06-19-2008, 12:20 AM | #761 | |
Kraken King
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Under the sea
Posts: 2,714
|
Quote:
And by institution, I mean they are organized, they center around a pastor, and a loose hierarchy below him for the most part.
__________________
One of my top ten favorite movies. "You ever try to flick a fly? "No." "It's a waste of time." "Can you see it?" "No." "It's right there!" "Where? "There!" "What is it?" "A crab." "A crab? I dont see any crab." "How?! It's right there!!" "Where?" "There!!!!" "Oh." -Excerpts from A Tale of Two Morons |
|
06-19-2008, 12:23 AM | #762 |
The Ñoldóran
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Mishawaka, IN
Posts: 2,050
|
Quakers aren't.
Of course, Protestants don't always claim them, either.
__________________
Then Celegorm no more would stay, And Curufin smiled and turned away... ~The Lay of Leithian |
06-19-2008, 12:27 AM | #763 |
Kraken King
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Under the sea
Posts: 2,714
|
I love Quackers. Some neat stuff to read about there. Now THAT, my friends would be a fun discussion, I think.
__________________
One of my top ten favorite movies. "You ever try to flick a fly? "No." "It's a waste of time." "Can you see it?" "No." "It's right there!" "Where? "There!" "What is it?" "A crab." "A crab? I dont see any crab." "How?! It's right there!!" "Where?" "There!!!!" "Oh." -Excerpts from A Tale of Two Morons |
06-19-2008, 12:29 AM | #764 | |||
Elf Lord
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Fountain Valley, CA
Posts: 6,343
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
__________________
If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." Last edited by Lief Erikson : 06-19-2008 at 12:34 AM. |
|||
06-19-2008, 12:31 AM | #765 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Fountain Valley, CA
Posts: 6,343
|
Yes. I don't know much about them at all.
__________________
If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." Last edited by Lief Erikson : 06-19-2008 at 12:35 AM. |
06-19-2008, 12:39 AM | #766 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,535
|
Quote:
This just MYSTIFIES me. First, "Protestants" aren't the same kind of group as "Catholics." Catholics have a top boss. His title is "The Pope." 'Protestants' come in a hundred types of organized flavors (like Lutheran, or United Methodist), and each of those has some organizational table. But there are other Christians (Orthodox, Mormon, Jehovah's Witness, just as a few) who have other systems...and lots of Christians who aren't members of any church at all.
__________________
That would be the swirling vortex to another world. Cool. I want one. TMNT No, I'm not emo. I just have a really poor sense of direction. (Thanks to katya for this quote) This is the best news story EVER! http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26087293/ “Often my haste is a mistake, but I live with the consequences without complaint.”...John McCain "I shall go back. And I shall find that therapist. And I shall whack her upside her head with my blanket full of rocks." ...Louisa May |
|
06-19-2008, 12:41 AM | #767 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Fountain Valley, CA
Posts: 6,343
|
Quote:
__________________
If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
|
06-19-2008, 02:22 AM | #768 |
The Ñoldóran
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Mishawaka, IN
Posts: 2,050
|
*raises eyebrow*
It's Quaker not Quacker. We're not ducks. I was raised Quaker, btw, and still consider myself to be one. A pagan one, it's true, but still Quaker. The two are in no way mutually exclusive.
__________________
Then Celegorm no more would stay, And Curufin smiled and turned away... ~The Lay of Leithian |
06-19-2008, 04:55 AM | #769 |
Elf Lady
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: In the lands where mountains are but a fairytale
Posts: 8,588
|
I was raised in a Protestant Church (well actually, it was Low Reformed, but recently it joined up with High Reformed, Re-reformed and New Re-reformed to form PKN: Protestant Churches Netherlands).
