Discussion Thread Number 3 Of Wraiths-Kings-Friends-Rings Campaign

[Butterbeer]

well, fine but if you elves are THAT hasty you will not last more than 5 days in tharbad, and regarding your professor, her character thus far developed seems a bit at odds with this "my god, that woman flinched just then for some reason - HE MUST BR A WIFE OR WOMAN BEATER!"

my god, what if someone shivers in tharbad?

or sneezes, or looks sad, will we accuse anyone near them of being cannibals, or of torturing them?

however you put it it is one almighty leap of faith to assume such things from a flinch ...


RIAN

the nobility of Arnor would i think take a very dim view of a lady being beaten

regarding who would think them perhaps involved?

let me again quote you in a following rpg post:

"But this house is odd, too," he went on, "unless this is the way that these type of people normally act. My brother saw lights and heard noises late into the night last night. I don't know - I haven't been around high class people much, and maybe that's just the way they act. But even in the short time I've been here ... I don't know, it's just ..." he shrugged his shoulders, unable to put words to his feelings.

so, every character you have written for is forming a very suspicous view of the orrodel inhabitants, we are soon to have a dead body, and rumours flying around the city, already the MM's are talking to udu ...


and you expect the morgul lord to be happy at this?

rather than not drawing any intention to himself, khamul goes out of his way into the street almost, to make all and sundry suspicious ... you have included CS and lotesse's characters as wooden dummies, and despite lotesse's uinhappiness about this whole post, still think it has no effect on anyone else in the rpg?

what will bumble and the constable and all other non nazgul chcarcters think of all these strange newcomers, the way you write it?

blithely ignore the rumours and the dead body?

no smoke without fire ... as the phrase goes.

[Gordis]

Sane, I am looking forward to the race very much!
Lotesse, please, come back!

Originally Posted by RÃ*an

And I still haven't had any response about how Rian was a bad manager I mean, should a major domo expect a maid to be murdered and have contingency plans? Should a major domo sleep in the kitchen? Come now, where did she go wrong? All this stuff took place when she would have been ASLEEP! As I said, she has almost completed the staffing in LESS than the required 3 days, and how can one expect an entire MANSION to be cleaned in 2 days? And all meals were good and on-time, etc. etc. I don't see ANYWHERE where she blew it. It's not HER fault that she doesn't know her employers are Nazgul!

A medieval servant is supposed to stay at her working place 24 hours, if she has quarters in the house. If she wants to leave the property, she must ask permission of her masters. You were away without permission. A medieval servant must accept any rudeness from her masters, or quit, she is not supposed to reply back, especially haughtily. A housekeeper is responsible for all the other servants actions. Yes, even when she sleeps. Here the servants were drinking in the kitchen, a girl got molested by stable boys and committed suicide. There was no breakfast in time, but it is just moot, compared to others. I am afraid rpg-Rian will have difficulty to find another place in Tharbad.

[Lady Marion Magdalena]

Say we ignore the saturday classes then. Will that work?

BB, please calm down a bit. You're assuming that my character completely agrees with Rian's character's assumption that Khamul is a woman beater. I never specified that she accepts that view, nor do I intend to make that specification. However, at the moment she is more inclined to be polite to these newly come elves than to Galadanunn (who she recalls being somewhat rude the night before), and so she isn't bothering to argue with that assumption. Make sense?

Please recall also that she's had no sleep and still has several classes to teach. It isn't uncommon for people to act more rashly when tired and I think that would hold true for elves as well as humans though elves might hide it slightly better.

[Butterbeer]

Gor, just seen your post ...well, true, i'll post Boom getting reports from the squirrels, if that is really what TD wants ....?

TD has been writing such great stuff i cannot understand why in his last few posts he seems to want to take the all the nazgul on and so anger the captain? i am flummoxed frankly ... flumooxed i say ...

Shah, am really looking forward to the race post!

let's hope Lotesse can forgive and carry on rpging!

