The Singers Thread

[Tessar]

Hmmm, I'm a bit frustrated because I'm still sometimes having trouble with the area around my Ab3... I'm not sure why, but right between the pitches of that Ab and the A my voice wants to flip back into my throat, my throat tightens, and I think my air starts to 'press' because my vibrato gets out of control and sounds pushed.

Especially since it's something that gives me trouble when I'm tired, or my allergies are acting up, I know it must be a problem spot that I need to spend time figuring out.

Time will tell... I have a feeling it's just a muscle habit that needs time and attention to work itself out. I'm going to spend lots of time focusing on it now though, so I can try to work it out once and for all. I'm using nasal 'slides' rather than scales, and it's definitely helping.

[Voronwen]

Originally Posted by Tessar

Jeeze I would kill to be a tenor. Preferably a lyric, actually. I would just die to be able to sing things like Che Gelida Manina from La Boheme... or maybe even a lighter voice (like Juan Diego Florez), to sing some of the Rossini/Verdi roles that require a bright, agile tenor voice.

I always go through phases of being resigned to being a baritone, and saying that I'd rather be baritone rather than tenor, but the truth under it all is that I really wish I were a tenor.

Hmmm.... Well, all i can say to that statement is this....

While the 'grass is always greener', as they always say, in another voice category... there may be some truth to the underlying cause of your tenor envy...

Before i found the breakthrough that released my stratosphere once and for all, i longed to sing coloratura rep more than anything else (not to mention i had several teachers and coaches along the way who tantalized me with it, saying "That's what your voice will be when it finally grows up!" ... to which i am very happy to say, they were right! ). Before i was told i was 'ready', i was singing it at home and in the practice room - Doll, all manner of bel canto, you name it. Finally the extreme top was secure enough to use in public, and it was a day of rejoicing.

Despite my always having wanted to develop into a bigger voice (like a mezzo or a full-lyric soprano) because it would have been so great to be able to sing all that heavier material, there was always something inside of me saying, "No way girl, you're a coloratura!" Lo and behold..... Something in me just always knew.

So, you never know. I went from a Pamina to a Queen of the Night, and you just might go from a Papageno to a Tamino.

(PS ~ I will keep you posted as to how my first Der Holle Rache is received - my performance takes place in about 4 weeks.)

[Varnafindë]

Originally Posted by Voronwen

So, you never know. I went from a Pamina to a Queen of the Night, and you just might go from a Papageno to a Tamino.

(PS ~ I will keep you posted as to how my first Der Holle Rache is received - my performance takes place in about 4 weeks.)

Your first? Meaning the first time you're performing it in public? Or did I miss something?

I watched that YouTube version of it that you posted a little while ago, and I realised that I hadn't known where it fit into the plot. It's this amazing piece of music - and then the lyrics is about "if you don't do this terrible deed that I command you to do, you're not my daughter any more"

[Tessar]

Originally Posted by Varnafindë

It's this amazing piece of music - and then the lyrics is about "if you don't do this terrible deed that I command you to do, you're not my daughter any more"

Oh come on. My mom says that every time she wants me to clean my room.



It is an amazing piece of music, and Magic Flute is a wonderful, fun opera. There are three or four incredible arias in it .


Voronwen!! You had better keep me posted on that Queen of the Night!! I am dying to hear you!!!!!!!

But really, yes I think my tenor envy is probably justified... lets be honest, there are no tenors out there that want to be baritones .

I want to be a tenor because I desperately want to play the romantic/dramatic lead . Baritones usually get bouncy, silly little arias that just aren't that dramatic.... unless of course you have a huge voice and can sing some of the truly enormous baritone arias. I feel like, emotionally, I connect better with tenor arias... I love most of them, and I really only enjoy a handful of baritone arias .

Although I AM excited because I get to sing Thais this summer. The duet where they're traveling to the nunnery... it's very dramatic and awesome .

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Originally Posted by Tessar

Oh come on. My mom says that every time she wants me to clean my room.

Complete with High F's?

[Tessar]

Originally Posted by Gwaimir Windgem

Complete with High F's?

You'd be surprised. >.>

[Tessar]

OMG!!!!

OMG!!!!!

*falls over!!*

In my lesson today I was trying to sing through something, and I explained to my teacher that it feels like to get from a G3 to an A3, I have to just give it an enormous amount of space in my mouth... like a cavernous yawn, and I asked if that was normal. She said no, and then said, "You know what? I've figured it out... your mouth isn't open enough on your low notes, so it can never open enough in time for high notes."

