TTT extended Edition

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by Millane
hhahaha i watched them talking about including Arwen in the fight scenes but they said there was an uproar on the internet, i stuck up for her at the time but im glad she wasnt fighting, looked shocking and she said she cried because people called her xena, hahahahahahaha

Did they really mention my Xena reference? I have called her Xena-elf since FotR came out. I'm sure by "she" you mean Liv Tyler cried - not Arwen. Do they really mention this on the DVD stuff on the DVD about how they took out her fighting because of the backlash on the net?

[cassiopeia]

Don't let my review spoil everything! The Frodo, Sam and Gollum scenes were good for the most part. I've managed to check out the Tolkien documentary on disc 3, which is brilliant. Of course it is, because it has Tom Shippey and others talking about Tolkien and the book. Very interesting.

I haven't seen the Xena-Arwen part yet. Maybe we do have power here on the net!

[Rían]

I still plan to get the DVD first thing tomorrow - the Tolkien lover in me enjoys the parts that are "right" to me, and ignores the rest And I'm one of those people that enjoy the behind-the-scenes stuff, and I got a kick out of the actors' commentary, esp. the silly stuff that showed they didn't know the book!

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by RÃ*an
... I got a kick out of the actors' commentary, esp. the silly stuff that showed they didn't know the book!

That just proves that Jackson fed us a line. He stated that all the actors had to read the book. Of course I already knew they hadn't since Elijah stated that he hasn't read the book.

[claudia silver]

I got it

Extra scenes include:

Elven rope
The Burning of Westfold
The Banishment of Eomer
The Song of the Entwives
Ent Draft
The Glittering Caves
Flotsam and Jetsam

::rushing to watch it::

[Khamûl]

Originally posted by cassiopeia
I haven't seen the Xena-Arwen part yet. Maybe we do have power here on the net!

No doubt that we have power. I have a habit of viewing Who's Online when nothing else is going on. Since I'm an admin, Who's Online shows IP addresses as well as the usual stuff.

Here's the cool part: sometime last year, this one IP caught my attention. It was "morannon.wetafx.co.nz" and they were viewing the thread called "Peter Jackson has improved Tolkien". Then I got to thinking and realized that WetaFX is Peter Jackson's special effects department, the .co.nz shows that they're from New Zealand, and then the LotR reference with Morannon was too much. Since we're one of the premier Tolkien boards on the web, I don't doubt that they dropped in to see what we have to say.

[Sween]

a much better version of the movie !

Loved some of the new sceans

[cassiopeia]

Hey, that's cool Khamul! I don't doubt that somebody involved in the movie would have stumbled upon Entmoot. Maybe even Peter Jackson himself!

I've mangaged a look at the documentaries on disc three. It shows some sequences of Arwen at Helm's Deep (shudder). It is explained that they couldn't have an Arwen/Aragorn romance when they are miles apart. So they thought they'd haul Arwen up to Helm's Deep and have her involved in the action. They claim they decided in the end that the flashback sequences were enough to show Arwen and Aragorn's romance. The rumours on the net were mentioned, but I don't think they influenced their decision.

They also explain Faramir's change in character. They say Faramir needed to go on a journey -- like Frodo and Boromir. Phillipa Boyens says that since the Ring is destroying Frodo, it would be an insult for Faramir to not be taken by the Ring. I just hope Merry and Pippin go on a big journey in the next movie.

It also is explained why Shelob wasn't in TTT: if you check the timeline in the LOTR, you'll see Frodo is attacked by Shelob when Minas Tirith is under siege; and that the Helm's Deep battle and Shelob would 'cancel each other out', lessening the emotional impact.

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by cassiopeia
Hey, that's cool Khamul! I don't doubt that somebody involved in the movie would have stumbled upon Entmoot. Maybe even Peter Jackson himself!

I've mangaged a look at the documentaries on disc three. It shows some sequences of Arwen at Helm's Deep (shudder). It is explained that they couldn't have an Arwen/Aragorn romance when they are miles apart. So they thought they'd haul Arwen up to Helm's Deep and have her involved in the action. They claim they decided in the end that the flashback sequences were enough to show Arwen and Aragorn's romance. The rumours on the net were mentioned, but I don't think they influenced their decision.

