08-26-2005, 03:50 AM | #861 | |||
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*springs up as if out of nowhere*
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However, science, and not philosophy should be taught in science class. I think the flaws in Evolution should be presented (as well as the flaws in the Bohr model and other scientific theories) but presenting the flaws in Evolutionary theory does not mean we have to teach philosophies as alternate scientific theories. I think we disregard philosophy (not necessarily religious) too much in our society. I think this is one reason why some people who believe in creationism etc want them recognized as scientific. What some people might be saying is that they have a logical and well-thought out theory that has some supporting evidence. This is a line of thought society calls science, but philosophies can be well thought out and evidence-based as well. I think society in general forgets that. Do I think creationism, Intelligent Design and Theistic evolution should be taught in science class? No. Do I think that people who believe those philosophies are somehow less reasonable, intelligent or logical than people who believe in the scientific theories? Not at all. I realize there is a grey area between science and philosophy, but the presence or absence of God in the theory draws the line for me. So macro-evolution = science, creationism = philosophy IMO. You know it's time to go to bed when you can't tell whether or not you can spell "whether" and "philosophy". I hope this post makes sense. Edited to attempt to make more sense.
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08-26-2005, 04:22 AM | #862 | ||||
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*gives you your thread back*
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"I can add some more, if you'd like it. Calling your Chief Names, Wishing to Punch his Pimply Face, and Thinking you Shirriffs look a lot of Tom-fools." - Sam Gamgee, p. 340, Return of the King Quote:
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08-26-2005, 04:22 AM | #863 | ||||
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*gives you your thread back*
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"I can add some more, if you'd like it. Calling your Chief Names, Wishing to Punch his Pimply Face, and Thinking you Shirriffs look a lot of Tom-fools." - Sam Gamgee, p. 340, Return of the King Quote:
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08-26-2005, 05:35 AM | #864 |
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Talking of historical perspectives, there are plenty of parallels.
Rian, you have articulated why this matters: because it affects a person's worldview. I know that it is not your personal and intention, but here is the rub. Creationists cannot accept many aspects of evolution because it contradicts their worldview. End of story, as Hobbit said. They will do whatever they can to undermine it. Consider the Copernican view of the solar system (you know, the one where earth goes around the sun), banned by the Catholic Church in 16-oatcake because it contradicted doctrine. It's a good example because, like evolution, you can't observe it directly. Note however, that the Ptolemaic view (earth is at the centre), the one the Church was defending, can actually be consistent with the evidence from observing planets etc. The Copernican model was preferred by science because it was simpler. Galileo was banned from promoting this worldview as "correct", but he was allowed to postulate it as a theoretical concept. Ring any bells? |
08-26-2005, 05:35 AM | #865 |
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Talking of historical perspectives, there are plenty of parallels.
Rian, you have articulated why this matters: because it affects a person's worldview. I know that it is not your personal and intention, but here is the rub. Creationists cannot accept many aspects of evolution because it contradicts their worldview. End of story, as Hobbit said. They will do whatever they can to undermine it. Consider the Copernican view of the solar system (you know, the one where earth goes around the sun), banned by the Catholic Church in 16-oatcake because it contradicted doctrine. It's a good example because, like evolution, you can't observe it directly. Note however, that the Ptolemaic view (earth is at the centre), the one the Church was defending, can actually be consistent with the evidence from observing planets etc. The Copernican model was preferred by science because it was simpler. Galileo was banned from promoting this worldview as "correct", but he was allowed to postulate it as a theoretical concept. Ring any bells? |
08-26-2005, 09:29 AM | #866 |
An enigma in a conundrum
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are you referring to Quasimoto?
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08-26-2005, 09:29 AM | #867 |
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are you referring to Quasimoto?
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08-26-2005, 10:35 AM | #868 | |
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08-26-2005, 10:35 AM | #869 | |
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
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08-26-2005, 10:46 AM | #870 | |
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but a true scientist does not jump to these kind of conclusions... there is no "right" and "wrong" from a scientific perspective... just data and interpretation it's not the fault of the scientists if people make ubsurd conclusions... much as it is not the fault of the bible if people decide to justify killing in it's name
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08-26-2005, 10:46 AM | #871 | |
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but a true scientist does not jump to these kind of conclusions... there is no "right" and "wrong" from a scientific perspective... just data and interpretation it's not the fault of the scientists if people make ubsurd conclusions... much as it is not the fault of the bible if people decide to justify killing in it's name
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
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08-26-2005, 11:01 AM | #872 | |
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pick anything you'd like to further discuss
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
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08-26-2005, 11:13 AM | #873 | |
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creationist's already have the answer, and are only looking to prove it and disprove others... and more importantly, the creationist answer is based upon a book written thousands of years ago... not on observable evidence give me one piece of observable evidence that a) does not come from the bible and b) makes creationism a logical alternative
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
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08-26-2005, 11:30 AM | #874 |
An enigma in a conundrum
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And now for something completely different to lighten things up a bit.
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If only God would give me some clear sign! Like making a large deposit in my name at a Swiss bank. How can I believe in God when just last week I got my tongue caught in the roller of an electric typewriter? What if everything is an illusion and nothing exists? In that case, I definitely overpaid for my carpet. Interestingly, according to modern astronomers, space is finite. This is a very comforting thought - particularly for people who can never remember where they have left things. What if nothing exists and we're all in somebody's dream? Or what's worse, what if only that fat guy in the third row exists? --the above courtesy of Woody Allen--
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08-26-2005, 01:17 PM | #875 |
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If it turns out that there is a God, I don't think that he's evil. But the worst that you can say about him is that basically he's an underachiever. Eternal nothingness is fine if you happen to be dressed for it. Not only is there no God, but try getting a plumber on weekends.
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
08-26-2005, 01:45 PM | #876 |
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Yes, Yes, I'd forgotten those. Good job.
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08-26-2005, 02:52 PM | #877 | |||
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I was asking for evidence of macro evolution that hasn't already been disproved
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08-26-2005, 02:58 PM | #878 | |||
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i'll try to get a link to some more info later, but i may gone for a day or two so be patient
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I was Press Secretary for the Berlioz administration and also, but not limited to, owner and co operator of fully armed and operational battle station EDDIE Quote:
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08-26-2005, 02:58 PM | #879 | |||
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i'll try to get a link to some more info later, but i may gone for a day or two so be patient
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I was Press Secretary for the Berlioz administration and also, but not limited to, owner and co operator of fully armed and operational battle station EDDIE Quote:
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08-26-2005, 03:25 PM | #880 | |
Advocatus Diaboli
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most of the info i've seen tries to prove why the earth is not, say, millions of years old... but i have seen none presented to prove that it is just 6,000
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