LOTR Ripoff

[Radagast The Brown]

Tar Elendil I realized from your posts that you don't like HP so it's not fair for you to the book. if you don't like it you don't have to destroy his reputation. well, anyway, I think that HP isn't totally original and there are lots of things that she did took from other legends and books but there are some things she invented herself.

[Tar-Elendil]

i was trashing nothing, radagast. i was merely stating my opinion..is that not what posting is about?

[Radagast The Brown]

I agree you should state your opinion but it's a bit not fair that you're against the book because you don't like it. I didn't write you were trashing nothing, and if I did I didn't mean to write what I wrote.

[Tar-Elendil]

how can being against the book becuz i dont like it be unfair? i just think it is very unoriginal

[Eruviel Greenleaf]

I wouldn't say it's unfair, but I would disagree with you

[Gorhiriel]

Realistically, I think many books have copied ideas from JRR. it's just that Potter is so high profile that people pick these up.

[Renille]

Back in December, I think, a mooter had a really good comparison between HP and LOTR. He said that Harry was like Candyland, and LOTR was like chess. (Or something like that) They're both really entertaining, fun, etc., but for different audiences. Sure, the two books have almost alarming similarities. But they ARE different.

[Gorhiriel]

V good point.

[Eruviel Greenleaf]

Although there is a lot of crossover-audience...I know a lot of Tolkien fans who also like HP, so I wouldn't say candyland exactly

[Radagast The Brown]

how can being against the book becuz i dont like it be unfair? i just think it is very unoriginal

ok. I'm sorry.
And now to another subject: Even if HP is a copy of LOTR, who cares? both of them are good books. HP is half original book, after all.

[Renille]

Originally posted by Eruviel Greenleaf
Although there is a lot of crossover-audience...I know a lot of Tolkien fans who also like HP, so I wouldn't say candyland exactly

Yes...I see your point. So maybe checkers?

[Eruviel Greenleaf]

Maybe. . .or. .. Risk!!! Okay, not really. . .

[jerseydevil]

To be honest - Tolkien's works aren't completely original either. He borrowed many things from legends and myths. His languages he developed off of the many languages he knew.

As people said - it's impossible to completely have an original idea. In order to have a COMPLETELY original idea you would have to be shut off from the outside world from birth.

Also - I thought it was funny that people were complaining if Rowling writes a scene where Wormtail turns on Voldemort and destroys him then she would be stealing that from Tolkien because it's similar to the way Wormtongue turns on Saruman. But isn't that also similar to how Darth Vader turns on the Emperor in The Return of the Jedi??? Aren't there many many references thoughout history and literature where the evil crony turns on his master? By the way - I do not think Darth Vader was just a crony, although I was upset that the emporer was over him and Darth seemed to grovel at his feet (but I guess that's for the SW forum).

I also read a comment about JK Rowling using her initials like JRR Tolkien on this thread. The reason she used her initials was because her publisher felt that the books would appeal more to boys if they didn't know it was written by a woman. JK Rowling is an ambiguous name. Of course now everyone knows she's a woman and no one cares. But possibly before the books became so popular boys would have cared.

Also to say there are similarities to Tolkien because of shape changers - such as Beorn and Lupin is ridiculous. Europe had those legends LONG LONG ago with werewolves. Both Tolkien and JK Rowling took there characters from those legends. Eddings also has shape changers in his Balgariad series; The Sorcerer Belgarath and Sorceress Polgara both turn into wolves.

Another thing that was funny was the reference in comparing the woods - the Dark Woods and Mirkwood. Has everyone forgotten Wizard of Oz? They had a dark wood too where the flying monkeys attack Dorothy and party. Come on - how many people have gone into the woods and felt something creepy about it? All you have to do is go hiking through the New Jersey Pine Barrens in the middle of the night to see where someone could get an idea to write about a "Dark Wood".

To compare JK Rowling and JRR Tolkien's works and say that she ripped off Tolkien is to completely ignore all the other sources of literature, myths and legends that either one or both could have gotten there ideas from.

As it's been stated - Tolkien had a great (the biggest) influence on Fantasy writing. It is the godfather of all fantasy books. It would be almost impossible to write a fantasy book that was completely devoid of any similarities with Tolkien.

[Tar-Elendil]

As people said - it's impossible to completely have an original idea. In order to have a COMPLETELY original idea you would have to be shut off from the outside world from birth

that is annoying..did i just not say that? and aye, tolkien's books took alot of stuff from all that anglo saxon crap and other stuff such as the bible itself..but(as i have said many many times before) the characters in haryr potter are frightningly similar to ones in LoTR

[Radagast The Brown]

and as I said, I don't agree with you, Tar Elendil. The characters in HP do not like the characters in LOTR. Nop. They are different. not totally different, but not totally alike.

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by Tar-Elendil
that is annoying..did i just not say that? and aye, tolkien's books took alot of stuff from all that anglo saxon crap and other stuff such as the bible itself..but(as i have said many many times before) the characters in haryr potter are frightningly similar to ones in LoTR

i don't knwo why it's annoying when I said several times in my post - "as people have previously said". Many people said similar things - I was supporting some of your statements.

I'm not going ot quote everyone and just put "I agree" after the quote.

I do however disagree with your statement that the characters in HP are frighteningly similar to LotR. I read LotR 8+ times and I read HP 2 times. Never did I feel I was reading a knock off of LotR. The characters are completely different, plots are completely different and the books are directed at two different audiences.

[Eruviel Greenleaf]

I agree with Radagast, and any similarties between the characters are from JK and Tolkien drawing on the same things, the same archetypes, mythology, etc. Refer to Jerseydevil's essay.

[Radagast The Brown]

Right. and if there are some similarties between the characters it means that they thought on the same thing when they tought on the character.

[Eruviel Greenleaf]

Originally posted by Radagast The Brown
Right. and if there are some similarties between the characters it means that they thought on the same thing when they tought on the character.

Or that the character is/is based on an archetype. Same deal, really. . .

[Kallasilya]

I think you are just imagining it... well actually there are quite a lot of similarities on the surface, but (having read both books), they are written in completely different styles, for different target groups of people. The characters may be similar in appearance, but some things are universal, like the portrayal of evil and wise old men