*Discussion Thread* Of Nazgûl-Kings-Friends-Rings Campaign (Calling all Nazgûl II)

[Rían]

Hey guys, are there a pre-determined things that are going to happen, or is this totally make-up-as-you-go? I'm trying to figure out what rpg-Rian is going to be doing and how she'll be fitting in. Should I know about anything?

[Valandil]

Rian - from my limited RPG experience, I think we're making it up as we go along. But we can certainly plan certain actions (especially if we see an imminent opportunity) or orchestrate something or other.

Gordis - OK, I modified the wording about Estelmo's view of Ilmenzor - just enough to make it fit that Ilmenzor could be a good deal younger - yet he was also a full-grown man as Estelmo was.

Don't know if Valandil may like Aiwendis or not... he hasn't met her yet (and neither have we... )

[The last sane person]

WHOOPS, posted the same time Val. My characters are floating around waiting for their King's action plan....Are we supposed to be on the watch out for anything? Or can they go goof off with what ever distractions come their way?

Oh yeah, edited my post that Val isnt in it...and I went over to lilly, for what ever she want marty an ray for.

[Rían]

Val, do you mind the fan-girl theme? I think it's certainly something that would definitely happen, and it could be fun! If that's ok with you, is it ok if we continue to use Annawen, or should I start a new character or two?

[Valandil]

I don't think Val has picked up any bad vibes yet. He came down here with a little apprehension about meeting the chancellor - but it was more personal/political related than academic. And he figures that will just happen and then he'll see how to take it from there. He has NO IDEA about what is brewing around here.

I mean - the Chancellor knew his father and his brothers - and was captured and tortured while defending the old family estates. It would be easy to imagine that Valandil might think he 'owes' him something. And... Val has had some unpleasant experiences dealing with his first cousin, King Meneldil of Gondor - so he's not sure what to expect in that regard from this second cousin of his.

Not sure how close Val actually IS with Marty and Ray... I almost imagine he might have just initially agreed to let them come because their antics might keep his true 'keepers' somewhat busy - and thereby help him get around them - inadvertently. I actually didn't imagine anyone picking them up as player characters though - so that early concept is easy enough to abandon.

Valandil was born in Rivendell, and raised there until he claimed the throne of Arnor in his 21st year. Either or both could be early boyhood friends if they were from the Mithiethel (Hoarwell) River Dunedain settlements. Otherwise, they could have met wherever Val did his undergrad - I'm thinking Emyn Beraid, unless he just went to school at Annuminas.

In either case - for now we're all just in basic 'student mode' - as far as we're concerned. Until enough happens to really raise suspicions.

[Valandil]

Originally Posted by RÃ*an

Val, do you mind the fan-girl theme? I think it's certainly something that would definitely happen, and it could be fun! If that's ok with you, is it ok if we continue to use Annawen, or should I start a new character or two?

Well - I had actually been waiting for something totally untrue about it to hit the streets from the tabloids. You saw my "Sindariel" post, didn't you? Another one or two? Woo-boy! I keep trying to imagine what this would be like in real life!

Still though - with serious observation, I think it wouldn't be surprising if lots of eligible young ladies flocked to an eligible young royal. (EDIT: How are things in UK with Prince William & Prince Harry... and THEY're not even High Kings!)

[Lotesse]

I'm really of the opinion that at this point, just for the time being at least, we should just play all the characters we've already got, you guys, 'cause aren't there an awful lot right now? Do we REALLY need any more brand-new characters yet; we've gotten pretty well stocked up on 'em at this point, no? Which is all good, I'm just sayin'...

[The last sane person]

well, I think that the friends theme would be better, seeing as thats how I played them. Perhaps I shouldnt have, before knowing either realtions to him (val)...Oops.

[Valandil]

Originally Posted by The last sane person

well, I think that the friends theme would be better, seeing as thats how I played them. Perhaps I shouldnt have, before knowing either realtions to him (val)...Oops.

No it's fine - and probably more satisfying since they're actually player characters. Besides, I think 'friends' was probably my very first concept, but I thought of mischievously twisting it like that a little.

So - let's say they're friends - and yet R & M can probably afford to be a good deal more light-hearted about most things than V.

[Lotesse]

Shah - You're talking about Marty & Ray? The way you've been playing them all along is perfect the way it is now; why on earth should you have to change your characters after all this time, when they are quite clearly who they are, now? I LOVE your Marty & Ray, Shah, and their relationship with King Valandil seems IDEAL to me; remember the Rosencrantz and Guildenstern comparison? It's so well done, what you've done to this point, it would be a real shame if you had to alter them against their already established type. Meh.

[The last sane person]

I agree, I am glad that I playe them like that. Its what came naturally to me...Its what I have relation wise with two of my best pals. But being the young king, I think your right about them being a bit more light hearted than Valandil. I think that they would also play the part of a morale squad, to cheer the young king up a bit.

[Valandil]

That's fine too (I guess you're saying that they're very serious about being light-hearted?? ). And I agree with Lotesse - you're doing great!

PS - Earniel, or some other experienced RPG'er... is it unusual for the discussion thread to outsize the game thread by about 6 to 1?

[The last sane person]

I guess, yeah, they make it their solemn duty to cheer Val up.

Nope, Look at the TLA. And this is quite the rpg, lots of bouncing around ideas and almost no ooc in it.

[Earniel]

Originally Posted by Valandil

PS - Earniel, or some other experienced RPG'er... is it unusual for the discussion thread to outsize the game thread by about 6 to 1?

