12-19-2008, 04:44 PM | #41 | ||||
Lady of the Ulairi
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Yet, I think I see TWO eyes! NEL - I don't really see why you discuss the ability of Palantirs to see in the Spirit World. Pippin clearly saw over the Palantir Sauron's physical body, not the Eye: Quote:
Also, consider Galadriel's words to Frodo: Quote:
Much more plausible is the other explanation: to see the Eye=to be able to see into the Spirit World. And for those who have access there, Galadriel's Ring is no mystery. |
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12-19-2008, 04:54 PM | #42 |
Leaf-Crowned Lord Of Elvenpath
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Because I do not necessarily believe that Pippin did see S's physical body. Maybe, maybe not. Your quote is, excuse me, too vague to deduce that Pippin saw a body, not the Spirit-world manifestation of S's evil will, the Eye. *bows* Until proved wrong, I'll cling to my view, and try to understand yours to my best ability.
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12-19-2008, 07:38 PM | #43 | |
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12-19-2008, 08:13 PM | #44 |
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I suspect that "Soldiers of the Eye", etc, are the literary device of synecdoche. "A figure of speech in which a part is used for the whole (as hand for sailor),"
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12-20-2008, 01:19 AM | #45 | |
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It is beginning to look that way. But however things might appear, I think I shall always envision Sauron as cyclopean in my mind's eye. </sigh> But I think I will keep a lookout for evidence that he was one-eyed. (What exactly did Frodo see, Sauron looking through a telescope? Was he winking? Have a mote in his eye? Just woke up? Maybe he had pinkeye?) |
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12-20-2008, 04:44 AM | #46 |
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Don't have that. Gonna get it someday though.
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12-20-2008, 06:28 AM | #47 |
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12-20-2008, 09:18 AM | #48 | ||
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To throw another kink into all this, and maybe add a little weight to NEL's argument: My son is reading LOTR (so proud of him!) and lately, I've been reading portions of 'ROTK' with him. I hadn't remembered this, but in 'The Passing of the Grey Company', as Aragorn recounts HIS encounter with Sauron in the Palantir, he says: Quote:
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12-20-2008, 09:44 AM | #49 | |
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12-20-2008, 03:59 PM | #50 | ||
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Add to this Narsil reforged and the general "kingly air" that Aragorn sometimes adopted. I guess Sau was convinced. Another thing. I have just stumbled on Gandalf's description of Frodo to Butterbur: Quote:
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12-20-2008, 06:20 PM | #51 |
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Do you have a quote to back that up?
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12-20-2008, 07:09 PM | #52 |
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12-21-2008, 09:56 PM | #53 |
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But could Frodo see out of both eyes?
(Is there a quote to support his ability or inability to see out of both of his eyes?) Re: Frodo's bright eye. Maybe one eye was brighter than the other. Maybe Frodo had a shiny glass eye. (I have no quote to support Frodo with a shiny glass eye)
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12-21-2008, 10:54 PM | #54 |
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"Bright eyes" are another topic I'm interested in. The "bright eyes" of the Elves are mentioned several times and they seem to be the main distinguishing physical characteristic between Elves and Men, but I'm not sure whether to take the phrase literally.
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12-22-2008, 12:10 AM | #55 | |
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12-22-2008, 07:35 AM | #56 |
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Gordis - your quotation only rules out one eye, not three or more.
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12-22-2008, 08:35 AM | #57 |
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One eye? Three eyes? Oh dear, you people are insane. Creatively insane, but insane nevertheless. I like this topic, it's amazing how differently people can interpret the same text. I never even considered the possibility of a Cylcopean Sauron until now. I still don't buy it, but I find it an interesting concept.
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01-01-2009, 08:45 AM | #58 |
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I remembered another quote to support the spirit-world Eye, though since I do not possess an English (or whatever) copy of LotR, you have to find it with my guidance. I believe Frodo said near Mt.Doom that there is "no veil" between him and the "wheel/ring of fire". The Ring allowed him to see into the S-W occasionally even when not worn, did it not? The wheel of fire was Sauron, but since Frodo didn't see properly, he couldn't recognize it as the Eye (by his vision) - that, or he knew that Sam knew what he meant. Or both.
Thoughts? Or I know you have thoughts, but what be they?
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01-01-2009, 11:23 AM | #59 |
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Didn't they only find that later - or is this the copy?
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01-01-2009, 05:35 PM | #60 | ||
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They found Elendil's Elendilmir (E-I) later, in Saruman's hoard: it had been drowned with Isildur. But the Elves made a new one (E-II) for Valandil, and forty Arnor Kings and Chieftains had worn it before it came to Aragorn.
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