Discussion Thread Number 4 Of Wraiths-Kings-Friends-Rings Campaign

[The last sane person]

*shrugs* beats me. There was nothing in any of the melwen posts that i read that had her talking. She was mostly feverish and sick, then she got chucked off the bridge.

[Udukhaturz]

Anything for peace. The post is dead.

[Valandil]

Wow - like 5 pages in the Discussion Thread in a 24-hour period... and most of it was to get removal of the notion that Orrodel is a topic of hot gossip in Tharbad?

OK folks, let's think about this:

You have an ancient culture - most people never really travel that far from home - few more than a single day's walk. Property is of high importance and passes down to relatives. If a major piece of real estate opened up, SOMEone would step up to claim it. Coined money is probably pretty scarce.

So now, what do we have here? A family comes in from the distant east, apparently throwing all kinds of money around, somehow manages to get their hands on one of the choicest estates in the city. Do you think they're NOT going to get talked about?

And then... they conduct themselves in public in a very UN-Tharbad like way! And there have been lights spotted inside the mansion into late hours of the night... even after 10 o'clock!

So then... all you Nazgul characters seemed to think it was oh so very clever the way Melwen was eliminated. And yes... nothing can be definitively pinned on any of you, but don't you think that a servant from your own household commiting suicide is going to draw people's attention? And especially when it's THAT house, with that strange family of "ferreners"? My how people would talk! And maybe not EVERYone in town knows Lilly yet - but some do - and at each appearance, someone in the crowd will probably know who that odd lady (EDIT: not that there's anything WRONG with that, CS!) is - and whisper it to someone else, who would whisper it to a couple someone-elses, etc, etc...

You guys have GOT to be the talk of the town - even with the High King around to go to school! Let's face it, you're not exactly trying very hard to 'blend in'. And then... the stories will grow in the telling! Soon there will be exaggerated versions and all KINDS of rumors flying around!

I mean, Gordis... if you just TRY to bring up King Valandil wanting to build a fleet to take on the world, I think the ladies of the sewing circle would pause, listen politely, then go right back to talking about the latest exploits of "that family in Orrodel"! Don't you?

Udu - I'm sad I missed your post, whatever it was.

BB - I was thinking maybe it would be best if Watson was the one who eventually makes a grand discovery! Little Bo Peep... hmmmmm

LSP - I'm not so sure I'm in a hurry to see bodily harm come to Marty... I'm game though if you really want to.

Rian - I'll see what I can do... I'm quite tired tonight though - and it's real late. Big task at work... (EDIT: Oh - and can we make it clear that the arrow thing at Rivendell was being exaggerated in some way? You know how stories grow in the telling. I see you got straightened out on the benches. I ALMOST had Val sit right in the middle of his, so that he could possibly get Rian and Earniel on each side - and was certain to get at least one of them... but decided against it. Which of you sat next to him anyway?)

Lotesse - remember... you're a mortal too... in RL!

There's probably a couple more pages worth to attempt to respond to, but I'm feeling pretty cooked.

[Valandil]

One thing more... I don't think Val is gonna be out TOO late tonight. He'll need to get to sleep soon... big day of classes tomorrow and all.

[Udukhaturz]

Originally Posted by Valandil

Udu - I'm sad I missed your post, whatever it was.

Val, the post was pretty much what you said in a nutshell. The only thing I missed was all the gossip about Udu buying a house.

[Butterbeer]

Originally Posted by Udukhaturz

Val, the post was pretty much what you said in a nutshell. The only thing I missed was all the gossip about Udu buying a house.

UDU this absolutely flabbergahsts me ... it is so far from the truth it is unbeleivable.

Now i just read what Valandil says above and i agree with it .. and you know what? IT IS THE VERY POINT that i DO agree with it, wherein lies the problem with what you and Gor have cooked up ...

it would take me far too long now to list points and problems with it ... i do not have the time ...

but you see Valandil has considered the story, the situation the rpg and the nuances we have worked to hard and yes, *sigh*argued about, to build in here to keep our world in check ...

[Gordis]

I have removed my post as Udu removed his. Now happy, BB?

[Butterbeer]

why would i be happy?

I never like it when people delete posts because people ask them to look at it ...

I stated MORE THAN ONCE i liked the THe character and the ideas ...

I just asked you to look at it and tone it down.

what annoyed me were the stupid immfamatory answers like the melwen thing from Udu: it just seemed like ...

[Gordis]

Originally Posted by Butterbeer

what annoyed me were the stupid immfamatory answers like the melwen thing from Udu: it just seemed like ...

