The World Trade Center and Pentagon Collapsed due to terrorist attack

[Mathron]

Your example and arguments don't really relate. With the priest situation - sure, they should be alert and alarmed. Should priests be forever banned from entering banks? I don't think so. And you are advocating this to be applied to ALL Arabs - not just illegal immigrants.

You mention crazy americans. Should we assume all americans are, thus, crazy?

Your opinions are your own, in the end. I hope you learn something, and calm down, and perhaps learn to forgive, as well as not to cast blame so quickly. I hope, as well, you do not act on your prejudices, but at least stop to think about things - and concentrate on the guilty being brought to justice, and not innocents.

[AACHOO]

Take one step to the left or right of the tree in front of you.

Stop squinting.

Look around.

Well! I'll be! Its a Forest!








been up since 0510 cdt 09-11-2001.going to sleep.

[Lief Erikson]

I'll be praying tonight for those who have suffered from these heinous acts of cruelty, as I have been since the day the bombing happened. But not least on my prayers will be the other Muslim Americans, or any of those who are from the Middle East and could be eventually suffering from hate violence. It has to be controlled. The removal of the Japanese from America during World War II was terrible, but simply because certain Arabs were likely responsible for this act does not mean we should be filled with anger at all of them. Consider Hitler, consider the Nazis. Should we, because of their horrible deeds wipe out all Germans? Most of the people of Germany believed he was doing the right thing, does that mean every German in existence should have been either wiped out or forcibly removed from America or from other Allied countries? The destruction of China at the hands of the Japanese during World War II . . . should we wipe out Japan? Certain African Americans were actually burned at the stake by white Americans while they tried to get their freedom in the Civil Rights Movement. Should we nuke the rest of America while we're at it?

You talk about six Arabs dressed as priests holding up a bank? How often are white Americans, looking just like anyone else, responsible for crime? Sin is universal, it does not accumulate in one race. There is no 'master race' and there is no 'inferior race'. There is only the human race.

The bombing is only the most recent act of cruelty that has happened in a world dotted with horrible deeds. They've happened since man first came into being and they still happen today.

What I see in what has happened is, perhaps, an opportunity to turn something that was terribly evil into an eventual good. Russia, China, France, Britain, Austria, Norway and many other countries have offered their assistance and condolence for the Americans. With the help of the world, perhaps the battle against terrorism can begin on many different fronts. I hope that even besides the group that is behind the attack on the World Trade Center, more groups involved in terrorism might be rooted out. Even though it is impossible to get them all -- we'll likely never accomplish that feat -- taking out the larger ones will be a massive benefit to the safety of the world and to people everywhere.

I believe that hunting down those responsible and neutralizing them is certainly the best thing to do, but there are many other ways for us Americans to help in this than to attempt to fight on our own. Harassing other Americans who you believe responsible, because of race or otherwise is simply wrong and is absolutely detrimental to the cause that President Bush and our governmental leaders are trying to fulfill. Right now is the time when we have to be united, not tearing at ourself on the inside, or biting out hateful, angry or blind words at people outside the country.

The singing and dancing in Middle East countries is obviously wrong, but how are you to know if that is the general atmosphere? And even if it is, look more closely at the situation and consider the cause. Why have they done this, and why do they hate us to such a level? Obviously they have some way to clear this atrocity in their own minds, whether by dehumanizing us or taking on your perspective ACHOO, of when there is a war everyone being involved in it, civilian or soldier alike.

Although nothing can possibly justify such a horrible and brutal deed as has been done, we have to widen our perspectives and look from all sides of the story, not our own limited and biased view.

[juntel]

A handfull of (presumed) arabic-speaking people provoke an atrocity causing the death of thousands of innocents.
Some muslims are seen to rejoice because of this, in some well selected video shots; along i'm sure with similar interviews.

But is this really all the picture? Is this representative of all arabs and all muslims?

Or do you (AACHOO and the likes) rejoice that finally you may go out and kill people?

How else explain that you discard the other side shown were arabs and muslim expressed condolences, not condoning such an act?
Of course, you won't believe them.
You don't want to believe them.
You don't want to see them as civilians so you can without pity go and kill them.

