the most tragic heroes - Page 2

Wayfarer · 05-24-2002, 05:46 PM

Turin I'll go with...

What's her name, the queen of numenor? It must have sucked to be her. Also the picture of her climbing the meneltarma while numenor was drowning is very poetic.

Third age- Noone said frodo! He was the saddest of the bunch!

BeardofPants · 08-25-2002, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Renille
1st age- Turin. Definitely Turin.

2nd age- Erendis (Aldarion's wife who turned bitter against all men once her husband kept going away...she's not exactly a hero, but she's a tragic figure.)

3rd age- Gollum

I'd go with this, but I'd replace Gollum with either Frodo, or Boromir, or perhaps even Hama.

And I'd say that Aldarion is just as much a victim, as Erendis.

Menelvagor · 08-25-2002, 01:41 PM

1st- Turin (can't really top that)
2nd- I'll agree with Wayfarer, Tar-Miriel
3rd- hm, Frodo? perhaps Theoden

Sween · 08-25-2002, 02:24 PM

theres nothing wrong with the way theoden went out. thats the kinda death you can be proud of i hope i go out in style like him

Menelvagor · 08-25-2002, 02:42 PM

The way he died wasn't tragic, but it does seem kinda sad to spend so much of your life under the influence of someone like Wormtongue, and then, as soon as he recovers, is killed. He doesn't really qualify as tragic, I suppose, but I can't really think of anyone for the third age. Maybe I'll change that to Hama...

Christiana · 08-25-2002, 04:09 PM

FA:Finrod
SA:Gil-galad
TA:Frodo
FA:Arwen

afro-elf · 08-26-2002, 07:54 AM

Quote:

perhaps even Hama

Really? I would choose Halabard (sp) over him.

But, I think that there others FAR more worthy of the title of "MOST" tragic hero. This is not to belittle them, but anyone who dies in a war COULD be consindered tragic. But, for MOST tragic of the 3rd Hama is WAY down the list. (btw i do like his character)

Quote:

FA:Arwen

Nice thought there young lady

BeardofPants · 08-26-2002, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by afro-elf

Really? I would choose Halabard (sp) over him.

But, I think that there others FAR more worthy of the title of "MOST" tragic hero. This is not to belittle them, but anyone who dies in a war COULD be consindered tragic. But, for MOST tragic of the 3rd Hama is WAY down the list. (btw i do like his character)

It was just a consideration. I don't think there is enough information about him to base a decision on. However, for me, I was quite bereft when I found out that he died.

thingol · 08-27-2002, 05:09 AM

i agree with you radagast

Radagast The Brown · 08-30-2002, 10:39 AM

Quote:

[i]originally posted by Wayfarer[i]
Third age- Noone said frodo! He was the saddest of the bunch!

I mentioned tragic fall, not tragic hero.

The Lady of Ithilien · 08-30-2002, 07:51 PM

First Age: Hurin for many things, but especially for never telling Morwen how their daughter had found their son.

Second Age: Tar-Miriel (though Amandil runs a close second).

Third Age: Saruman.

Fourth Age: Arwen.

Mirahzi · 08-30-2002, 09:52 PM

First Age: Maglor..

Radagast The Brown · 08-31-2002, 12:12 PM

First Age - Fingolfin
Second Age - Elendil
Third Age - Sauron

UnStashable · 08-31-2002, 01:26 PM

This is kind of off topic but I think people here when talking about Isildur were thinking of the fight seen in the movie which is not how it happened in the books. I think in the books Isildur dosen't accidently cut off Sauron's finger, He stands over Sauronds broken body with the ring still on it and cuts it off.

Khadrane · 09-01-2002, 10:30 AM

Lets see...
First Age:Turin
Second Age: Aldarion's and Erendis' daughter. (I can't think of her name right now.) I know she's not much of a hero, but she has a pretty tragic story.
Third Age: Boromir

Telperion · 09-01-2002, 11:09 PM

I've only gotten to where Fingolfin rescues ???? from Morgoth's stronghold in the Silmarillon so I can't answere for the second age and my answere for the first age won't be all that informed. Oh well, here it goes.

First age: Feanor
Second age: ???
Third age: Borimir.

Ñólendil · 09-02-2002, 12:36 AM

????=Maedhros, but it was not Fingolfin who rescued him, it was Fingolfin's eldest son: Fingon the valiant.

Willow Oran · 09-04-2002, 06:35 PM

I think I'd have to choose Finrod over Turin for the first ages most tagic hero, though Maglor takes a close second. For the second age I 'd choose Gil-Galad, for the third age I'd choose Elrond, I know he doesn't die but he gets permenately seperated from all of his children and he has to tell his wife who he has seen for half an age about it when he gets to Aman and I think that that's more tragic than any of the deaths suffered by humans. For the fourth age I'd definetly say Arwen and/or Aragorn.

Elanor · 10-12-2005, 07:14 PM

There are way too many tragic heroes, and they get on my nerves. I guess it's because I don't believe in fate. Feanor, Turin, Thorin, and Denethor are the most annoyingly tragic, because they doom themselves, or they change their name too many times (I really think this was Turin's main problem!), or get so proud that they can't see beyond their noses.

I think Turin is similar to Oedipus, and Denethor to King Lear. What other literary tragic heroes do you think resemble Tolkien's?