We most certainly do have an institution. There is a local circle overarched by the regional, provincial and national circle. It is registered as an organization/institution and the people in the national circle make up the "guidelines" the rest has to follow. True, they don't make rules and there isn't one person on top of it all, but it's an orderly whole nonetheless. Besides that, the church is part of an international network that meets up at least once a year to discuss problems like fragmentation, how to interpret some parts of the teachings, etc. It's not like people follow one charismatic leader. That is the case with the Evangelists and a lot of Baptist churches that split off from Evangelists. I myself also go to a Baptist Church that split off from the Protestants and their structure of the service is pretty much the same as in my own Church (yes I attend two) only the focus is not as much on God, as on Jesus. And in my Protestant Church people (95% is 70+ years old) think of faith and worshiping as grave business whereas the Baptists celebrate and rejoice. Perhaps this is different from the Protestants in America, I don't know, but here some High Protestant churches are still very close to Catholicism, and the open churches with charismatic leaders and no organization at all are the Evangelists. Protestants are perceived to be boring and very very strict and too institutionalized. (The Dutch Bible Belt has indeed some very very strict religious villages: wear black, wear a skirt, wear a hat and whatmore)
__________________
Love always, deeply and true ★ Friends are those rare people who ask how we are and then wait to hear the answer. ★ Friendship is sharing openly, laughing often, trusting always, caring deeply.
...The Earth laughs in flowers ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson, "Hamatreya"... |
06-19-2008, 09:27 AM | #770 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,535
|
"A Protestant Church. My point is 2-fold.
First, There is One-Holy-And-Apostolic-Roman-Catholic-Church which covers people commonly referred to as "Catholic." Like a town that has a mayor. 'Protestant' churches are neighboring towns. They each have their own mayor. The Episcopalians have a mayor, the Church of Christ has a mayor, and so on. Then there are other Christians, mostly "Protestant" who 'live in the suburbs'. They have neighborhoods, but no 'mayor'. They are not registered members of any church, but they identify as "Christian", may attend services around Christmas or Easter, or get married by a Christian officiant. Not all of them have a paster, or formal church organization. They differ from their neighbors who are Muslim, or Jewish, or Bahai, but they don't have the same "organization" that the denominations do. Protestant qua Protestant is not the same, organizationally, as Catholic.
__________________
That would be the swirling vortex to another world. Cool. I want one. TMNT No, I'm not emo. I just have a really poor sense of direction. (Thanks to katya for this quote) This is the best news story EVER! http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26087293/ “Often my haste is a mistake, but I live with the consequences without complaint.”...John McCain "I shall go back. And I shall find that therapist. And I shall whack her upside her head with my blanket full of rocks." ...Louisa May |
06-19-2008, 10:36 AM | #771 | ||
Elf Lady
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: In the lands where mountains are but a fairytale
Posts: 8,588
|
I'm sorry Sis, I don't think I get it
For as far as I know this: Quote:
But this: Quote:
If you are a Protestant, then you are a formal member of the church, whether you go or not, and yearly you get asked to donate some money. You are registered and you are assigned to a dominee (viccar? priest? pastor?) and pastoral worker who you can turn to. The whole housegroup or circle thing is not a Protestant thing, though you can attend 'courses' etc. which are often in someone's home, but led by the dominee or pastoral worker. Someone who studied for it anyway.
__________________
Love always, deeply and true ★ Friends are those rare people who ask how we are and then wait to hear the answer. ★ Friendship is sharing openly, laughing often, trusting always, caring deeply.
...The Earth laughs in flowers ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson, "Hamatreya"... |
||
06-19-2008, 11:02 AM | #772 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,535
|
Quote:
"Protestant" is a fairly generic term in the US. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protestantism I wish I could draw a chart. It would have Christians starting as 2 trunks, RC and Eastern, then the RC branch splits again at Martin Luther, and becomes twigs for various groups. "Protestant" encompasses the whole batch of stems and twigs that starts with Luther.
__________________
That would be the swirling vortex to another world. Cool. I want one. TMNT No, I'm not emo. I just have a really poor sense of direction. (Thanks to katya for this quote) This is the best news story EVER! http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26087293/ “Often my haste is a mistake, but I live with the consequences without complaint.”...John McCain "I shall go back. And I shall find that therapist. And I shall whack her upside her head with my blanket full of rocks." ...Louisa May |
|
06-19-2008, 11:04 AM | #773 |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,535
|
Oh, and without a state church, no one asks you to donate money. You have to walk in and volunteer.
*bashes rule*
__________________
That would be the swirling vortex to another world. Cool. I want one. TMNT No, I'm not emo. I just have a really poor sense of direction. (Thanks to katya for this quote) This is the best news story EVER! http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26087293/ “Often my haste is a mistake, but I live with the consequences without complaint.”...John McCain "I shall go back. And I shall find that therapist. And I shall whack her upside her head with my blanket full of rocks." ...Louisa May |
06-19-2008, 11:19 AM | #774 |
Elf Lady
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: In the lands where mountains are but a fairytale
Posts: 8,588
|
I just checked the Dutch pages on Protestantism, but it's very confusing. Too many churches that call themselves "reformed" or something like that.
