Classical Music

[trolls' bane]

What is the Il Divo?

[Last Child of Ungoliant]

Il Divo is a group of opera singers, very good ones

[trolls' bane]

What do they sing?

[Last Child of Ungoliant]

they did an operatic arrangement of 'Unbreak My Heart' (Regressa Mi),
they have done Nella Fantasia, Io Ti Amero and lots of others
Il Divo

[Embladyne]

One of my favourite performance groups is Anonymous 4. I love how beautifully they sing renaissance songs. Sadly, they no longer tour, and I managed to miss them when they came through Seattle.

[Mercutio]

I just got this cd.

It has William Grant Still's Symphony #1 (absolutely love it) as well as Duke Ellington's Suite From 'The River'.

[hectorberlioz]

Originally Posted by trolls' bane

I got a few new CD's since my last post in this thread. I now have "25 Thunderous Classics," "25 Symphony Favorites," "25 Concerto Favorites," "Great Classical Marches," and the "Carmina Burana."

A good "Best of" series is RCA Victors, especially their Copland, Rachmaninov, and Gershwin. I rarely get best of cds unless its rescuing them from the Evil Pot of Destruction in some record store.

[hectorberlioz]

Originally Posted by Embladyne

One of my favourite performance groups is Anonymous 4. I love how beautifully they sing renaissance songs. Sadly, they no longer tour, and I managed to miss them when they came through Seattle.

There was a group in Nashville, just days ago, that performed old renaissance songs (secular). Looked good, but I would prefer just listening on disc.
Anonymous 4 has done some really good stuff. 11,000 virgins by Hildegard- I heard a bit of that at a Borders store in Atlanta. I was really impressed.


btw, Troll's Bane, I never was able to get to your site...the link is messed up or something...

[hectorberlioz]

The Ninth Symphony

By Samuel Stephens


For Anton Bruckner and Gustav Mahler writing a ninth symphony was like filling out your own death certificate. The fact that both Beethoven and Schubert died leaving nine symphonies was a frightening prospect. [Crude sentence here…]

However, both Bruckner and Mahler wrote more than nine symphonies. Bruckner wrote two symphonies before he wrote what is now his official first. Mahler wrote three before he wrote his “Titan” symphony (no.1), but burned them apparently unsatisfied.
When writing his ninth, Mahler became ill and suspected that death was near; so he crossed out the title and renamed it “Das Lied von Der Erde”, and proceeded with a tenth, which is now called Symphony No.9. “Really this is the tenth, because ‘Das Lied’ was really the ninth”, he remarked to his wife, Alma when writing it.
Gustav Mahler died in 1911, leaving behind two movements of his Symphony No.10. Beethoven also began on a tenth symphony.

Schubert wrote nine, no.7 is unorchestrated and no.8 is missing two movements. It has been debated extensively as to whether only two movements were written in the first place. Schubert handed the score of the eighth to Anselm Huttenbrenner in 1822. A theory of mine is that if only two movements were composed, there might be some written words as to why; but there isn’t, and the most likely explanation is that Huttenbrenner lost the last two parts of the score. Also by Schubert is the Gmunden-Gastein Symphony, a mysterious work that has never showed up.
In ‘The Lives of the Great Composers’, Harold C. Schonberg writes…

One theory used to be that Schubert’s grand duo for piano four hands was a reduction of the Gmunden-Gastein symphony, but nobody takes that idea very seriously today. Another theory, taken seriously by some musicologists, is that the Gmunden-Gastein symphony is really the first version of the great C major symphony, and that it was composed in 1825.

Two other prominent composers to write ninths are Antonin Dvorak and Ralph Vaughn Williams.
Arnold Schoenberg in 1913 wrote, “It seems that the ninth is the limit. He who wanted to go beyond must leave…those wrote nine were too close to the beyond.

It must be noted that Ninth Symphonies are always important.
-Beethoven’s was the first to use a chorus.
-Schubert’s is called the “Great” (so named by Robert Schumann, who found it.), and most critics agree, saying that it is Schubert’s true masterpiece.
-Bruckner’s ninth was very important to him, and he planned to write a choral ending as i Beethoven’s. He got as far as three movements.

