aikanáro 'till the Last battle. Last edited by Falagar : 11-29-2006 at 06:06 PM. |
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11-29-2006, 06:07 PM | #910 | |
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Bob Marley became an Orthodox Christian (under the Ethiopian Orthodox Church), after a long run with Rastafarianism....though I get a feeling you were talking about the Dickens character
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11-29-2006, 06:30 PM | #911 | ||
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You can THINK homosexuality is wrong all you want as ive said before. You can even speak out on it and foam at the mouth about how disgusting it is and protest funerals because of it if you really want to. That’s your right. What IM speaking of is saying to someone else they can NOT do something that you can do and not giving a sufficient reason why. THAT is unjust discrimination and shouldn’t be allowed. Quote:
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"People's political beliefs don't stem from the factual information they've acquired. Far more the facts people choose to believe are the product of their political beliefs." "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." |
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11-29-2006, 06:46 PM | #912 | ||||
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The point is not whether we "evolved" to be against homosexuality, it's whether "nature" if that is all there is above us, told us to be against it. In other words it may be just as "natural" to be against homosexuality as anything else. Quote:
But you are not really giving a reason why it is wrong, from an atheistical POV, to be racist.
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11-29-2006, 06:47 PM | #913 | ||||||
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
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You right, I won't agree. Quote:
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Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle |
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11-30-2006, 01:39 AM | #914 | |||
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As I explained to my good friend Hector: Quote:
All the scriptures in the world are simply expressions of what humanity has learned over the ages about living with one another, written and compiled by human beings. We all desire pleasure, but most of us don't take it at the expense of others because it would ostracize us from the very society we all need to survive. It is in your own self interest to live as harmoniusly as possible with those around you. Sure, there have been many examples of societies that have cast this aside, but few have survived the consequences of the few taking advantage of the larger portion of any given society. Morality exists when it works, and it evolves over time when it does not. It's really very simply.
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
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11-30-2006, 01:42 AM | #915 | |
of the House of Fëanor
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Hear, hear!!
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11-30-2006, 07:05 AM | #916 |
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I'm not sure if this has been said already, I didn't read all 46 pages, but here is my idea on homosexual marriage in America.
Personally, I think it should be allowed, and here is why. Marriage in America, from the perspective of the government, is a nonreligious matter. It has to be, because religion is outside the scope of government. When two people get married, the only thing the government cares about is the civil portion. What religion you are, and how you do the ceremony, doesn't matter. It's the civil portion. If you are an adherent to any particular religious sect, and your sect does not allow gay marriage as sinful, your church does not have to perform them- Congress does not make you, and the gay men or women would probably not want you to either. No law prevents that, no law should. However, if two gay men sign papers saying they want to be joined in marriage, religion has no part in that either. You cannot use the excuse that it is frowned upon by God, because this is a secular nation. The 14th Amendment guarantees equal protection to all- if heterosexuals can do it, homosexuals can do it too, it's only fair, and without religion you don't have much of a case against it. Also, to end, I'm sure people have said this, but what in the world is the problem with two gay guys signing papers in a courthouse? It's certainly not my problem, it doesn't break my leg, and it doesn't break any fundamentalist legs either. Honestly, what I think the fundamentalists are doing here are poking their righteous noses into people's business like they own marriage. They do not, it is an institution that is multireligious and multiethnic, and it is unfair and pretentious to deny two people the right to be happy just because they like a different gender than somebody else. Anyway, just my opinion- I'm straight, I'm going to marry a girl, and really I don't see my world falling apart if someone I know decides to marry a guy. It's totally irrelevant...
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11-30-2006, 08:17 AM | #917 | ||||
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Welcome Aquilonis! This thread needs a sign. "Abandon all hope, ye who enter", or something
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Though since the ultimate goal of Christianity is being with God and being with God is considered the 'ultimate pleasure', perhaps it isn't really necessary to replace anything. Happiness is still the goal of any ethical system, whether in this life or another.
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Fëanor - Innocence incarnated Still, Aikanáro 'till the Last battle. Last edited by Falagar : 11-30-2006 at 08:23 AM. |
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11-30-2006, 11:02 AM | #918 | ||
The Lovely Hobbit-Lass
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It's New Years Day, just like the day before; Same old skies of grey, same empty bottles on the floor. Another year's gone by, and I was thinking once again, How can I take this losing hand and somehow win? Just give me One Good Year To get my feet back on the ground. I've been chasing grace; Grace ain't so easily found One bad hand can devil a man, chase him and carry him down. I've got to get out of here, just give me One Good Year! |
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11-30-2006, 11:23 AM | #919 |
Advocatus Diaboli
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The atheist's goal is happiness in this life. And the intelligent one realizes that one's own happiness is effected by the happiness of those around us.
I think that was the gist of much of jesus' teachings as well.
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
11-30-2006, 11:24 AM | #920 | ||
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Fëanor - Innocence incarnated Still, Aikanáro 'till the Last battle. |
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