In the end, you speak the same language as these atrocious terrorists: you justify the attrocities you want to act on innocents by demonizing them.
The lives of the innocents in each of these cities you want to nuke means nothing to you, just as the lives of the innocents in the WTC meant nothing to the terrorists.

"One Islamic Capitol a day-One Tactical Nuclear Cruise Missle a day until ALL Terrorists are DEAD or Handed in CHAINS to America. "

Oh! and of course, how can you know that all the terrorists are dead? How do you know if there aren't many left elsewhere?
You probably have in mind to utterly destroy these countries, leaving not one arab nor muslim alive. Or maybe keep these countries under military occupation forever?

The terrorists would be proud of you.
That's what they want from you.
Among extremists, you understand each other very well.

These terrorists don't want peace between their people and the west.
They don't want any compromise.
They don't want coexistence, they don't want peacefull cooperation between people of different religions.
They think their religion (in their own interpretation of it) is the only one, all others being evil.
And they would do anything to put a wedge into any diplomatic procedure.

And with people like you, aachoo, they find the perfect exemple to present to their people; they want you to be the representative element of what america is.

Probably thirty (30) terrorists, probably during many months in america, prepared carefully and methodically their mad suicide, with enough intelligence to outsmart all securities.
And you would think that they didn't know there would be retaliations from the US???
Their accolytes are probably disapointed that the US isn't already attacking muslim countries cities. Disapointed that there aren't little aachoo's with their guns running around gunning down innocent civilians.
.
.
.
AACHOO, you might try to deny your racism, but it's there in your words: "By the actions of others a blanket of suspicion must be cast. 4,5,6 Arabs capable of hijacking an airline." (emphasis mine).
No. Not true. You are self-deluded. Take 6 arabs in the streets, at random, and they can't hijack a plane. No more than I.
Make no mistake, your blanket of suspicion is what makes you a racist.


"There will be only one side now – America's."

Take one step to the left or right of the tree in front of you.
Stop squinting.
Look around.
Well! I'll be! Its a whole colorfull multicultural World!

[easterlinge]

I'm not sure attacking other countries is a good answer. No government was behind this, as far as we know. Retaliating against a country/government would likely build up even more resentment, and possibly provoke more undesirable incidents.

If any action is done, I think it'll be a "cloak and dagger" kind of action. Mobile phone bombs and poisoned drinks rather than cruise missiles.

One thing niggles at me. When Hizbollah, Hamas, PLO (in the 1970's), Tamil Tigers (they use suicide bombers too), and other zealot groups hit their targets, they would proudly proclaim responsibliity, fully expecting and even welcoming armed response.

But yesterday Usamah bin Laden issued a statement denying that he did it. I think a fearless man such as he would not be afraid to claim responsibility, surely? It doesn't mesh with what we know about zealot groups. If he really did it, he would admit it, I think.

So how do we know it was really he?

I'm only saying this because if American agents go haring off after the wrong guy, the real perpetrator is free to do it again.

[Lief Erikson]

If a government supports the mass murder of thousands of innocent civilians, I think the declaration of war is probably a good idea. Plus the added possibility that whatever government is responsible get yellow at the chance of complete destruction and turn the culprits in. There might not be a government, true, but agents are rooting up every trail they come across, which is about 2000 at present, so I doubt they'll get away. Especially when so many countries have offered to support us.

I don't think that Bin Laden would declare it if he did do the crime. No one would be the stupid, however fanatic they are. I don't know any of them personally, but they wouldn't simply go out looking for death. If they declared it, every single state would remove any support or financing they were giving him and he'd die within days . . . hours, more likely. It wasn't death for himself whoever is behind this was seeking, although it might have been done to disrupt relations between America and the Middle East.

[Mathron]

In the past, most terrorrist attacks have been to make a point. This was not - it was, truly, an act of war, designed to cripple america. Targets included our economy, our military, and our political head.

