10-08-2005, 09:56 PM | #61 |
Fenway Ranger, Lord of Red Sox Nation
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Hey, didn't you see the " "? I'm joking, Lotesse
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Adventure...betrayal...heroism... Atharon: where heroes are born. My wife once said to me—when I'd been writing for ten or fifteen years—that I could always go back to being a nuclear engineer. And I said to her, 'Harriet, would you let someone who quit his job to go write fantasy anywhere near your nuclear reactor? I wouldn't!' (Robert Jordan) |
10-08-2005, 09:59 PM | #62 |
of the House of Fëanor
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Oh, O - KAY.
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10-09-2005, 12:07 AM | #63 |
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My sentiments.
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10-09-2005, 02:29 AM | #64 | ||
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In my book of definitions, "reasonable people" don't use insults to make their points. They don't need to, nor do they desire to. Part of why I started the thread in the first place (which unfortunately got merged and swallowed up in another thread ) was that it fascinated me to see and analyze the TYPE of words flying around from both sides. From what I saw, the people against the Kansas City changes in the curriculum were the ones that resorted to playground insults. I didn't see the childish insults, like "pinheads" (!), coming from the other side. I found that fascinating, and very illuminating, because in my experience, the side that has to retort to insults first is the one with less substance on their side. Quote:
I think we're a pretty cool community here. Some of my best friends here are atheist evolutionists And I try to be considerate to them by not making wholesale assumptions and statements about atheists or evolutionists when I post. I think we should all do that - it would make things a lot nicer, IMO. So, to answer your question, IMO an uber-evolutionist is someone who is obnoxious, close-minded, and insulting, among other unpleasant things, when it comes to discussing evolution/creation/ID. Not all evolutionists are like that, thank goodness. I don't know - I guess I just don't care for humor that tears people down, especially your friends. This kind of thing can just go on and on, and get worse and worse. There's all sorts of cartoons out there making fun of liberals, etc., that are very insulting. And I think they have MORE than a grain of truth in them! But I just don't think it does any good to post them. But that's just me. (ps - and did you see where I asked someone on "my side" to not make wholesale statements about liberals?)
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! Last edited by Rían : 10-09-2005 at 02:31 AM. |
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10-09-2005, 02:32 AM | #65 |
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Maybe I'm just an old-fogey dinosaur, and I should just ignore the cartoons ...
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
10-14-2005, 03:26 PM | #66 | ||||
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I really enjoyed the cartoons; I thought they were pretty funny. But cartoons do not equal science or proof. I expected someone who subscribes to the Theory of Evolution to employ better science than that. Unless you were kidding..? Anyway, I do agree that there shouldn't be a mandate to teach creationism in schools. I do think it would be a good idea to teach it in a religious studies class, along with beliefs from other religions. This is better than wedging all that into Social Studies, which is how the curriculum currently stands in British Columbia. With a Religious Studies class, you could explore everything in more detail. Edited to add: R*an, I was going to add that "evolutionist" isn't a word, but apparently it is! Quote:
edited for spelling
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10-14-2005, 03:34 PM | #67 | |
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how do you feel about theistic evolution R*an?
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10-14-2005, 03:52 PM | #68 | ||
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Theistic evolution is cool. I don't know where I stand on it. On the one hand, I do believe in Theistic evolution, and on the other hand my belief in God and my belief in the ToE are separate.
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10-14-2005, 04:08 PM | #69 | |||
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I don't understand how you can believe in both ToE and God, I have found them to be somewhat mutually exclusive; the ToE leaves no room for a god of any kind, in fact evolution is man's way of explaining away God, but i won't get started on that
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10-14-2005, 04:11 PM | #70 | ||
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My comments about Theistic evolution and ToE were just that I'm confused about some of the finer points of my world view. These things take a lot of thinking.
ToE does so leave room for God. What on Earth made you think otherwise? ToE makes absolutely no comment at all about God. Therefore it does leave room for it. The existence, or lack thereof, of God does not affect the contents of ToE.
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10-14-2005, 04:22 PM | #71 | ||||
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The theory of evolution is one of the tools used by humanist to try to disprove God's existence, of course trying to disprove something is quite hard scientiffically, but some do try.
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10-14-2005, 04:23 PM | #72 | |
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*pumps fist in air*
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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10-14-2005, 04:26 PM | #73 | |
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That link looks interesting - scanned it briefly and will read it carefully later thanks!