It one has to look for "immafamatory" posts one has to look at yours BB.

Note, I haven't added that they were "stupid". But offensive they were and are.

I am off from here, at least for some time.

No need to close this thread, I have stopped this discussion for my part

[Earniel]

Originally Posted by Lady Marion Magdalena

and unless I'm very much mistaken, Earniel's character came to Tharbad to, in effect, spy things out herself.

Accurate, in a way.

On this you can all trust me, if this should be an issue, RPG-Eärniel will not have nor ever need either spies or a network of them in Tharbad.

Originally Posted by Valandil

One thing more... I don't think Val is gonna be out TOO late tonight. He'll need to get to sleep soon... big day of classes tomorrow and all.

Neither will Eärniel, she doesn't usually visit pubs in the evening (regardless of the fact that there normally wouldn't be any in Nîn-In-Eilph where she could have grown the habit ). And besides, Itazel and Danor would probably start to worry if their guests take too long to collect some luggage.

[Butterbeer]

sorry for the staccato response ..am at work ...

i was to continue on saying ...

it just seemed like you two could not see the problem and were just ignoring it ... what got me Gor, was that for someone who asks for edits left right and centre both you and udu seemed not to even want to consider that anything might need changing ...

so, someone asks you to consider looking at it, and you and udu DELETE both posts???

and yes, i logged off to cool down last night ... as i suggest you do if you are that angry about being asked to consider looking at a post .... the implications are FOR ALL and for the WHOLE rpg if there are spies EVERYWHERE

to me, seriously, this does radically alter the whole rpg, the city as we know it, effects every character and player ... i am more than happy to discuss this later in detail, if you don't see it ... though for someone as intelligent as you and udu i can't understand how you would not see it and thus understand why there are concerns ..

The idea of this effects every player and every post: of a network of super spies that can see everything everywhere, without any of us other rpgers having any say on the matter introduced into the game at this point with no prior discussion with the rest of the players

not only will we never know what is secret or not, thus we cannot really rpg, if the spy network is as all powerful as it must have been from what was written in that post ... but the realities of this ultimately, if it is to make any sense as you have both written, completely alter the world we live in, as valandil's post outlines ..remember the world we are in ... a small insular city... in the heart of arnor ...now of course this works both ways ..yes, i agree ... but for a nazgul to set up a vast intricate all powerful spy system that he must have to get the info that was reported in the post ... just is unbelivable and throws the whole world on it's head ..at least for me ..



and will you not look at the inconsitences in the two posts ...

you see it is not the idea or the feedback, i think it good .. but what is written makes no sense, implies that everything is heard or seen ..thus he must have more spies in tharbad than actual other people that live there ....

also, this radically alters the world again if an undercover nazgul, following the defeat of sauron can in three years disguise himself, take up a full time position, acquire wealth and set up a network of trusted evil spies ... mention worshipping the darkness' to stepathon ... yet this guy does not even know khamul that has been working for the ML for a while ...????
but he does know (as ALL of his spies for this to even resemble working) must the names and identitys of everyone else in the city ?????? including those that arrived a few days ago ... and meathor is known by name in the cod after what one possibly two drinks there????

Gor there is no need to be like that ... but do as you will ... but i am sorry if we cannot even raise valid queries about a post without the poster even at least willing to discuss it and then deleting the post?
yet you ask and do all the time and always pretty much get a good feedback ... why then can this not be a two way thing?

it is only the inconsistency of asking for edits and poo-poohing others valid concerns that got me upset ... and be fair the udu quote about melwen was stupid - or ok, maybe meant as a joke?? if not a joke then, c'mon ..it makes no sense ... if we then get into maybe situations it just gets farcical ..so maybe you can see why i thought it inflammatory? If not a joke and serious, then again it carelessly turns the whole game around on its head without consulting the other players who did indeed discuss this event for a long time in advance ... and thus is also inflammtory.

you two did get very defensive, added at best (in udu's quote eg) some rather odd and easily taken the wrong way comments ..and in tone did imply it was fine ...so shut up ... maybe it came across wrong??? ..but as i say, for someone as intelligent and reasonable as you to treat us this way when we only asked you to look at it ... yet advocate yourself the value of nit-picking ... was too much ...

hopefully if nothing else you'll see what i think ... even if you do not agree with it.

very best BB

[Telcontar_Dunedain]

I agree with most of what Val posted. Orrodel is bound to be the centre of gossip at the moment, with the death of one of the maids and Liaenwen's antics in town.