No - instead there sending her down to Gondor to bring Aragorn his sword - then there will be a huge cat fight between her an Eowyn.

They also explain Faramir's change in character. They say Faramir needed to go on a journey -- like Frodo and Boromir. Phillipa Boyens says that since the Ring is destroying Frodo, it would be an insult for Faramir to not be taken by the Ring. I just hope Merry and Pippin go on a big journey in the next movie.

They didn't NEED to do that at all. They just wanted more action and more conflict.

It also is explained why Shelob wasn't in TTT: if you check the timeline in the LOTR, you'll see Frodo is attacked by Shelob when Minas Tirith is under siege; and that the Helm's Deep battle and Shelob would 'cancel each other out', lessening the emotional impact.

I don't think that it would have cancelled each other out. Does that mean they won't have the Battle of Pelenor Fields or what about at the Black Gate. The destruction of the Ring and the Black Gate might cancel each other out.

It's funny with how much jackson changed he's worried about the timeline and where Shelob fell into the story when he gave us that ridiculous Flight to the Ford scene. To me it would have been great to leave off with Sam thinking Frodo was dead (you KNOW the MAIN character) - but then Jackson would have had to have shortened Helms Deep. In my opinion that is the ONLY reason why Shelob wasn't shown - because he didn't want to take away from his precious battle sequence for Helms Deep.

[BeardofPants]

Wow, I didn't even realise it was out until I saw it accidentally at Whitcoulles today... Needless to say, I didn't need any encouragement to buy it, but I'm probably not going to watch it until tomorrow, since I'm feeling a bit crap right now. Woe, me.

Originally posted by cassiopeia
Hey, that's cool Khamul! I don't doubt that somebody involved in the movie would have stumbled upon Entmoot. Maybe even Peter Jackson himself!

Hey, if my BF can stumble over him at Real Groovy records, then why not Entmoot?

[Tuor of Gondolin]

The extended dvd is significantly better, it's largely book materialish, although there's a continuation of PJ, PB aggravating habit of changing speakers, situations, etc., frequently for no good reason. (ex. Merry and Pippin drink entdraughts against the advice of Treebeard).
And on disc three in a section called "book to screen" they, probably in response to criticism, try to justify Faramir's character alteration. It seems to generally come down to a conclusion that they know better then JRRT.

[Dúnedain]

Just to comment on the Osgiliath thing. I wasn't a big fan of them bringing Frodo and company to Osgiliath, but looking at it from a different perspective, it makes sense in the following respect. The fact that Frodo, Sam and Gollum's route was leading them down in that direction to go through Minas Morgul. Now, considering the fact that Faramir and company were needed at Osgiliath then, for them to bring them there issued their safety. Yes, yes I know the parting was much nicer in the book and Faramir was more noble than his father and brother in the respect of doing what is right, however the book does lend us the fact that Faramir wants approval from his father. The movie sets that up nicely, unfortunately making Faramir look bad, but as I've always said about the way he was portrayed in the movie, the ultimate piece of him that we see, IS that noble Faramir we know and enjoy.

So, ultimately, that move in the movie makes sense by the fact that their paths led near the same end, being that Frodo was going to Minas Morgul which is basically next to Osgiliath. So from that perspective I can understand the motive, of course that is done looking back and knowing the geography of things. I do wish we didn't see Faramir in that light, but in the end he more than makes up for it and I am sure he will carry on to be the Faramir we know and love in his portrayal in RotK...

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by Dúnedain
So, ultimately, that move in the movie makes sense by the fact that their paths led near the same end, being that Frodo was going to Minas Morgul which is basically next to Osgiliath. So from that perspective I can understand the motive, of course that is done looking back and knowing the geography of things. I do wish we didn't see Faramir in that light, but in the end he more than makes up for it and I am sure he will carry on to be the Faramir we know and love in his portrayal in RotK...

i would not call them next to each other. That is like saying that if I'm in Cape May NJ (souther tip of NJ) - I can be dragged up to NY because I was going to Philadelphia anyway.

I don't think it works - I think jackson wanted more conflict.