Lotesse, i agree with you, but please do not get so angry - i am not angry just suprised how 2 good writers such as Rian and Td cannot see the oddness of khamuls actions (unless he is seeking a showdown with the captain?) and how odd it is because of a flinch to (at least imho - almost force in such speculation and anger to the point almost of a duel) nor what the impact will be on all other characters as the rumours spread through the city for all this circumstanstail evidence is mounting up, from zimra, arastud (great name! ), mathaliel, and possibly??? earniel ...earniel's character must be wondering about this odd episode???

and of course the 2 hot headed elves ... willing to potentially kill a professor of the university on their first day in a strange city on a hunch and a whim?????


not to mention the honour problems of besmirching a character they hardly know on a very shaky guess and hunch following a flinch? maybe lilly just does not like uncomfortable situations, for all they know!

plus of course this gives both lilly and Viv potential rumour-led problems later with marty and ray, esp when mr O and the king hear of the tragic death and the rumours abounding about the new inhabitants to orrodel and tharbad ....

but ok, if TD really wants this?? and rian really??? has not a care for other rpg players, fine ...nor how this incident has to be written in as causing suspicion on the players from orrodel and that effect on the game ... now I have to have barliman making inquiries ...

Rian , look i do not wish to argue, i enjoy your writing very much, and will just leave it up to you and TD as gor said ... but please do at least consider the repercussions of making them out to be so odd, unlikebale, rude, warlike and generally suspicious .... JUST when a dead body last known to be at their house is fished from the river, drunk ... and as her cousin will testify, she never hardly if ever drinks???

a night on which wierd noises and lights have been seen?

you are forcing the watch to investigate this, and you are making it impossible for me not to have lots of odd events and circumstabtial evidence mount up ... already rumours of the events are going round the city ...

please give it a thought




GOR .. will add the maps in a bit

best BB

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

BB, unless Gor says that the ML would have a problem with what Khamûl did then I don't see the problem. Can you specify what exacly Khamûl has done that would infuriate the ML. He hasn't killed anyone, or started a fight. All he has done is fire his house keeper.

[The last sane person]

*types madly away at the race post* Whew, I hope I dont dissapoin then!

[Butterbeer]

Lady M / willow, i am perfectly calm!

thank-you for your work on the schedule, i just fear it is too much for rpg practicality ... unless we agree attendance will be very low ... else nothing else will be able to happen without everyone getting thrown out!

I think commerce may just be tuesdays at 3pm and the odd seminar group thrown in occasionally ... is that ok with you?

ok fine ref the professor - my only point is character assasination (in the normal sense) is very badly timed here just after a murder ...

but either way the thought is now there in her head, no?

well, anyway tis up to Td and rian ... let us hope they may try and pm lotesse and welcome her back rather than just ignore her concerns, which to me is a bit off...

but i'm cool with it ... lets just move on, the balls now in their court, khamul will have to live with his actions, and the rpg with suspecting the nazgul already.

best BB

[Rían]

Well, I'm back ...

Originally Posted by Butterbeer

well, fine but if you elves are THAT hasty you will not last more than 5 days in tharbad ...

Let's review. Alagos DID stop, and will be more careful now. He JUST found his sister, after thinking she was dead for many, many years, and then hearing she was alive he's been searching for her. And then he finds her, and the three have a wonderful reunion, and then some guy insinuates she's a LIAR? I think his reaction is VERY understandable for a loving, protective brother who has just been reunited with his sister.

my god, what if someone shivers in tharbad?

or sneezes, or looks sad, will we accuse anyone near them of being cannibals, or of torturing them?

however you put it it is one almighty leap of faith to assume such things from a flinch ...

I just plain disagree, and I think the elves are pretty perceptive, in general.

the nobility of Arnor would i think take a very dim view of a lady being beaten

But how are they concerned? And why would the elves tell them? They wouldn't.

let me again quote you in a following rpg post: ...

