01-26-2003, 05:10 AM | #41 |
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I didn't think that Elrond looked angry. But Arwen looked sad.
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01-26-2003, 05:56 AM | #42 |
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Elrond didn't look angry, he looked grieved. Because Arwen will not be sailing West.
I'm sure we will see flashbacks of Arwen having Narsil reforged in RotK.
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01-26-2003, 08:44 AM | #43 | |
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01-26-2003, 08:56 AM | #44 |
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The way the film was edited, the audience is made to feel that Arwen is leaving for the Grey Havens. But we know she doesn't. In flashback we will probably learn that the Rivendell party was always setting off for Rohan and will arrive at the beginning of ROTK (no, she's not already there.)
My arguement was that Tolkien's Arwen was never given enough "print time" to give the reader a true understanding of her character. But after thinking about azalea's comments, I find myself agreeing with her that PJ's Arwen wouldn't lie to her father. The scene where Arwen says to Aragorn when he tries to give her back the Evenstar necklace, "It was a gift...keep it." makes it pretty clear that she's straightforward and handles herself with great dignity and class. She doesn't strike me as a liar either. |
01-26-2003, 01:12 PM | #45 |
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I think we will probably learn more about that scene when Arwen and company are leaving Rivendell in the Extended Edition DVD. Kinda like in FotR when Frodo was seeing his companions look at him in the mirror of Galadriel, that actually happened in a scene that was deleted and then cleared up in the Extended Edition where they were waiting to get into Lothlorien while Aragorn was talking with Haldir.
Anyway, point being, there is more to that scene that we will all learn, whether it is in a flashback or in the Extended Edition DVD, because something funky is going on with Elrond's face
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'Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta!' - And those were the words that Elendil spoke when he came up out of the Sea on the wings of the wind: 'Out of the Great Sea to Middle-earth I am come. In this place will I abide, and my heirs, unto the ending of the world.' 'Then Tuor arrayed himself in the hauberk, and set the helm upon his head, and he girt himself with the sword; black were sheath and belt with clasps of silver. Thus armed he went forth from Turgon's hall, and stood upon the high terraces of Taras in the red light of the sun. None were there to see him, as he gazed westward, gleaming in silver and gold, and he knew not that in that hour he appeared as one of the Mighty of the West, and fit to be father of the kings of the Kings of Men beyond the Sea, as it was indeed his doom to be; but in the taking of those arms a change came upon Tuor son of Huor, and his heart grew great within him. And as he stepped down from the doors the swans did him reverence, and plucking each a great feather from their wings they proffered them to him, laying their long necks upon the stone before his feet; and he took the seven feathers and set them in the crest of his helm, and straightway the swans arose and flew north in the sunset, and Tuor saw them no more.' -Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin "Oh. Forgive me, fairest of all males of Entmoot...Back down, all ye other wannabe fairest males! Dunedain is the fairest!" --Linaewen |
01-26-2003, 01:23 PM | #46 | |
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01-26-2003, 03:16 PM | #47 | |
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Or there's a possibility that it will be included in the TTT extended version, as Dúnedain pointed out. Of course all this is merely speculations on my part.
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01-26-2003, 03:33 PM | #48 | |
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At least that is how I interpret that scene.
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01-26-2003, 03:44 PM | #49 |
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At first: I always wondered why elves have to give up their immortality to marry a man. Is it a heart thing or like a "law".
Second: I think the trailer scene, where Arwen says to Elrond: "You have the gift of foresight, tell me what you have seen", will be included on the Extended DVD
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01-26-2003, 04:02 PM | #50 |
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There have only been three elvish-human marriages, Arwen and Aragorn, Luthien and Beren, and Idril and Tuor.
Arwen and Luthien gave up their immortality, but Idril didn't. So I guess there is no law which says that the elves must become mortal to marry mortal men. Otherwize, should Idril be considered a criminal?
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01-26-2003, 04:12 PM | #51 | |
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Lalaith, you have read the 'Athrabeth' recently, haven't you? There you see clearly that love between Elf and Man in general does not change their fate regarding to death. Now in the movie, Arwen doesn't seem to be Half-Elven. Actually I think her fate is a bit confusing. IIRC Elrond on one occasion says "I will not leave my daughter here to die!". It seems to be a sort of 'law' here, but the movie doesn't offer any explanation now, does it? You just have to accept it.
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01-26-2003, 05:12 PM | #52 | |
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'Et Eärello Endorenna utúlien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildinyar tenn' Ambar-metta!' - And those were the words that Elendil spoke when he came up out of the Sea on the wings of the wind: 'Out of the Great Sea to Middle-earth I am come. In this place will I abide, and my heirs, unto the ending of the world.' 'Then Tuor arrayed himself in the hauberk, and set the helm upon his head, and he girt himself with the sword; black were sheath and belt with clasps of silver. Thus armed he went forth from Turgon's hall, and stood upon the high terraces of Taras in the red light of the sun. None were there to see him, as he gazed westward, gleaming in silver and gold, and he knew not that in that hour he appeared as one of the Mighty of the West, and fit to be father of the kings of the Kings of Men beyond the Sea, as it was indeed his doom to be; but in the taking of those arms a change came upon Tuor son of Huor, and his heart grew great within him. And as he stepped down from the doors the swans did him reverence, and plucking each a great feather from their wings they proffered them to him, laying their long necks upon the stone before his feet; and he took the seven feathers and set them in the crest of his helm, and straightway the swans arose and flew north in the sunset, and Tuor saw them no more.' -Of Tuor and his Coming to Gondolin "Oh. Forgive me, fairest of all males of Entmoot...Back down, all ye other wannabe fairest males! Dunedain is the fairest!" --Linaewen |
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01-27-2003, 03:54 AM | #53 |
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Is he really? I don't recall that. But anyway, it's still confusing.
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01-27-2003, 04:02 AM | #54 | ||
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I don't think there's anything to those pictures. There was just three blurry pictures of a random, unidentifiable elf. And since when does Arwen have a distinctive sword?
*generally disgruntled about movie-Arwen*
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02-02-2003, 02:07 PM | #55 | ||
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02-02-2003, 02:21 PM | #56 | |
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02-02-2003, 04:05 PM | #57 | |
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Yes, I remembered right. It's in the "Turin and Nienor" thread.
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02-03-2003, 02:59 PM | #58 | |
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I think I will in future, but not by now as they won't be published in German and in English it is rather difficult.
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02-03-2003, 06:12 PM | #59 |
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Hehe! i have some possible proof that arwen was a helms deep in the movie! in the hardcover version of The Lord of the Rings: The Making of the Movie Trilogy, on page 49, there is a picture in the lower right hand corner. It depicts pj, and some people from the crew looking at a sketch, some extras in costume, and two rows of blue chairs for the actors, in a place that looks like helms deep. on two of the chairs you can see the names of the characters eowyn and arwen. so its a possibility that arwen was in the scene.
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02-03-2003, 10:00 PM | #60 | ||
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Well Eowyn wasn't in that battle either, so ha!
Maybe each character had her own chair, and Eowyn and Arwen wanted to sit and watch them film that scene. That's a plausible explanation.
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