It took me three tries to figure out how to open my mouth wide enough and place the voice correctly, but then there was just one of those 'light-bulb' moments, and it was like I had suddenly traded out voices. My voice just... grew. I kid you not... instantaneous vocal growth . My voice is considerably bigger than it was before, and now (if I keep my mouth open correctly) it feels like there is no 'high' or 'low', it's all like reaching sideways and everything feels like it's resonating in the same place from the bottom of my range to the top. I was making octave leaps in my song like it was nothing, and I hung out in a tessitura that's normally impossible for me.


It was SO exciting. My teacher almost started crying she was so happy... I almost did too, for that matter. It's a whole new level of vocal freedom .

Then my good friend had her lesson right after (the one who has had a lifelong list of vocal problems), and I always stay to listen and cheer her on.... and OMG. It was just a day of vocal breakthroughs. I wish I had a recording to show you guys, because my teacher had my friend make just a few tiny adjustments, and my friend just busted out with this big, rich, creamy mezzo sound. It was one of the most gorgeous things I've ever heard from live singing... I kid you not, she sounds almost exactly like Susan Graham now.

VERY exciting vocal day .

[katya]

I'm home alone and bored so I've been doing karaoke by myself with all the instrumental versions of stuff I have. I'm jealous of you people who can actually sing though. To me a good day is "Hey, I kind of sang the right notes most of the time!"

[Tessar]

Originally Posted by katya

I'm home alone and bored so I've been doing karaoke by myself with all the instrumental versions of stuff I have. I'm jealous of you people who can actually sing though. To me a good day is "Hey, I kind of sang the right notes most of the time!"

I have been terrible at karaoke every time I have tried it before . The microphone intimidates me because I have had major pitch problems in the past, and it's like... oh.... okay... here it is one inch from my mouth, ready to amplify every single glitch and error that I make.

I might try it again though . I'm discovering tonight that with the new 'jaw adjustment' not only is my pitch always right in the middle of the note (finally!) but my comfortable singing range is much increased .

I'm actually trying some 'crooner' stuff tonight... trying to see if I can make the same technique work for singing jazz and pop stuff. Seems to work pretty well, I just have to make sure not to sing too loudly, or make my vowels really dark and operatic .

[katya]

The first time I sang karaoke (in Japan) I was like "Woah, the microphone makes me sound kind of like I'm good at singing!" But of course, that's only to the untrained ear. But I think they do make them so you sound good on purpose. I looove karaoke. I don't really do real singing songs though, mostly rock and anime theme songs and stuff like that. Stuff where it's more about the energy and looking silly.

[Tessar]

Just so you know, the cake is a lie.

[Voronwen]

Originally Posted by Tessar

I want to be a tenor because I desperately want to play the romantic/dramatic lead

There IS romantic lead stuff written for baritone! It's out there! It's just a little more obscure and not as popular as the tenor stuff. Happy searching!

'Crooner' music i can definitely see working for you as a baritone. Don't be afraid of the mic. When i started singing in the worship team, i had the same fear of it - i'm so used to resonating naturally/accoustically that i feared that i'd blow out the mic or something But here's what you do (and you probably already know this), just make sure your soft palette is a little bit LOWER in contemprary/popular styles than it is for classical/opera. With the mic, you won't need so much resonating space, and the vowels need to be a little bit brighter. So think a little more 'spread' and horizontal inside, with a little less 'height' in the palette. But the rest of your technique STAYS THE SAME. Your voice still needs ample breath support and forward placement to work properly and stay protected from injury.

Varnafinde, yes - this will be my first public performance of the Queen (i've peformed Pamina's aria from the same opera before so that's probably what you're remembering). I'll keep everyone posted!

Gwaimir, you'd be surprised what a little emotion does for a high soprano voice, even in speaking - i tend to laugh in my stratosphere when i'm really laughing hard (i'm not kidding - sometimes i wish that didn't happen! ). Mozart just knew the voice and its ways of expressing emotions SO well! That's why his operas have stood the test of time, IMHO!

katya - Don't despair! Anyone can learn how to sing. Repeat after me - ANYONE can learn how to sing. It's a skill, like riding a bike. A little of the right training, and you'd be off and running! And seriously, finding your proper range and voice type is half the battle won. When i was younger, i had tried the whole karaoke thing, too (all my friends can sing in that range and belt - why can't i???), but it never worked for me. In the middle range, my voice just doesn't have the 'ping' or the power - it's just too soft. But once i was placed in my proper range and style, it was like night and day - i have all the power in the top, because of the way my voice is built. Those girls who could get a lot of volume in the middle are often mezzos, or else lower sopranos, and their voices are built with more strength in the middle than a voice like mine is. Like anything else, it's so important to find your niche. Asking a high soprano voice to keep stride with the mezzos is like asking a figure skater to compete in speed skating One is all about twirls and flowery tricks, the other is about sheer strength. But there is both beauty and power in one as there is in the other - just of different kinds.