[Dúnedain]

Originally posted by jerseydevil
i would not call them next to each other. That is like saying that if I'm in Cape May NJ (souther tip of NJ) - I can be dragged up to NY because I was going to Philadelphia anyway.

I don't think it works - I think jackson wanted more conflict.

First of all I said "basically next to each other" which in the realm of Middle Earth, according to the maps they are near to each other. I would consider Minas Tirith (not counting the outer wall) next to Osgiliath as well, yet they are not exactly next to each other. In looking at the maps, Minas Morgul in respect to Minas Tirith, is just a little bit further from Osgiliath than Minas Tirith is. So in that respect they are "basically next to each other".

As far as your analogy of Cape May and Philadelphia, that is just ridiculous, cuz that is practically the whole state of New Jersey between the two places. From Osgiliath to Minas Morgul it is more like Newark to New York City, if that far...

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by Dúnedain
First of all I said "basically next to each other" which in the realm of Middle Earth, according to the maps they are near to each other. I would consider Minas Tirith (not counting the outer wall) next to Osgiliath as well, yet they are not exactly next to each other. In looking at the maps, Minas Morgul in respect to Minas Tirith, is just a little bit further from Osgiliath than Minas Tirith is. So in that respect they are "basically next to each other".

I don't see any reason for Faramir dragging Frodo and Sam to Osgiliath.

As far as your analogy of Cape May and Philadelphia, that is just ridiculous, cuz that is practically the whole state of New Jersey between the two places. From Osgiliath to Minas Morgul it is more like Newark to New York City, if that far...

I disagree that Osgiliath and Minas Morgul are really that close.I'll give you that they are closer than the analogy I gave. But Newark and NY are less than 10 miles apart. Between Minas Morgul and Osgiliath it is 30 miles. On foot that is a big distance.

[Dúnedain]

Originally posted by jerseydevil
I disagree that Osgiliath and Minas Morgul are really that close.I'll give you that they are closer than the analogy I gave. But Newark and NY are less than 10 miles apart. Between Minas Morgul and Osgiliath it is 30 miles. On foot that is a big distance.

At least you can admit that about your analogy

How do you know it's 30 miles? But even if it is 30 miles, that is still relatively close in relation to other things in ME...ya know? It's still "basically next to each other"

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by Dúnedain
How do you know it's 30 miles? But even if it is 30 miles, that is still relatively close in relation to other things in ME...ya know? It's still "basically next to each other"

Becuase on the map I have has a scale. I took a piece of paper - marked where Osgiliath is and Minas Morgul and compared it to the scale.

[Dúnedain]

Originally posted by jerseydevil
Becuase on the map I have has a scale. I took a piece of paper - marked where Osgiliath is and Minas Morgul and compared it to the scale.

Oh duh I didn't look at that on my map, lol. Ok I just ran the scale as well.

From Osgiliath to Minas Morgul (on the map from the middle of each site) = 24-25 miles

From Osgiliath to Minas Tirith (middle of each site, Minas Tirith is measure from the block for the city itself, not the outer wall) = 18-19 miles

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by Dúnedain
Oh duh I didn't look at that on my map, lol. Ok I just ran the scale as well.

From Osgiliath to Minas Morgul (on the map from the middle of each site) = 24-25 miles

From Osgiliath to Minas Tirith (middle of each site, Minas Tirith is measure from the block for the city itself, not the outer wall) = 18-19 miles

Well the road isn't straight though. And the land would be hilly - if not mountainous in some areas. But I'll give you 25 miles. I still think it is stupid for Faramir to drag Frodo to Osgiliath. I especially hate the fact that Frodo is two feet in front of the Nazgul, holding out the Ring and the damn thing just flies off like that.

[Sween]

One thing i think is very imporant to mention is no matter what anyone thinks of the changes made to the books etc and for good or bad anyone that has watched the extras cannot help but be moved by how much these people care and how hard they worked to do this. I dont think anyone would go to so much trouble if they didnt love tolkien or take great pride in there art and in what they were trying to do which is bring this worold to life and if only for that reason i think the proff would allmost aprove of the movies.

Richard Taylor does have a really anoying voice though