Discussion threads are usually bigger than the game threads because of all the things that has to be planned before actually starting. The TLA-discussion got closed at page 77 for being too big, but then that thread had been used for three games and was following books so plots didn't have to be that discussed and planned with too many details.

Naah, you lot are just extremely talkative!

[Gordis]

Thanks for editing your post, Val.

Yes, Estelmo should have served in Minas Ithil as Elendur's esquire, while Ilmenzor's father (Veantur? is that name OK?) was the Captain of the Moon Tower. Ilmenzor himself was in Minas Anor serving Anarion.
When the war started in 3429, Ilmenzor stayed in Gondor with Anarion and for 5 years led incessant desperate assaults on Minas Ithil, before he got captured early in 3434.
Estelmo followed Elendur and Isildur to the North and returned with the army of the Last Alliance. It was Elendur's and Cirion's host that finally recaptured Minas Ithil later in 3434. Therefore, Estelmo saw Ilmenzor right after he was rescued from the dungeons. Let us assume that Ilmenzor was too weak to participate in the War again, and remained in a hospital in Minas Anor till the end of the war in 3441. Then for 2 years Isildur dwelt in Minas Anor (along with Elendur & Estelmo) instructing Meneldil.

So, Estelmo saw a great deal of Ilmenzor AFTER he was rescued from his captivity and had his interactions with the Morgul Lord. I think Estelmo felt that Ilmenzor was not in his right mind anymore after the dungeons, as it was a very traumatic experience.

[Valandil]

Gordis - so you don't want to think about a 5-year captivity, huh?

One slight correction. I think Isildur & Co would have dwelt mostly in Osgiliath for those 2 years, rather than Minas Anor - because Osgiliath was the capital and biggest city, and the place from which he and Anarion had previously ruled. Minas Anor was more of a royal palace (and fortress) than a city at that time, I believe.

Why would you have father & son split up though? Just to avoid that much more shared experience between the true Ilmenzor and Estelmo? In some ways, I like Ilmenzor having been at Minas Ithil all along - and Val truly feeling that he does 'owe him something'. You certainly have the final say though - especially since I don't know all about your reasons, etc.

[Gordis]

Originally Posted by Valandil

Gordis - so you don't want to think about a 5-year captivity, huh?

No, I prefer not. Five years is a hell of a long time to spend in a dungeon.

But more than that, I want Ilmenzor to be a war-hero, not a martyr figure. I doubt real Ilmenzor was able to fight after his captivity. Actually he must have been half-mad when rescued, apart from being unfit physically.
So let him attack Minas Ithil for 5 years, causing the Morgul Lord to hate him. Then his interest in breaking the captive's mind is more justified.

Originally Posted by Valandil

One slight correction. I think Isildur & Co would have dwelt mostly in Osgiliath for those 2 years, rather than Minas Anor - because Osgiliath was the capital and biggest city, and the place from which he and Anarion had previously ruled. Minas Anor was more of a royal palace (and fortress) than a city at that time, I believe.

Ok, I agree. Ilmenzor's hospital in Osgiliath as well?

Originally Posted by Valandil

Why would you have father & son split up though? Just to avoid that much more shared experience between the true Ilmenzor and Estelmo? In some ways, I like Ilmenzor having been at Minas Ithil all along - and Val truly feeling that he does 'owe him something'. You certainly have the final say though - especially since I don't know all about your reasons, etc.

No problem here, if you prefer not to split father and son, fine with me.
Let Ilmenzor retreat, protecting Isildur and Elendur, while his father, Veantur, was cut off in the Moon Tower and died along with his wife and a couple of other children.
Agreed?
I will have to change the long-suffering post #86 (I even remember the number by now).

And, Val, I think Valandil and the Chancellor are third-cousins.

[Gordis]

I have changed #86 thusly

“Well, the Chancellor, Lord Ilmenzor, is the King’s third cousin. He is the great-grandson of the younger brother of Amandil, our King’s great-granddad. But though he is of the same generation, he is older than our King and fought in the War. His father was Captain of Minas Ithil, under King Isildur. When the War started, the enemy sacked the City in his first stroke. King Isildur barely escaped, but the Captain and his family were not so fortunate. They perished, defending the Citadel to the last man. Lord Ilmenzor was King Isildur's esquire at the time, and they fought their way out, but Ilmenzor was the only one left of the whole family, and wowed to make the Nameless Enemy pay for it. When Lord Isildur went North to seek help from his father, Lord Ilmenzor remained in Gondor with King Anarion. Many assaults had he led on the Moon city, but the accursed Ulairi held it fast"

I even made Ilmenzor Isildur's esquire, a fitting position for a young relative. He must have known Elendur's esquire Estelmo quite well.

I suppose, after the escape from M. Ithil, Ilmenzor asked Isildur to leave him behind in Gondor, as he was still uncertain about his family's fate, and wished to help to free them or to avenge them.

[CrazySquirrel]

Shah, I am sorry, but you have greeted Lilly twice. You forgot you were already telling her the chancellor's story that same evening, posts 86-87
Otherwise, nice post .Please be kind to poor distressed Lilly.

Gor, why not let Five have Commerce? The more young handsome guys there the better. Some girls would be distracted from wooing Val. Dont you want him to marry Aiwendis?

Val - Super-Killer posts!

[Lotesse]

Nice, TD and CS! I had a terrific scene written out in my head last night for us Nazgul, and was unable to post it because my boyfriend wanted me to get off the computer to go to sleep, and so I lost it. MEH!!! I hate losing my inspired moments like that; my muse strikes seldom but when she does, if I don't write, I can never recapture what it was in my head at that particular inspired moment. And my best inspiration is in the middle of the night. RRRrrrrrr...