-Dvorak’s Ninth is probably the most popular after Beethoven’s. Undoubtedly, it is that composers most popular work. Subtitled “From the new world, it is a symphony depicting (so the composer said) the American landscape. Integrated into it are old African hymns and spirituals. “The song of Hiawatha” can be heard in the second movement.
-Mahler’s Ninth is his swansong. That is what is said, and Mahler always was a
Sentimentalist, so there is little reason to doubt it.
-Vaughn Williams wrote his ninth in



Despite Schoenberg’s comment and all the other superstitions about writing Ninth Symphonies, many composers have successfully written past the No.9.
Dmitry Shostakovich wrote fifteen, Miaskovsky wrote twenty-four.

Blah blah blah, I’ll give you the rest later….

[hectorberlioz]

hmmph! you guys are mean! where's Fat Middle?

anyways, I recently got Berlioz's Les troyens opera-how glorious it is!!

[trolls' bane]

Oh, sorry...

Originally Posted by hectorberlioz

btw, Troll's Bane, I never was able to get to your site...the link is messed up or something...

Here it is again:
Brendan's Classical Music

I have a message board for it, but it is incomplete, and confusing.

[Mercutio]

Ok hb you asked for it...

~

For Anton Bruckner and Gustav Mahler, writing a ninth symphony was equivalent to filling out their own death certificates. The fact that both Beethoven and Schubert died leaving nine symphonies was a frightening prospect. [Crude sentence here…]

Both Bruckner and Mahler, however, went on to write more than nine symphonies. Bruckner wrote two symphonies before composing what is his ‘official’ first (Symphony No. 1 in C Minor, 1866). Mahler wrote three before his “Titan” (Symphony No. 1 in D Major, 1888), but burned them apparently unsatisfied.

When writing his ninth symphony, Mahler became ill and suspected that death was near. He crossed out the title, renaming it Das Lied von der Erde, and proceeded with a tenth: A Symphony for Tenor, Baritone (or Contralto) and Orchestra (1910). He would not call it Symphony No. 9, its current title, believing that a ninth symphony must be its composer's last. When writing it, Mahler also remarked to his wife, Alma, “Really this is the tenth, because ‘Das Lied’ was really the ninth.”

Gustav Mahler died a year later in 1911, leaving behind two movements of his Symphony No. 10. It is worthy to note that Beethoven also began work on a tenth symphony.

Franz Schubert wrote nine symphonies. Symphony No. 7 in ? Major/Minor is unorchestrated and Symphony No. 8 in B Minor is missing two movements. It has been debated extensively whether only two movements were written in the first place. If Schubert had indeed wrote only two movements, a written explanation is likely. Schubert had, however, given the score of No. 8 to Anselm Huttenbrenner in 1822. It is possible that Huttenbrenner lost the last two parts of the score.

~

My comments:

Are you sure Huttenbrenner could’ve lost it? I thought he was given mov. 1 & 2 and piano sketches for 3. It’s possible tho, I suppose.

For your last section (below) it might be good to note the following from program notes at http://www.pasadenasymphony.org/notes/concert7.htm

“Research by John Reed, Otto Biba, and Robert Winter in the 1970s and 1980s cleared up several of the nagging problems in regard to the history of the Great Symphony. Supposed to have been composed in 1828 and long considered Schubert’s last symphony, the Great was actually begun in 1825 and completed in 1826; furthermore the supposedly lost “Gmunden-Gastein” symphony of 1825 was shown to be none other than the Great. In regard to the oft-mentioned lack of sketches for the work, Brian Newbould, author of Schubert and the Symphony (1992) and expert on Schubert’s sketched “Tenth” Symphony, has boldly hypothesized that Schubert may not have made any preliminary sketches before composing the Ninth (Great) in full score.”

your paragraph:

Also composed by Schubert is the Gmunden-Gastein Symphony (18??), a mysterious work that has never been found. In The Lives of the Great Composers, Harold C. Schonberg discusses two theories. The first, not taken very seriously today, is that Scubert’s Grand Duo for Piano- Four Hands is a reduction of the Gmunden-Gastein. Some musicologists believe that Gmunden-Gastein is the first version of the Symphony in C Major (The Great; 1828).


And all the titles of works, including abrieviations (like merely No. 8) are italicized. They are in the word doc I emailed you.

[Embladyne]

Originally Posted by hectorberlioz

Anonymous 4 has done some really good stuff. 11,000 virgins by Hildegard- I heard a bit of that at a Borders store in Atlanta. I was really impressed.

Ah, yes. Hildegard. I really appreciate how different her compositions are from those of her contemporaries, and she most deifinitely wrote for women's voices.