Apparently the church I'm used to, is the largest church in the Netherlands though. I never knew
__________________
Love always, deeply and true ★ Friends are those rare people who ask how we are and then wait to hear the answer. ★ Friendship is sharing openly, laughing often, trusting always, caring deeply.
...The Earth laughs in flowers ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson, "Hamatreya"... |
06-19-2008, 12:01 PM | #775 |
Dread Mothy Lord and Halfwitted Apprentice Loremaster
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Thomas Aquinas College, Santa Paula, CA
Posts: 10,820
|
More like Christians starting as one trunk, then a shoot called Assyrian splitting off, then an Armenian, a Coptic, an Ethiopian, and a Syrian shoot breaking off to make a Miuphysite branch, and THEN the big Chalcedonian branch splits into RC and Eastern, and everything follows as you state. Assuming, of course, that we're only considering groups that are still around today.
__________________
Crux fidelis, inter omnes arbor una nobilis. Nulla talem silva profert, fronde, flore, germine. Dulce lignum, dulce clavo, dulce pondus sustinens. 'With a melon?' - Eric Idle |
06-19-2008, 04:10 PM | #776 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Fountain Valley, CA
Posts: 6,343
|
Quote:
Nautipus, I'll wait for your less exhausted reply . Too bad you don't live nearby . Oh well. Hey, do you live near Washington DC? I'm taking a journalism class there this summer.
__________________
If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
|
06-25-2008, 11:51 PM | #777 |
Elven Warrior
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: in the one town with that weird name that i can;t seem to think of...*luaghes* but its a funny name!
Posts: 238
|
Hey, im new this place. Anyways im wanting to join in and debate so yeah...i'll just wait for a moment to really jump in and talk but wanted to say HI. For now I'll tell you I'm a hardcore Jesus Freak, but in this debate I will question everyone so that even the ones I agree with will be hit hard....I think its great to question everyone so that they can realize why they believe what they believe instead of believing out of habit. O and if this all sounds weird I'm sorry, its late here.
__________________
One Love, One God, One Way! -Me- Do you trust me? I can show you the world -Aladdin- If home is where the heart is, then my home is where you are! -Relient K, I'm taking you with me- |
06-26-2008, 12:39 AM | #778 |
The Ñoldóran
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Mishawaka, IN
Posts: 2,050
|
Welcome Azrael. I think if you've read this thread you'll see quite easily that there's nobody here believing what they believe out of habit...
__________________
Then Celegorm no more would stay, And Curufin smiled and turned away... ~The Lay of Leithian |
06-26-2008, 12:45 AM | #779 | |
Elf Lord
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Fountain Valley, CA
Posts: 6,343
|
Quote:
Just to let you know, the people (Christians and non-Christians alike) present are active on this thread because they do think about what they believe. I don't think you'll find anyone here who just believes out of habit. I personally recommend that you only question people when you genuinely want to know why they think what they do, rather than to make sure they know their stuff. Because the latter kind of questioning can come across as arrogant, even if it's not meant that way. You aren't our tutor . I'm very glad you're going to join the discussion!!!
__________________
If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." Last edited by Lief Erikson : 06-26-2008 at 12:47 AM. |
|
06-26-2008, 12:54 AM | #780 | |
The Ñoldóran
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Mishawaka, IN
Posts: 2,050
|
Quote:
__________________
Then Celegorm no more would stay, And Curufin smiled and turned away... ~The Lay of Leithian |
|
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Science | ayarella | General Messages | 804 | 04-13-2012 09:05 PM |
muslims PART 2 | Spock | General Messages | 805 | 02-03-2011 03:16 AM |
Theological Opinions | Nurvingiel | General Messages | 992 | 02-10-2006 04:15 PM |
REAL debate thread for RELIGION | Ruinel | General Messages | 1439 | 04-01-2005 02:47 PM |
Offshoot discussion of "what religion are you" thread | Rían | General Messages | 2289 | 01-08-2004 02:31 AM |