Bin Laden made his statement, that though he supported it, he did not do it. If he did it, this is likely the best thing he could say - the US can not act on his feelings or words, but only once they have evidence he did it. He obviously cannot express condolences - that would be a lie. So this is the only statement he really could make.

[samwise of the shire]

Aaachoo you dont need to pity them because they cheered in the streets it will just continue if we do. All we have to do for this is IGNORE THEM and FORGIVE THEM for what they are doing.No save your pity for Americans, the Americans who have thrown Rocks through American Masque windows and made phone threats.
Save your pity for those Christian leaders that have NOT done anything about this, whether to condemn American Churches to the blasphemies they teach, or whether it was to talk about it and give people the true Christian response to our enemies,save it for the Radio programs that sing suposedly in honour of God but are really spitting in his face because they are NOT telling people the importence of repentence.And save your pity for those Middle eastern families whos sons and husband and father died while thinking they would go to heaven.Save your pity for them. And yes I think we should greive with those families who lost loved ones on those planes and in those buildings.
Aaachoo I think your statement of the blood and money you made was totally and absolutley unessicary, it's good you did that but other people are doing the same or more,and some people cannot at all do what you did.
Sam

[Spock]

Well there's always: "kill them all and let God sort them out".

We know who and where but perhaps not exactly when to strike. Let our resolve remain strong.

[Ñólendil]

I'd like to quote from a few posts on another forum (on another website altogether) regarding this terrible tragedy.

This from a post of a US resident:

In the grand scheme of things, today's piddling politics and current religious permutations are meaningless. As history shows, agendas change, policies are skewed for expediency's sake and yesterday's enemies are tomorrow's allies. Which makes today's terrorist acts senseless in the extreme.

What does it prove? What motivation does it serve? Will it free a people? Does unshackle a nation or nations that have been in constant conflict for over 5000 years? No, but it will cause an escalation in hostility. Many more thousands will die as each side jockeys for the moral high ground while stepping on the piled bones of the innocent.

Justification has always been a contemptible pretext for war and terrorism. Was Allah's ends met and does he wait with open arms in the Seventh Heaven for his adherents who undoubtedly did this heinous act? Converseley, will Jesus be pleased by the marines landing on foreign shores in the wake of a barrage of smart bombs that have taken out both military and civilian targets?

This from an American living in the United Arab Emirates:

Well, over here in the middle-east, us westerners have been advised to keep a low profile. Generally the local arabs here are just as stunned and disgusted as the rest of the world. But it is advised for westerners not to comment on this in public as you never know if there are any lunatics around.

They've closed the U.S. embassies here which makes sense, but those of other countries are still operational.

The tension here is intense ... the most worrying time since the last major action in Iraq. There has been no U.S. show of force here yet ... a couple of years ago I went to a shopping mall and it was being buzzed by F16s, very, very low and loud ... totally unnerving. There has been no obvious military mobilisation that I have seen, neither from the US or the local military but I am sure that will come.

I thought it was relevant.

[Darth Tater]

ACHOO, you should be ashamed of yourself. Your general stereotyping of all followers of a religion and all people living in countries reminds me of nazism.

[gdl96]

Safety in the air? We know their face NO Arabs on commercial flights for their safety and ours

What the hell? That s racism beyond belief. Not all arabs/Muslims are evil like you say. They have as much right as you and I to fly on comercial airliners.

[AACHOO]

Russian Intel Warns CIA -
Next Target A US Nuclear Facility
Source: Ren TV, Moscow
in Russian 0900 gmt 12 Sep 01
BBC Monitoring © BBC
9-13-1

Russian intelligence warns CIA that more attacks imminent BBC Monitoring Service - United Kingdom Sep 12, 2001

Text of report by Russian Ren TV on 12 September Presenter - Yelena Meshcheryakova

Russian intelligence agents know the organizers and executors of the terrorist attacks in the USA. They are Usamah Bin-Laden's organization, the Islamic movement of Uzbekistan and the Taleban [Afghan] government.