Nice posts all. Especially Val, loved your last two posts.

[Serenoli]

Somehow I always miss the fights! Must be the time-difference or sth, but evryone quarrels when I'm asleep...

Pity I didn't get to read the Sapthan post... hopefully, the posts will be re-written? With less spies, I suppose... but mostly I hope that you all come back...

Val, and CS, am enjoying your posts at RH. And I also liked Maggie's sewing post, but forgot to mention it earlier.

[CrazySquirrel]

Originally Posted by Telcontar_Dunedain

I agree with most of what Val posted. Orrodel is bound to be the centre of gossip at the moment, with the death of one of the maids and Liaenwen's antics in town..

Of course it should! THERE MUST BE TALK OF ORRODEL ALL OVER THARBAD!!!

Lilly and Buz have been in Tharbad for 3 weeks, have you forgotten? Buz mostly drinking in riverside taverns (see my old post), Lilly flaunting her revealing dresses and spending lots of money in various places. I don't think it was normal for a lady to go ALONE even to the Herring. EVEN if Buz and Lil were quiet as mice, there would have been talk already.

Then - the Rotting Cod. (FRIDAY night) You think the appearance of a noble lady THERE at NIGHT is USUAL??
Moreover, Marty and Ray suspected that Lilly picked a sailor's pocket. So the same suspicion could have been shared by others, and discussed.

And don't tell me they didn't know her. Lilly is not a grey mouse. She is quite conspicous with her RED hair and GREEN eyes and her immodest dresses. Could be easily recognised by a verbal description.

Saturday night - Marty and Ray and all the Family spent HALF OF THE NIGHT drinking and eating in the DINING ROOM, with lights visible from the street. - Is it already forgotten?

Sunday night - suicide! Is this one NOT discussed? Are Arastud and Arabud not talking? Is the Dwimmerbusy silent. Is BB's WIFE silent? Is Zimra silent? I bet she discusses it all through Tharbad. That's why in my last Orrodel post she was GONE somewhere. All her relatives are talking and Arastud's relatives and poor ANNAWEN, forgotten by everybody.

I bet the talk at the Red Herring around Annawen turns around like that: "You better forget this guy, it seems he was the cause that that poor thing, Melwen, did herself in. Perhaps he made her drunk and...And you heard Rian doesn't work there anymore? There is her bag lying in the corner waiting fer her. And the Constable wants to talk to her, must be about Melwen..."

And now SERVANTS.

First Lil and Buz had NO SERVANTS at all, a very interesting thing in itself. Then they have hired an Elf. And an Elf that was known to lots of people around Red Herring. Was it not being discussed.
Was her firing not being discussed? not the scandal, but the FACT itself - two days at a job and then please collect your bag at the Herring.

And Melwen, She was hired on SATURDAY. As the Kitchen maid. The same day she was promoted to a ladymaid. YOU THINK SHE TOLD NO ONE?? Nothing about Lilly, scary Professor, haughty Elf-housekeeper and too friendly master Pengolod??
Sure, on Sunday night she couldn't talk! BUT before???



So PEOPLE HAD A LOT TO TALK ABOUT. Why a few spies INTERESTED in the talk couldn't report it back?? ALL THE ABOVE. And the episode at the Singing Swan. AND what is now happenning in the Red Herring. Why reporting this gossip is "omnipotence"?

[Valandil]

Rian... Earniel... your move!

[Rían]

*yawn* I was on an all-day field trip with my son's 4th grade class - am too tired to post coherently *Double yawn*

I'll post tomorrow - I have a pretty clear day - yay!

*headdesk*

(ps - re your PM - what if it was ... Alagos?!?! )

[Rían]

Lotesse - loved your elf-smell addition!

general thoughts on gossip - I agree that talk would most definitely get out about these things that are out of the ordinary that CS listed, but I also agree that we shouldn't use gossip as an easy way out of anything. And remember, FOEADs, we FOGALS don't have any interest in "outing" things too soon - we'd like the game to keep going

[Earniel]

Originally Posted by Valandil

Rian... Earniel... your move!

I'm a little bit busy at the moment (holiday season is extending its claws and so on) to write in the RPG, but I'll try to post something on Sunday. I don't think I can make time before that to put my mind to writing. If you don't want to wait for that, feel free to continue without my input for a day or two.

[Rían]

*gets eeeevil thoughts about writing a post after real-life Earniel is away from the Moot ... *

[Earniel]

I'm a little short on time to invest into deciding what to write and writing a RPG-post out. I think I can manage moderating to keep an eye on you, weasel-Elf!