Mercutio, I hadn't really thought about 9th symphonies in quite so ominous a way before. Now, however, although I haven't written any symphonies so far, I'm kind of worried about writing a 9th one. Well, since I work similarly to Ravel, and compose more than one peice at a time, and often companion peices, it may not ever be a problem.

[hectorberlioz]

Originally Posted by Mercutio

Ok hb you asked for it...

~

For Anton Bruckner and Gustav Mahler, writing a ninth symphony was equivalent to filling out their own death certificates. The fact that both Beethoven and Schubert died leaving nine symphonies was a frightening prospect. [Crude sentence here…]

Both Bruckner and Mahler, however, went on to write more than nine symphonies. Bruckner wrote two symphonies before composing what is his ‘official’ first (Symphony No. 1 in C Minor, 1866). Mahler wrote three before his “Titan” (Symphony No. 1 in D Major, 1888), but burned them apparently unsatisfied.

When writing his ninth symphony, Mahler became ill and suspected that death was near. He crossed out the title, renaming it Das Lied von der Erde, and proceeded with a tenth: A Symphony for Tenor, Baritone (or Contralto) and Orchestra (1910). He would not call it Symphony No. 9, its current title, believing that a ninth symphony must be its composer's last. When writing it, Mahler also remarked to his wife, Alma, “Really this is the tenth, because ‘Das Lied’ was really the ninth.”

Gustav Mahler died a year later in 1911, leaving behind two movements of his Symphony No. 10. It is worthy to note that Beethoven also began work on a tenth symphony.

Franz Schubert wrote nine symphonies. Symphony No. 7 in ? Major/Minor is unorchestrated and Symphony No. 8 in B Minor is missing two movements. It has been debated extensively whether only two movements were written in the first place. If Schubert had indeed wrote only two movements, a written explanation is likely. Schubert had, however, given the score of No. 8 to Anselm Huttenbrenner in 1822. It is possible that Huttenbrenner lost the last two parts of the score.

~

My comments:

Are you sure Huttenbrenner could’ve lost it? I thought he was given mov. 1 & 2 and piano sketches for 3. It’s possible tho, I suppose.

For your last section (below) it might be good to note the following from program notes at http://www.pasadenasymphony.org/notes/concert7.htm

“Research by John Reed, Otto Biba, and Robert Winter in the 1970s and 1980s cleared up several of the nagging problems in regard to the history of the Great Symphony. Supposed to have been composed in 1828 and long considered Schubert’s last symphony, the Great was actually begun in 1825 and completed in 1826; furthermore the supposedly lost “Gmunden-Gastein” symphony of 1825 was shown to be none other than the Great. In regard to the oft-mentioned lack of sketches for the work, Brian Newbould, author of Schubert and the Symphony (1992) and expert on Schubert’s sketched “Tenth” Symphony, has boldly hypothesized that Schubert may not have made any preliminary sketches before composing the Ninth (Great) in full score.”

your paragraph:

Also composed by Schubert is the Gmunden-Gastein Symphony (18??), a mysterious work that has never been found. In The Lives of the Great Composers, Harold C. Schonberg discusses two theories. The first, not taken very seriously today, is that Scubert’s Grand Duo for Piano- Four Hands is a reduction of the Gmunden-Gastein. Some musicologists believe that Gmunden-Gastein is the first version of the Symphony in C Major (The Great; 1828).


And all the titles of works, including abrieviations (like merely No. 8) are italicized. They are in the word doc I emailed you.

Ouch! that's some good editing!
The problem is that its so different from the original, I'd feel guilty to have it published under my name...

[hectorberlioz]

I recently got two versions of Alexander Nevsky, by Prokofiev. And I got a Sibelius disc, with Finlandia and some symphonic poems, and I got a Delius disc, also with programmatic music

[trolls' bane]

Okay, now I have a few questions. What are those abbreviations? Like Op. and WVB (or something like that).

[jellyfishannah]

Originally Posted by trolls' bane

Okay, now I have a few questions. What are those abbreviations? Like Op. and WVB (or something like that).

Op. is opus?

Where did you see WVB?

[trolls' bane]

I don't know. I saw it once at least, on the Ride of the Valkyries, on both of the CD's that I have that have it.

[Last Child of Ungoliant]

yes Op. is opus, referring to a unique reference number for a piece of music, dont know about WVB either

[trolls' bane]

Thank you. I always wondered that.