According to the internet publication news.ru, Russia's foreign intelligence special envoy told the CIA that there were at least two Uzbeks among the suicide terrorists. Our security services are warning the USA that what happened on Tuesday is just the beginning, and that the next target of the terrorists will be an American nuclear facility.

Source: Ren TV, Moscow, in Russian 0900 gmt 12 Sep 01 BBC Monitoring/ © BBC. World Reporter All Material Subject to Copyright


Since the FBI,CIA,Secret Service,INS,DEA,Border Patrol and every local PD in America are scutinizing the Arab/Muslim population they must be Racsist hate mongers , too.

[juntel]

These are your words AACHOO:

"One Islamic Capitol a day-One Tactical Nuclear Cruise Missle a day until ALL Terrorists are DEAD or Handed in CHAINS to America. "

You are the hate monger here.

And if the FBI and the US gov comes to the point of arresting all muslims and arabs and putting them in indefinite detainment, or even banning arab(-looking) people and muslims from flying in aircrafts, then these would be racist actions, yes.

Fortunately, as I said earlier, your government is behaving the right way right now, far, far from your pitifull racist agenda.

With the aid of many other nations, the terrorists will be rooted out, and be judged, just as the nazis were judged at Nuremberg.
With justice, not with blind and pitifull racist hatred like the one you display.

[Mathron]

Government:
"Let's investigate possible leads to ensure less death."

You:
"Let's wipe out the rest of the world to ensure less death."

If we wiped out all of middle east, sure, that would solve the problem. Course, people that would do that would probably start randomly killing people like us for no real reason. We would just have more extremists use terrorism or murder to get their own points across. Since you seem to have extreme views, your own policy would demand your death. Is that what you want??

We can't blindly kill people for skin color. We can't succomb to hate.

[Lief Erikson]

The acts of the Nazis, following your point of view, ACHOO, would call for the same treatment a hundred times more. At least. What Mathron said is absolutely true and I said the same thing up above. Racism simply doesn't work. This is only the most recent horrible act of cruelty, it is by far not the first of this sort in the world, and it does not prove that everyone of this race is evil.

Following your thoughts about this, English people should be exterminated for the destruction of the Cathars, Germans for their murder of Jews. These things have happened throughout history, this is only the most recent act of this sort. It is horrible and it should never have happened. Our government is doing everything it can to keep it from happening again.

But if an entire race, or everyone with a certain color of skin were exterminated because of the acts of a few people who were of that race, there would be no one left in the world.

A person who goes to our class at church is Palestinian and he's a great person, I've talked with him sometimes. I can't and won't believe he's evil simply because a few people, likely Arab, have done this deed. It's so ridiculous it doesn't bear thinking about.

You keep giving news clips picturing Arabs or Palestinians as villains, I ask you to stop. We know that there are people who are evil, who are misguided or who have hardened themselves against Americans. But it makes no difference to our views. You'll never prove that all of them are evil, that all are hardened against us. You're slapping blame on people out of anger. Some who are hurt by the bombing are like that, wanting to strike out swiftly for revenge and therefore labeling the most likely candidate to be the terrorist. In a few cases, such as yours, labeling an entire race.

[olorin]

Perhaps if we all ignore AACHOO, he will go away, or at least be quiet.

[juntel]

Sneezing is usually something annoying that one cannot control...

[AACHOO]

I see the ability to read and comprehend simple sentences is beyond some members here.

As is presently known four groups of Arab men boarded four domestic long haul flights on the east coast.After take-off;
using cleverly designed blades and pepper spray they assaulted the air crews and passengers.After securing the aircraft they used
the heavily fuel laden planes to destroy the W.T.C. and damage the Pentagon by crashing three of the four planes into those structures.
Killing all on board and (currently)an estimated 10,000 to 30,000 unsuspecing Americans and peoples of other nationalities.

On the fourth plane three brave Americans forwarned of possible targets via phone conversations with soon to be grieving relatives resolved to prevent additional tragedy by
attacking their attackers and saving possibly thousands of lives by sacrificing their own.


I'll try to keep it simple for you from here on:

Groups of Arab men hijacked planes.

How to prevent this from happening again during the current situation?

