Do elves have souls?

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Originally posted by galadriel
I think the connection between the two stories is what they say about the role of religion in fairy-tales. 1) The fairy world is generally intrinsically pagan. (Not the case for Elves, but they are certainly not Christian, the other end of the scale in Western storytelling... Christianity does not yet exist, and they are not human.) And the very word "soul" has religious connotations. So it's almost logical, if not valid in the Elves' case, to assume fantastic creatures are soulless. These stories explore the relationship between the human, Christianize-able world and the, if not pagan, then at least "unsaved" world of Elves/mermaids/what have you.

Ahem. But moving on....

1) Certainly agree with you there, the pagan mythologies are fascinating. Of course, that is not always the case, and as you point out, it is not with the Elves. Though I fail to see why that means the faerie creatures are most likely to be soulless; as Rian pointed out, many, many religions believe in the spirit, or the soul. Hinduism is, I believe, a form of Paganism, and they believe in the soul and rebirth. Obviously, paganism is too broad a horizon to encompass in a single statement.

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by the "unsaved" world of Elves etc....

[galadriel]

Originally posted by Gwaimir Windgem
Though I fail to see why that means the faerie creatures are most likely to be soulless; as Rian pointed out, many, many religions believe in the spirit, or the soul. Hinduism is, I believe, a form of Paganism, and they believe in the soul and rebirth.

Oh, you're very right. Lots of people believe in souls. But from a Western, Christian, old-fashioned perspective (both authors being Christians), only the Christian definition of "soul" counts. Fantastic creatures do not fit into the traditional Christian worldview. They are relics from an earlier mythos. Therefore, they probably wouldn't have a Christian soul - not being human, how could they possibly go to heaven or hell? (A more modern definition of a soul implies self-awareness. But Andersen's definiton, at least, is certainly more than that - the little mermaid seems just as sentient as any other being. It's her fate that seems to be different from humans.)

Of course, Tolkien's Elves don't fit into this picture. Although not Christians, they believe in a Judeo-Christian God. They do have souls in the conventional sense of the word. Still, there is uncertainty, because of their Elven nature, what their fate will be. They have souls - but not human souls. Like The Little Mermaid, the Athrabeth tries to reconcile the seemingly incompatible worlds of Elves/mermaids and Men.

Originally posted by Gwaimir Windgem
I'm not entirely sure what you mean by the "unsaved" world of Elves etc....

Just referring to the (rather antiquated) Christian terms for those who have been saved from sin and those who haven't. Fantastic creatures not being human, and they probably wouldn't fall into the category of those who could be "saved" by becoming Christians.

[Kalile]

I haven't posted for a while, and I haven't had time to read the new replies yet, but here is an idea from the Silmarillion.

For the Elves die not till the world dies, unless they are slain or waste in grief... and dying they are gathered to the halls of Mandos in Valinor, whence they may in time return. But the sons of Men die indeed, and leave the world... Death is their fate, the gift of Illuvatar, which as Time wears even the Powers shall envy.

This kind of states that the Men have something different, maybe more, if you take my meaning, than elves. While elves are bound to the earth, Men go to other places, and are known as the Guests, or Strangers.

Also:

Men shall join in the Second Music of the Ainur

while elves will not.

[Elf Girl]

Originally posted by Kalile
This kind of states that the Men have something different, maybe more, if you take my meaning, than elves. While elves are bound to the earth, Men go to other places, and are known as the Guests, or Strangers.

True, but nothing keeps people who are bound to the earth from having souls. And Elves have other things Men do not.