If you're going to do that, then please quote MORE, especially the parts where they eventually write it off to her maybe doing errands or seeing some other guy. I don't see how unspecified uneasiness is anything wrong. He also writes it off to his general lack of knowledge of higher-ups.

so, every character you have written for is forming a very suspicous view of the orrodel inhabitants, we are soon to have a dead body, and rumours flying around the city, already the MM's are talking to udu ...

No, my characters just think they're unsavory humans, and would not pass on their opinions to just anyone. And I don't see why you're so worried about the dead body?! It sure looked like a suicide to me. WHY would they tie it back to Orrodel? WHY? The elves would NOT say their opinions to the officials at this time; they would only share facts.

rather than not drawing any intention to himself, khamul goes out of his way into the street almost, to make all and sundry suspicious ... you have included CS and lotesse's characters as wooden dummies, and despite lotesse's uinhappiness about this whole post, still think it has no effect on anyone else in the rpg?

He does NOT "make all and sundry suspicious" - I've explained that.

I think Lilly and Penny are in character, submissively watching their Captain, who told them to come, and Lilly flinching at Khamul's movements and anger (which she can clearly see) because of her severe beating just a FEW hours ago. If CS and Lotesse disagree, then I will certainly be happy to edit. But I think when possible, we should accomodate other players, as I did when I made Rian go to Orrodel in the first place, even though I thought she wouldn't naturally do that - the Red Herring was a much better place, IMO. But several players begged me to do it, so I worked with it.

I have answered Lotesse's objections, as far as I know, by explaining that it was NOT a big public scene.

And btw, I tried and TRIED to give you guys other options besides killing the maid!!

what will bumble and the constable and all other non nazgul chcarcters think of all these strange newcomers, the way you write it?

blithely ignore the rumours and the dead body?

The only rumor that will get around is that Rian was sacked. The dead body was YOUR side's choice, and I thought you dealt with it well.

Is there some other issue here that I'm not aware of?

[Butterbeer]

TD, why not read gor's post just now????

a maid had been murdered, the ML not told, did he not say bring things to him?

then you have upset the other naz again ...

then the ML wants nothing to bring any attention on them: instead we have Khamul going out into public, arguing, almost fighting, eyes blazing, we have elves thinking he is a woman beater and after the nights odd events your maid is about to be fished out of the river, with rumours flying???

how would the ML be happy?

Gor has made it clear here many times she does not approve ...do you wish me to go catalouge and quote them all for you????

TD, you have been writing some great stuff .. ... i just do not understand why you wish to go against the captains orders, nor gor's wishes, nor put the nazgul into jeopardy by hot headedness ... by having a slanging match out in public?

[Rían]

Originally Posted by Gordis

A medieval servant is supposed to stay at her working place 24 hours, if she has quarters in the house....

I don't believe that that was specified here. Or if you want to go another route, Rian wasn't told that. As was mentioned in the interview, her resume was rather thin, and she was on trial. Her understanding was that she was to get the house up and running, and IMHO, she did a stellar job.

A medieval servant must accept any rudeness from her masters, or quit, she is not supposed to reply back, especially haughtily.

Again, not specified here, and you guys specified over and over that it was some wonderful, prestigious position that she had, and she would be treated with RESPECT. She got the place up and running, and did it well. And if she received continued rudeness, she would quit. She is USED to her employers treating her well, because she does such a good job, and would never work under any other conditions.

A housekeeper is responsible for all the other servants actions. Yes, even when she sleeps. Here the servants were drinking in the kitchen, a girl got molested by stable boys and committed suicide.

All three are untrue - they were forced actions by the Nazgul. Now your characters might say she did a bad job (and they DID, altho they themselves knew better), but you guys here should not be saying she did a bad job, IMO.

There was no breakfast in time, but it is just moot, compared to others.