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç å ™ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
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10-14-2005, 04:32 PM | #74 | |
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10-14-2005, 05:00 PM | #75 | ||
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evolution to some is just like a religion and they believe in it as strongly as extremist muslims believe in blowing up all other religions. evolutionist have a similar goal, they would like to eliminate the other theory.
evolution has played a big role in history, perhaps darwin did not intend to stir things up like he ended up doing, but he did, both communisn and nazism were very much influenced by the teachings of darwin, and "survival of the fittest" leading to the lack of morals during the holocaust and during stalins reign, after all they thought it was only "natural selection", that the stronger kill the weaker so they did
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10-14-2005, 05:08 PM | #76 | |||||
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However, what is it in ToE that leads you to believe that there is no room for God in the theory? When I took cell biology, we spent a fair amount of time on evolution theories (the Urey-Miller experiment, the theory about how multi-celled organisms could have evolved from symbiosis between two single-celled organisms, etc.). Nothing in the class ever caused me to think, "How can I subscribe to this theory and at the same time believe in God?" Quote:
If someone didn't believe in God, they could point to ToE to show that it's possible to logically not believe in God. This is because God does not have to exist in order for the ToE to be a valid theory. However, you should also take into account, that God can exist and ToE can still continue to be a valid theory. This is because ToE makes no comments about God's existence - neither positive nor negative.
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10-14-2005, 05:28 PM | #77 | ||||
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I cross-posted with you there Rohirrim TR. (Since I was typing that Theology post at the same time - go check it out. )
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Let's not forget Godwin's Law people! For those of you unaware, Godwin's Law states that the longer an internet debate goes on, the more the probablility of someone comparing the other side to Hitler approaches 1. This person would then lose all credability, since they had to resort to a hyperbole. I think comparing people who think ToE is the absolute truth to religious extremists is a hyperbole. ToE is not the truth. ToE is science, and science exists to rationally and objectively offer explanations of the world around us. Only a few things in science are laws. One could say scientific laws are truths, eg. gravity is a law, and it is true that gravity exists. Needless to say, there are not many laws. Quote:
(I actually had not read this part of your post when I explained Godwin's Law earlier.) I can't believe you just blamed ToE for Nazism and, of all things, Communism! The incredible fallacy in this logic astounds me. Allow me to address these points individually. 1. Nazism and ToE. Belief in 'survival of the fittest' (one aspect of ToE) had no influence whatsoever in Hitler's beliefs and his heinous crimes. In fact, Hitler's ridiculous idea that the "Aryan race" was somehow better than the rest of humanity is in violation of ToE, but that is neither here nor there. Hitler's main influences, as far as I can tell, were: a) extreme economic hardship in Germany and the vulnerability and desparation of the German people b) good oratorial skills and the ability to manipulate others c) extreme racism and bigotry d) the ability to suspend all logic (for example, Hitler was not a member of his beloved Aryan race, being brown-haired and brown-eyed, and in fact, he had a Jewish grandmother). e) a number of complex social factors about which I know very little 2. Communism was a social ideal first proposed by the likes of Karl Marx. Legitimate criticisms of Capitalism were made. Communism was later exploited in, most notably, the U.S.S.R. by dictators such as Stalin - whose actions would have absolutely appalled Marx. This is a very, very simplified version of the history of Communism, but as you can see, it has nothing whatsoever to do with ToE. Your above quoted statement has led me to believe that you know absolutely nothing about a) ToE b) World War II and c) Communism. A thoughtful, well-supported response to my post will certainly rectify this belief. I'm sorry to be insulting, but... ToE has influenced Nazism and Communism (which, it should be mentioned, also have nothing to do with each other)!? Anyway, please to not let this rather harsh rebuttle of your post put you off discussing our world views in the Theology thread, and I would really like to continue this discussion as well. (I will try to not be so mean next time around. )
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10-14-2005, 05:36 PM | #78 | |||
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let me correct myself here on my original post i am refering to secular humanists, because i realize there are more than one kind of humanist heres a drawing that outlines the belief of secular humanists, on the right side of the pic i think click here
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10-14-2005, 05:39 PM | #79 | |||
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Looks like we cross-posted again Rohirrim TR. Don't forget my post right before this one!
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10-14-2005, 05:51 PM | #80 | ||
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Nurvingiel-
#1 i did not compare anyone to hitler, hitler is his own person and i have NEVER compared anyone to him #2 comparison of evolution to islam is very fitting, extremist muslims are very rare, extremist evolutionist are very rare, i'm not saying they are all like that, broad generalisations about large groups of people are bound to be wrong #3 the works of darwin did influence, not cause, but influence communism and stalin, and hitler, there are other reasons for both leaders actions but their moral philosophy influenced by evolution and insanity led to that evil this is an informative article #4 Karl Marx was quite enamored with the works of darwin and the concepts that darwin wrote about, again darwins work influenced, him and his philosophy not caused it #5 i'm glad you don't hate me, i don't hate you either, if there are more points for me to explain i'll have to do it later
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