The Irony of Jackson Bashing

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by hectorberlioz
nirvingiel's post

well, jackson should've known-if he was truly careful and cautious-that je should not have messed with something like arwen.
So what if crazy extremist women feminists(just th crazy ones ) persecute him for the rest of his life for not having a central woman character? maybe he would have kept truer by omitting arwen on the whole.

The thing is - both Galadriel and Eowyn are STRONG woman characters. He reduced Galadriel down - as I said - into the Ice Queen of hell.

Tolkien's books had a lot of historical accuracy to them and I'm sorry if the "womens lib group" wasn't active during the middle ages - but it wasn't. Yes - there were women like Galadriel and Eowyn - but the majority were like Arwen in the books. I agree that the love between Aragorn and Arwen needed to be shown - it didn't need to be made a whole new plot line like it is in the movies. I has taken over too much of the movie in my opinion.

[hectorberlioz]

Oh yeah, I saw a can of pringles with Aragorn,Eowyn and Arwen.
Like-its a hard decision for aragor nto choose between them
Jackson has 'interpreted' eowyns secret love for aragorn into a 'i lovearwen,but eowynissopretty' type romance now.

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by thranduil

Never did I say I didn't like hearing your complaints, I "love" to argue over them because of how ridiculous some can be. As for "seeing nothing wrong with the movies" where did you get this information? In plenty of my quotes I have admitted to things that I didn't like and agree with. And as for Faramir being an a*****e, it just took him a little longer to make up his mind. I doubt that makes anyone an a*****e.

I threw you in there for various reasons - you aren't as hard-headed as bb is at least. As for faramir - there was NO reason for him to kidnap Frodo back to Osgiliath - that makes him an a*****e in my book. Now Frodo has to make up all that time - backtracking while Sauron's armies march toward him. It makes no sense. Of course Jackson will just completely ignore this contradiction he created in the movies.

[thranduil]

Originally posted by jerseydevil
I threw you in there for various reasons - you aren't as hard-headed as bb is at least. As for faramir - there was NO reason for him to kidnap Frodo back to Osgiliath - that makes him an a*****e in my book. Now Frodo has to make up all that time - backtracking while Sauron's armies march toward him. It makes no sense. Of course Jackson will just completely ignore this contradiction he created in the movies.

I would say he was taking reason before chance. If it was me I would have taken him to MT for sure. Not let Gollum lead them to Cirith Ungol. It seems like madness. Kidnapping Frodo and taking him to Osgiliath is the wiser choice. He just let his wisdom come before his faith. No big deal. Well okay to some it is.

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by thranduil
I would say he was taking reason before chance. If it was me I would have taken him to MT for sure. Not let Gollum lead them to Cirith Ungol. It seems like madness. Kidnapping Frodo and taking him to Osgiliath is the wiser choice. He just let his wisdom come before his faith. No big deal. Well okay to some it is.

It is a big deal - it completely changes his character and it also takes Frodo away from the quest. Talk about destroying the timeline. jackson should have shown more of how treacherous the journey was through Mordor - instead he just throws in an action scene. You know - dumb ignorant movie people wouldn't be able to sit through it if it didn't have an action scene in Mordor.

[Ruinel]

BB and all forms of BB <edited>

[hectorberlioz]

this is now the official jackson/whatever else arguement thread.
no more arguement thread starters please

[thranduil]

Originally posted by jerseydevil
jackson should have shown more of how treacherous the journey was through Mordor

Hmmm I'm quite sure that will be in ROTK.. They aren't even going through Mordor in TT. I don't know what your talking about but I can only guess you didn't think that post through very well

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by thranduil
Hmmm I'm quite sure that will be in ROTK.. They aren't even going through Mordor in TT. I don't know what your talking about but I can only guess you didn't think that post through very well

They're making their way toward Mordor. basically it is treacherous country - are they technically in Mordor - no. But why should jackson show the toil of Frodo now - all they're doing is going right ot shelob - which ends up bringing him into Mordor. Jackson has too many other things to worry about about for the 3 hours - than to worry about the Main Characters toil and hardship on the road to Mordor. There wasn't even a build up to the Ring getting heavy. All of a sudden - Frodo just says - "it's getting heavy".