Breakfast was ready at the specified time. Breakfast was NOT requested at dawn

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

Originally Posted by Gordis

Why did the ML give Khamul command of the Orrodel group? Because being at the University and VERY occupied (he gives 4 courses of lectures!), it was impossible for him to watch the Orrodel family close. And they needed watching: Lilly is a fool, Buz is an alcoholic and completely under Lilly’s heel, Vivvie is too impulsive, especially when angry, and loves to steal beautiful baubles.

So the ML appointed his trusted Second to be his representative in Orrodel. Yes, the ML was not told of the maid. Because, after all, it was a MINOR problem, one silly MORTAL to quieten, and Khamul decided he was perfectly capable on handling it on his own. And he handled it quite well, IMHO.

Gor said here that Khamûl handled the situation quite well. Is that the only problem?

[The last sane person]

Wow, this thread is on a hair pin trigger! Though, to be fair BB, people ARE editing their posts.

[Rían]

And one more time - would you opponents of this scene PLEASE stop saying that it was some public shouting match, when we've said over and OVER that it is NOT! I've even written in now that the onlookers WENT AWAY! because nothing exciting was happening! What more do you want me to put in, that they all fell asleep?

[Butterbeer]

well, as i said its up to you and td ... if mine, gors and lotesses opinion do not matter, fine.

thats cool

ive left it ..

i shall report the incident to the captain as gor requested and khamul can deal with the consequences since that is what he wants.

The watch will now have to investigate, please make your characters avaialbe if sent for.

very best BB

lets move on.

shah, well yes i guess your right about editing , but not the points that others are unhappy about, and i DO hope lotesse will be cool and carry on, especially as you have spent so much time twice on the race post!

anyway, i am happy for all to do as they wish, and lets just carry on in a good spirit ok?

best BB

[Lady Marion Magdalena]

I think commerce may just be tuesdays at 3pm and the odd seminar group thrown in occasionally ... is that ok with you?

Say we switch Commerce with Defensive Building. Would Commerce at 2:50pm be close enough to what you had in mind?

EDIT: Here's the corrected version:

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c1...rrections2.jpg

Pardon the crappy scan, except for the fact that Defensive building and Commerce are switched and Saturday has been deleted it's this same as before.

[Butterbeer]

thats great, thanks lady M!

[Rían]

Originally Posted by Butterbeer

well, anyway tis up to Td and rian ... let us hope they may try and pm lotesse and welcome her back rather than just ignore her concerns, which to me is a bit off...

How have I ignored her concerns? I've addressed every single one of them. I've edited my posts, over and over again, to address them.

Originally Posted by bb

if mine, gors and lotesses opinion do not matter, fine

They DO matter, that's why we've edited our posts, over and over! It seems to me to be more the other way around


Is Lotesse leaving? I hope not!

[Butterbeer]

rian, lets just leave it ok?

if you are happy with it, then fine ...

i can't be doing with arguing .. i have investiagat-teting to be a doing!

best BB

[Rían]

Maggie - Earniel gave me a suggestion how to change my post #470 so you don't have to change yours. I think it works perfectly - see what you think.

One more general comment - guys, I have no more interest in "outing" the Nazgul than you do at this point in time, because that would end the rpg, which I don't want to happen. I thought it was an interesting, tension-filled, fun incident which did nothing more than plant some seeds in the heads of my elves that won't sprout for some time. I repeat that they think the Orrodel inhabitants boorish, but NOT Nazgul!!!! And I wrote that the onlookers turned and left after seeing NOTHING interesting happen. They were across the street, not next to the group.

A great part of this experience is the differing opinions going on. I hope we can just write this down to we have different opinions and don't always agree, especially given our repeated assurances that it was NOT by ANY means a public display, and the elves will NOT repeat their opinions to others at this point in time - why should they?

Let's have that race!

[Rían]

I cross-posted with you, BB - that's fine with me, I just wanted to make very clear that the opinions of you guys DO matter VERY much, as evidenced by my copious editing!!