Crossing over is always possible, though. But if i want to sing my contemporary Christian stuff, i'm a backup singer adding texture to the fabric of the sound with high harmonies. And if i want to sing musical theater, it's things like Cosette (Les Mis) and Christine (Phantom). There's a place for every voice in every kind of music.

On that note, Tessar, i'd love to hear your crooner stuff, too! Ok, now i'm hit with inspiration - An Entmoot Christmas concert You can croon White Christmas for us, and i'll stick with Rejoice Greatly.

[Varnafindë]

Originally Posted by Voronwen

Varnafinde, yes - this will be my first public performance of the Queen (i've peformed Pamina's aria from the same opera before so that's probably what you're remembering). I'll keep everyone posted!

Wow - that's really something
Do keep us posted - I only wish I could have heard your performance!

Asking a high soprano voice to keep stride with the mezzos is like asking a figure skater to compete in speed skating One is all about twirls and flowery tricks, the other is about sheer strength. But there is both beauty and power in one as there is in the other - just of different kinds.

That's a good way to show the difference! And you are so right that there is beauty in both, and there is strength in both, of different kinds - and there is technique of different kinds.

Ok, now i'm hit with inspiration - An Entmoot Christmas concert You can croon White Christmas for us, and i'll stick with Rejoice Greatly.

YouTube!
YouTube!
YouTube!

[Tessar]

So, I can memorize something like 8-10 measures of music in English in about 30 min, but it seriously takes me something like 30-40 min just to memorize 3-4 measures of foreign language music. I lurve Thais with all of my heart, but I'm so frustrated with it. It takes me hours just to get one page down.

[Gwaimir Windgem]

I'm guessing that would diminished if you developed a proficiency in one or two of the main operatic languages? Actually, I'll bet proficiency in either French or Italian would be of tremendous help with the other, just by itself.

[Tessar]

Yes, you would need to actually know the language.... and knowing another language really wouldn't be horribly helpful. Maybe a bit, but the problem is that unless you know the language, you're basically memorizing a string of totally meaningless sounds. Even if you memorize each word's meaning, it still feels like a string of gibberish. Then even if it's similar to a language you know, it's like putting together some words you know, interspersed with gibberish, and even the words you know have nonsense-syllables stuck on them or in the middle.

[katya]

I know what you mean. I memorized the ending theme from G Gundam before I knew a word of Japanese. It took a long time (but not that long, because I'm pretty good at memorization). Now I can memorize songs in Japanese in no time at all. Even if I don't know some of the vocabulary, it feels like I understand it... I think some English words are like that too. If you asked what they meant I might not be able to tell you, even though I think I know.

[Tessar]

Originally Posted by Voronwen

On that note, Tessar, i'd love to hear your crooner stuff, too! Ok, now i'm hit with inspiration - An Entmoot Christmas concert You can croon White Christmas for us, and i'll stick with Rejoice Greatly.

Haha, I might actually indulge myself and record/post something. I hate to sound inflated here, but I've actually been very surprised and pleased with how my voice has sounded these last few days. Dropping my jaw was that last magical step I needed to have a couple of other things fall into place.

Right now I'm just fighting old habits of wanting to tense up, or not open my mouth enough. So sometimes my voice still wont flip all the way over, giving me a throaty sound as I ascend in range, or my throat will tense up out of habit as I try to sing through a high tessitura area giving me a very 'pinched' sound, but it's so, so, so much better .


Katya, I envy your memorization skills . What puzzles me is that some things (like the Reynaldo Hahn song, "A Chloris") were very easy to memorize as I recall, but things which are not as melodic and simple (like most operas) give me a LOT of trouble. Maybe it's just that I'm keenly feeling the time-crunch, where as for most of my music I can take about as long as I want to memorize it.

[katya]

Yeah, the more melodic something is, the easier. I usually find that I memorize the chorus parts of songs (or whatever the more melodic parts are) first.

I would love to hear what you sound like! We've head so much about it.

[Tessar]

Originally Posted by katya

Yeah, the more melodic something is, the easier. I usually find that I memorize the chorus parts of songs (or whatever the more melodic parts are) first.

I would love to hear what you sound like! We've head so much about it.

Well don't get too excited. This is what some guys my age, with my type of voice, sound like: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0VrXMNKJcy4

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaand I sound nothing like that. Even though my voice has grown considerably with this new jaw thing, I don't have even half that dude's power, or half as rich a voice. I've still got a loooong way to go.

But enjoy him, and pretend its me.