[hectorberlioz]

and aragorn's becoming the screen idol throughout the whole film.
they can show legolas riding on the shield, to make him look cool.
but they cant spend enought time with frodo.

[Ruinel]

Originally posted by jerseydevil
YOu know- I have really been giving this a lot of thought lately and I must say - I am starting to see BB as being right. I'll have more about this later. I need to run off and watch FotR and TT back to back right now.

*spits water that she was drinking all over her monitor in shock*

You may have captured, tortured and brain washed JD, black servant of Morgoth, but you will never take me alive.

[thranduil]

Originally posted by jerseydevil
They're making their way toward Mordor. basically it is treacherous country - are they technically in Mordor - no. But why should jackson show the toil of Frodo now - all they're doing is going right ot shelob - which ends up bringing him into Mordor. Jackson has too many other things to worry about about for the 3 hours - than to worry about the Main Characters oill and hardship on the road to Mordor. There wasn't even a build up to the Ring getting heavy. All of a sudden - Frodo just says - "it's getting heavy".

Whoa! there will be plenty of time for showing Frodos toil I hope. And so should you! It should fit if the battle doesn't take up half the movie. And I know you especially would be very upset if the battle raged on for the entire half of the show. And anyways that is when the ring becomes the heaviest is in Mordor, that is when there will be the struggle and emphases that the ring has grown over him. Perfect time to show how the ring is taking control over Frodo. And when Frodo says "its getting heavy" that isn't the climax, its the starting of build up. In case that had you confused.

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by thranduil
Whoa! there will be plenty of time for showing Frodos toil I hope. And so should you! It should fit if the battle doesn't take up half the movie. And I know you especially would be very upset if the battle raged on for the entire half of the show. And anyways that is when the ring becomes the heaviest is in Mordor, that is when there will be the struggle and emphases that the ring has grown over him. Perfect time to show how the ring is taking control over Frodo. And when Frodo says "its getting heavy" that isn't the climax, its the starting of build up. In case that had you confused.

Actually - a lot of the toil and heaviness of the ring was occuring before Shelob. As for the heaviness line - it should have been building up - it didn't. He should have said it earlier than that - and shoudl have shown more of the toil of trying to make their way to Mordor. Instead - they go to the Black Gate (oops can't go through there - roll down hill - enemy 2 inches in front of them , turn around). They're at the Black Gate - then they're with Faramir, then Osgiliath and then all of a sudden - they're on their way to Shelob. It's way too jumpy - because jackson spent so much wasted time on other things instead of the main character.

[hectorberlioz]

like helm's deep

[thranduil]

Originally posted by jerseydevil
Instead - they go to the Black Gate (oops can't go through there - roll down hill - enemy 2 inches in front of them , turn around).

Did you read in TT when the riders go right past Aragorn, Gimli, and legolas, whithout notice. Yes! thats right there cloaks blend in very well to the environment.

And about the timeline, I say screw the timeline, so what if it doesn't match. Oh well another "petty" complaint that has no real weight to it.

[hectorberlioz]

well then. aragorn can run around from gondor and back, no prob.

[thranduil]

Originally posted by hectorberlioz
well then. aragorn can run around from gondor and back, no prob.

Yes. Rangers are swift.

[jerseydevil]

Originally posted by thranduil
Did you read in TT when the riders go right past Aragorn, Gimli, and legolas, whithout notice. Yes! thats right there cloaks blend in very well to the environment.

If you read TT - the riders were on horseback riding fast past them. They were not standing 2 inches in front of them actually LOOKING for them.

And about the timeline, I say screw the timeline, so what if it doesn't match. Oh well another "petty" complaint that has no real weight to it.

It's not petty because Sauron has his army marching WEST now Frodo has to backtrack right INTO this army. There is absolutely no explanation for this - Frodo just mirculously gets from Osgiliath to Shelob no problem.

[hectorberlioz]

Yes. Rangers are swift.

rubbish.

[thranduil]

I don't even know why i'm trying to defend TT. I was just trying to defend Faramir because I disagree about the names you have placed on him. TT is my least favorite and I find many of these things annoying myself but I look past it. How frodo journeys from Osgiliath without problem eludes me. He does have a very good guide, they do have there cloaks, and the enemy isn't looking directly for them, are my guesses.