01-30-2002, 11:08 PM | #61 |
Elf Lord
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I see this kind of 'open mindedness' (is that a word) in a lot of people.
"I'm open minded, so you should be open minded, but if your opinions aren't like mine, you can't be open minded, you stupid bigot"...hmm...okay. Or "I HATE CHRISTIANITY ALL CHRISTIANS SUCK AND THEY ARE ALL BIGOTS". I have basically had this said to me by someone, and it actually made me laugh out loud, because this is actually the biggest case of bigotry and hypocrisy I have ever seen. This isn't directed at anybody, just referring to the topic. I've seen Christians (and I am one) close their eyes to the fact that they are being hypocritical, and I've seen atheists/agnostics completely turn themselves around and backwards to prove that something doesn't exist. One question to all those atheist who are bent on 'converting' Christians. Why? It's not like there is a reward for that person if they DO 'convert' (I hate that word), unlike Christianity.
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01-30-2002, 11:08 PM | #62 |
Halfwitted
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I don't know, Sakata, telling someone that you're only trying to "save their soul" is rather condescending. I can see why Aragorn would get mad.
And I, for one, agree more with Aragorn than anyone else here. I am an atheist (or agnostic, whatever you want to call it). Evolution and reincarnation are not incompatible doctrines. In fact, reincarnation actually seems more logical (to me, at least) than Heaven. Since everything else in the universe is continuously going through being reused and recycled, why not people's souls? Why would it be a one-way thing? That doesn't make much sense. William Wallace - how could anyone be "pretty sure about" what happens when we die??? WE HAVE NO IDEA WHAT HAPPENS WHEN WE DIE!! In the end, Heaven and reincarnation and ceasing to exist are all just idle speculation. We don't know, and we never will, until we actually die. We don't know if there's a God either, and we don't know if there isn't one. So let's discuss it, but there's really no point in getting angry. Nobody here is any more right than anybody else.
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01-30-2002, 11:10 PM | #63 |
Elf Lord
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Exactly FF. Getting angry about these things is pretty stupid. I admit it hurts me to find out if my friend is atheist/agnostic, BUT this gives me no right to go about judging them, or stop loving them, or get angry at them.
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“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.” –Bertrand Russell |
01-31-2002, 01:16 AM | #64 |
Elven Warrior
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What's wrong with reincarnation? Reincarnation is a really common concept. Seems to me Christianity is one of the few religions that doesn't have it. (Well, and Judaism and Islam, which I tend to lump together for historical reasons) It's metaphysically attractive because it emphasizes the cyclic nature of things. That's if you go into metaphysics. Religions are really big on circles. Come to think of it, real physics is also really big on circles. That's where all that trig you have to do comes from.
Hey Starr Polish! Are you in university or high school? Cuz for a biology major, you just have to get through the first year prereques, like first year physics, chem, calc, and then you get to do whatever you want to do, e.g. marine biology. Don't let math intimidate you. Haha! psych! Not my thing. I've been avoiding psych courses like the plague. I guess it's for some people, not for others. Anyways, evolution is cool. Evolution is important. Evolution keeps things going, otherwise, everything would die. Without evolution, everything we thought we knew about biology would just fall apart. "Adaptation? What adaptation? " Can you imagine? Christians get rewards for converting people? I shudder at the thought. I hope that was just a mistake. |
01-31-2002, 01:28 AM | #65 |
Elven Warrior
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Basically, I believe that it's Jehovah's Witnesses who believe they get rewards for converting people, but technically, they are not Christian, since they believe that Jesus is not God (part of the eternal Trinity of Father, Son, and Spirit), but a created being (an angel). (I know I will probably get arguments here, and people are entitled to disagree, but I stand by what I've said.)
Jesus told his disciples to go throughout the world, preaching the gospel and making disciples of all people, and believers do this out of love for their Lord, not to get rewards.
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01-31-2002, 01:29 AM | #66 |
Elf Lord
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Oi...no, Christians don't get rewards for 'converting' people (and I hate that word, I hate it with a passion). Christians believe in heaven, and that the only way to get there is through Christ. A true Christian wants others to go to heaven as well, which is why they should try to 'convert' people. But just because someone calls themselves a Christian doesn't mean they are one, and everyone interprets the faith differently. It's actually encouraged (Law of liberty, Romans 14)
I'm in high school...and my mind is very screwed up. I'm a right hander, terrible in math, I love to write, but I don't always understand the mechanics of English (misplaced modifiers???) but I excel amazingly in biology classes. ::shrug:: I dunno, acting seems like something I really want to persue right now.
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01-31-2002, 11:02 AM | #67 | ||
Elf Lord
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If you want to attempt to save someone's soul, I'll open another thread somewhere and you can holler at me. I don't think that Aragorn is listening to you, other than to luagh at you.
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I'm actually with you two; I don't believe in God. There is some stuff I believe in, but to "God" I say; Bah. Quote:
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01-31-2002, 11:11 AM | #68 |
Elven Warrior
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Okay....I'm sorry to break it to you people but I never got mad. I just thought you might actually respond if I typed that using caps and exclamation points. The only thing I'm mad about is the Christians reading one of my posts about 100 times just to find one error that may help them "defeat" me. To Starr Polish: I'm not trying to make any Christians stop believing in god. I'm just standing up for what I believe in instead of letting all you people bashing my theories on life and death.
