11-18-2002, 12:58 AM | #41 | |
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11-18-2002, 01:20 AM | #42 | |
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11-18-2002, 01:48 PM | #43 | ||
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Tolkein also develops the history of Middle-earth and of each character very extensively, which also subtly advances the plot.
Places like the Forsaken Inn (where ever it's mentioned) succeed in doing this. I think everything in a book advances the plot in some way, it just depends if it sends the plot in some pointless direction, or brings it closer to an interesting climax. Tolkein is never pointless and extremely subtle.
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11-19-2002, 04:14 PM | #44 |
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It also helps to make ME a "larger" place than what the one episode encompasses. There are other people, elves, hobbits, dwarves, doing other things.
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11-28-2002, 02:22 AM | #45 | |
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More like Eru-Forsaken Inn???
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08-15-2004, 12:43 PM | #46 | |||||
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It may be that the Forsaken Inn was called 'forsaken' because noone (except perhaps the Rangers) went there, like Deadmen's Dike (former Fornost). But Dwarves used the East-West road a lot; they would naturally want shelter for the night. Thorin's company passed through a country with 'an inn or two' in Eriador during the Quest of Erebor in 2941; perhaps one of them was the Forsaken Inn. After all, in 1966 Tolkien was "greatly concerned to harmonise Bilbo's journey with the geography of The Lord of the Rings". It does not explicitly say that they visited it though, but it would perhaps be a natural place of rest for them (in Appendix A Thorin stayed at Bree for the night, presumably at an inn, maybe The Prancing Pony where the meeting with Gandalf took place, which led up to the Quest of Erebor; though this was later changed to take place at the road near Bree (see 'The Quest of Erebor')).
TH, 'Roast Mutton': Quote:
LR, 'A Knife in the Dark': Quote:
But since Aragorn says Quote:
The Sindar called themselves Eglath, the Forsaken People. Could it be that the Forsaken Inn was controlled by Sindar who were among those Sindar who went East from Lindon in the beginning of the Second Age? On another Tolkien board Michael Martinez also speculated that it was controlled by Avari, from the etymology of the word forsaken. It is sort of curious that Aragorn says Quote:
'The Disaster of the Gladden Fields', note 6 (Author's note): Quote:
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08-15-2004, 04:34 PM | #47 |
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I would suppose that Aragorn was unaware of that measurement, since it was so many years since the Gladden Fields, and much lore had been lost.
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04-21-2005, 04:47 PM | #48 |
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Forsaken Inn
Good disertation Aphanuzîr. An old, ghosttownish image of the Inn I always had, little used but still viable. its heyday was most likely in the grander days of Arnor, which is speculation on my part.
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04-21-2005, 08:54 PM | #49 |
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Everyone so far seems to have interpreted "Forsaken" as an adjective modifying "Inn." But what if it's a noun? That would make it essentially "The Inn for the Forsaken" AKA "The Forsaken Inn."
Not a bad name, really, to entice weary travelers in a deserted portion of Middle Earth who, by then, undoubtedly felt forsaken. |
04-21-2005, 09:33 PM | #50 | |
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04-22-2005, 01:55 AM | #51 | |||
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I was wondering about the name too Jon S. I like your idea. If the inn did date back to the good old days, before Fornost was called Deadman's Dike, I imagine the inn would have had a more cheerful name. Travellers wouldn't have been forsaken then, and neither would the inn.
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04-22-2005, 02:24 AM | #52 | |
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The term for 1/8th of a mile is 'furlong' - from the length of a furrow, ie, how far a farmer would plow in a line before he turned his plow around and went back the other way... and FYI - an acre is 1/8th of a mile (660') long by 1/80th of a mile (66') wide. Nurvi, I thought you were gonna tell Olmer that The Forsaken Inn IS like the Eagles' "Hotel California" song! Yes - I think over time the use of the Great East-West Road just greatly diminished - and that all the many inns and towns that had once lined it gradually disappeared. There may have even been less in 3018-19 (the travel years in LOTR) than there had been in 2941-42, when Bilbo would have passed that way in "The Hobbit". Perhaps by 3018, what was then called "The Forsaken Inn" (and perhaps only as a nickname) was barely hanging on.
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04-22-2005, 10:04 AM | #53 | ||
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I didn't say because of course it's like the Eagles song! Um... yeah. (Sung by the servants of Manwë )
Interesting post Val. Now that you say that, I'm sure that the Inn didn't start out as the Forsaken Inn. Who would name a probably (or hopefully) prosperous Inn 'forsaken' unless they were being ironic or funny? Probably not even Aragorn remembered its original name.
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04-22-2005, 12:34 PM | #54 | |
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04-23-2005, 06:24 PM | #55 |
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FWIW, the section of The Tolkien Forum intended for "Relatively serious off-topic discussions involving various social issues, philosophy, literature, and similar topics" is named The Forsaken Inn.
http://www.thetolkienforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=97 |
04-23-2005, 07:10 PM | #56 | |||
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04-24-2005, 12:35 PM | #57 |
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..speculation...build and they will come....out where nothing exists to serve the wanderers and/or those who don't crave companionship; i.e. Bree, Shire, etc.
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04-24-2005, 01:12 PM | #58 | ||
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Field of Dreams - the unreleased Middle-earth version!
Would you really walk for 3 days to go to an inn in the wilderness when you could go to the Pony though?
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04-24-2005, 01:18 PM | #59 |
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depends upon the ambience and entertainment.
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05-04-2005, 11:15 AM | #60 | |
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The Forsaken Inn
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