Don't allow groups of Arab men on a plane.

If they aren't on the plane they can't hi-jack it.

How difficult is this to grasp?

We are doing it now. In Newark,at Kennedy,la Guardia,Ft. Worth,and Miami. Arab men have been arrested bearing forged paperwork,stolen uniforms and weapons of the sort used to hi-
jack the first four planes.

The George Washington Bridge in NYC

" Jerusalem Post

(08:45) Car bomb found on George Washington Bridge

American security services overnight stopped a car bomb on the George Washington Bridge connecting New York and New Jersey.

The van, packed with explosives, was stopped on an approach ramp to the bridge.

Authorities suspect the terrorists intended to blow up the main crossing between New Jersey and New York, Army Radio reported. "



If you know who is perpetrating the attacks you do everything necessary to stop them.

No one but groups of Arab men have committed these acts of War and continue to attempt these acts of War.

How can it be labelled as "Racsist" to focus on groups of Arab men if they continue to attempt to kill Americans?


juntel please learn to read and quote correctly

---"Is this the solution is it all they will understand? One Islamic Capitol a day-One Tactical Nuclear Cruise Missle a day until
ALL Terrorists are DEAD or Handed in CHAINS to America"

---It's a question not a statement.

Leif don't ever credit a quote falsly I did not post this you did

----"Let's wipe out the rest of the world to ensure less death."----

America is at War. We are battling for the future of our country and for our freedom. Our very survival depends upon this. No toll taken in enemy lives is to high if it secures the safety and well being of my country.




N.Y. POST


SIMPLY KILL
THESE BASTARDS
By
STEVE DUNLEAVY


September 12, 2001 -- THE response to this unimaginable 21st century Pearl Harbor should be as simple as it is swift - kill the bastards.
No, I don't mean hunt them, arrest them, extradite them and prosecute them in a court of law.
I mean a far quicker and neater form of retribution for this cabal of cowards. A gunshot between the eyes, blow them to smithereens, poison them if you have to.
President George W. Bush should right now be putting his name to a fresh document - one that rescinds Executive Order 12333, signed by President Gerald Ford on Feb. 18, 1976.
It reads in part: "No person employed by or acting on behalf of the United States should engage in assassination or conspire to engage in assassination."
Right for that time, wrong for this time.
Train assassins (we've done it before), hire mercenaries, put a couple of million bucks up for bounty hunters to get them dead or alive, preferably dead.
As for cities or countries that host these worms, bomb them into basketball courts.
No, it won't bring back the thousands of innocents and the brave cops and firefighters lost, but it might stop the sacrifice of other innocents.
"This is an act of war of an enormity that is staggering," Sen. John McCain of Arizona said yesterday.
Former Secretary of State Gen. Alexander Haig said: "We should be ready to take resolute action, which we have failed to in the past."
The point is that Osama bin Laden has been at war with us for a decade - make no mistake, he's behind the attacks.
At the beginning of the year, he issued a video to his followers urging them "to penetrate" the United States.
Only three weeks ago, he was quoted in an Arabic newspaper saying he was preparing a big action against our country.
He is the sole individual who has the billions of dollars, the training camps and the fanatics to have perpetrated this sophisticated bloodbath.
Former Speaker of the House Newt Gingrich said yesterday: "This wasn't planned in a handful of homes by a handful of fanatics."
When we put a rocket in the pocket of Moammar Khadafy, he went as quiet as a mouse.
If the CIA can't find this amoeba Osama Bin Laden, leave it to someone else.
We should give the Taliban, which protects this monster, 24 hours to clear the city of Kabul of innocent civilians and then start the process of urban renewal with high-altitude bombing.
Then we should go into the interior, hunt down the desert rat and execute him and his followers on the spot.
And if Saddam Hussein makes so much as a peep, do him, too.
The time has come

[Spock]

When in a war you kill or capture those whom you know are the bad guys. Then you use investigation tecniques to find those who don't look or sound like the bad guys. Simple.
Funny how Islam is really a peaceful religion in books but practicioners have made it so violent and anti-anything that isn't muslim.