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01-31-2002, 04:17 PM | #69 |
Elf Lord
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I wasn't trying to imply that you were, that was just a general question.
::shrug:: I have Wiccan, atheist and agnostic friends, and I'll happily discuss religion with them. I hate that term as well Man...I'm a hater of words. It's just...it gets so out of hand sometimes, that people forget WHY they are what they are sometimes. Did that make any sense?
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“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.” –Bertrand Russell |
01-31-2002, 07:09 PM | #70 |
Hobbit
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So are you avoiding my answer Aragorn or have you just not come up with something to defend yourself yet?
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Everyone dies, but not everyone truly lives... Last edited by William Wallace : 01-31-2002 at 07:12 PM. |
01-31-2002, 07:11 PM | #71 | |
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Quote:
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Everyone dies, but not everyone truly lives... Last edited by William Wallace : 01-31-2002 at 07:14 PM. |
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01-31-2002, 07:17 PM | #72 | ||
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Quote:
Quote:
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"When evil people come to destroy me, when my enemies and foes attack me, they will stumble and fall. Though a mighty army surrounds me, my heart will know no fear." -Psalms 27:2-3 -Dare you venture into Gollum's Lair? JESUS LIVES! Last edited by Sakata : 01-31-2002 at 07:18 PM. |
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01-31-2002, 07:21 PM | #73 |
The Insufferable
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But Christians cant convert people. Only God can. So it would be pointless for them to expect a reward, wouldn't it?
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01-31-2002, 08:48 PM | #74 |
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Um ok thats great everyone. Now move back to whatever this thread was originally about (whatever that was). A thing this board does not need is another big discussion on religion.
Fact: Nothing any of you say will change how anyone thinks, feels, and believes. We all know how you all feel now.......so whats the point of saying anything else on the topic? Exactly, don't. (plus, I don't know about you guys, but I could care less what religion each of you are.......everyone is equal. I don't judge anyone by what their religion or beliefs are. I really could care less) No religion is right or wrong. You shouldn't get mad at Aragorn because a lot of people feel that way. Its called Science Ok that was my little speach. I was going to make it longer and more meaningful, but that might cause controversy. Why when you hear 'bible' do you have to launch into a big argument over whos right and whos wrong...........just stop it. If this thread was originally about books, well there are forums about books ya know.
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01-31-2002, 09:07 PM | #75 | |
Elven Warrior
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Quote:
People should be able to talk about bibles without generating all this fuss. Let's be mature about it. Some people are into this stuff and some people aren't. And either way is completely OK. It's a very personal thing, isn't it? I, for one, would love to be able to talk about bibles and korans and taotechings and sutras without people getting all emotional, but that seems too much to expect. Religious books can be interesting, but all this unnecessary me vs. you is just tiresome. |
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01-31-2002, 09:40 PM | #76 |
Elven Warrior
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Who’s getting emotional? We are having a conversation; people don’t get angry if a thread wanders to say their pet or something, it is just what people want to talk about. HOBBIT why is it the last thing this forum needs? People obviously like discussing this so why come in and break it up? it is not like we are cussing and tearing each others eyes out You guys have repeatedly said that no ones minds are being changed so what’s the point? the point is that having your beliefs challenged is what makes them stronger (usually) I know my debates with afro-elf have strengthened my faith more than anything and I would assume it would be the same in whatever you believe in. So even if we are not going to end this forum with everyone believing one thing, at least a few people know better why they believe. And lastly if you dont like debates then by all means dont read them! I am sure there are plenty of other forums that are discussing books
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"When evil people come to destroy me, when my enemies and foes attack me, they will stumble and fall. Though a mighty army surrounds me, my heart will know no fear." -Psalms 27:2-3 -Dare you venture into Gollum's Lair? JESUS LIVES! |
01-31-2002, 09:48 PM | #77 |
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Sakata, you are getting emotional I don't think that anyone wants to discuss this. Hmm maybe I'm wrong. Ssssshhhhhhh.
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01-31-2002, 09:56 PM | #78 | |
Halfwitted
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I know with all my mind, body, and soul, that I do not know what comes after death. And I won't, until I die. What makes you so great that you are immediately right and I am wrong? My eyes are not closed. I am willing to consider all options, from all religions and philosophies. I don't have to stick to one idea. When I find an explanation that rings true, I will believe it. And when I die, I'll know for sure. Besides, why do you really want to know? I see Death as a great mystery. Someday we'll all find out what it is. I can wait until then. It makes it less scary, anyway.
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01-31-2002, 09:56 PM | #79 |
The Insufferable
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I can't help wondering why it's ok for Non Christians to tell christians how wrong they are, but not vice versa.
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01-31-2002, 09:58 PM | #80 |
Halfwitted
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What? I never said Christians are wrong. All I'm saying is I don't know. Nobody does.
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