Lefty Scaevola · 10-12-2005, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garina

Turin is definitely the tragic hero for the First Age. Funny how no one disputes that!

I do. For me it is Hurin, he fall from a loftier Height from Turin, and from character flaws tiny compared to Turin. Turin is a self absorbed brat, with little of the nobility of charactor of his father, well earning smackdowns repeatedly through selfishness, vanity (enough for reigning kings when he is a fugitive), violent rages, banditry, murder, obstinacy, and follishness. Hurin's flaws are much more subtle, his pride far more rational, and a great challenge for even Morgoth to exploit even with years of captivity, and even then, as soon as he realizes that Morgoth is making some subtle manipulation use of him, he ends the evil, wheas truin is repeatedly slapped in the face with the evil he has done, and kills himself over unintend incest, rather than earlier intentional crimes of violence.

05-24-2002, 05:46 PM	#21
Wayfarer The Insufferable Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 3,333	Turin I'll go with... What's her name, the queen of numenor? It must have sucked to be her. Also the picture of her climbing the meneltarma while numenor was drowning is very poetic. Third age- Noone said frodo! He was the saddest of the bunch! __________________ Disgraced he may be, yet is not dethroned, and keeps the rags of lordship once he owned

08-25-2002, 02:24 PM	#24
Sween im quite stupid Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Cockermouth Posts: 2,058	theres nothing wrong with the way theoden went out. thats the kinda death you can be proud of i hope i go out in style like him __________________ Yeah god hes ok but i would rather be judged by a sheep than that idiot

08-25-2002, 04:09 PM	#26
Christiana Elf Lord Join Date: May 2002 Location: Searching desperately for a swan boat to take to Valinor Posts: 1,231	FA:Finrod SA:Gil-galad TA:Frodo FA:Arwen __________________ I take full responsibility for my actions, except for those that are somebody else's fault Having someone to blame is nearly as good as having a solution to the problem Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you are a mile away from them, and you habe their shoes. ~Frieda Norris

08-31-2002, 12:12 PM	#33
Radagast The Brown Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Israel Posts: 6,975	First Age - Fingolfin Second Age - Elendil Third Age - Sauron __________________ Lalala... poof! AboutNewJersey.com - New Jersey Travel and Tourism Guide

08-31-2002, 01:26 PM	#34
UnStashable Enting Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 52	This is kind of off topic but I think people here when talking about Isildur were thinking of the fight seen in the movie which is not how it happened in the books. I think in the books Isildur dosen't accidently cut off Sauron's finger, He stands over Sauronds broken body with the ring still on it and cuts it off. __________________ This elevator only goes to the basement, and sombody made an awful mess down there

08-25-2002, 01:41 PM	#23
Menelvagor Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: lurking on the edge of conversations Posts: 924	1st- Turin (can't really top that) 2nd- I'll agree with Wayfarer, Tar-Miriel 3rd- hm, Frodo? perhaps Theoden

08-25-2002, 02:42 PM	#25
Menelvagor Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: lurking on the edge of conversations Posts: 924	The way he died wasn't tragic, but it does seem kinda sad to spend so much of your life under the influence of someone like Wormtongue, and then, as soon as he recovers, is killed. He doesn't really qualify as tragic, I suppose, but I can't really think of anyone for the third age. Maybe I'll change that to Hama...

08-27-2002, 05:09 AM	#29
thingol Hobbit Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: norway,stord Posts: 30	i agree with you radagast

08-30-2002, 07:51 PM	#31
The Lady of Ithilien Elven Warrior Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Right here in between yesterday and tomorrow. Posts: 357	First Age: Hurin for many things, but especially for never telling Morwen how their daughter had found their son. Second Age: Tar-Miriel (though Amandil runs a close second). Third Age: Saruman. Fourth Age: Arwen.

08-30-2002, 09:52 PM	#32
Mirahzi Elf Lord Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 1,286	First Age: Maglor..

09-01-2002, 10:30 AM	#35
Khadrane Elf Lord Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Middle Earth (I wish) Posts: 670	Lets see... First Age:Turin Second Age: Aldarion's and Erendis' daughter. (I can't think of her name right now.) I know she's not much of a hero, but she has a pretty tragic story. Third Age: Boromir __________________ Few know whither their road will take them till they come to its end. -Legolas FRODO LIVES! ABORTION IS HOMICIDE

09-01-2002, 11:09 PM	#36
Telperion Enting Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Calgary Posts: 78	I've only gotten to where Fingolfin rescues ???? from Morgoth's stronghold in the Silmarillon so I can't answere for the second age and my answere for the first age won't be all that informed. Oh well, here it goes. First age: Feanor Second age: ??? Third age: Borimir. __________________ Wherever you go, there you are. Aim for the stars, if you miss, you'll at least land on the moon! He who is made of air should not accuse the wind. My mind wanders. "Not all those who wander are lost." Therefore, my mind is not lost. Now, my question to those of you who doubt my sanity is this: How can someone who has not lost their mind be insane?

09-02-2002, 12:36 AM	#37
Ñólendil Elf Lord Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: California Posts: 60,865	????=Maedhros, but it was not Fingolfin who rescued him, it was Fingolfin's eldest son: Fingon the valiant. __________________ Falmon -- Dylan Last edited by Ñólendil : 09-02-2002 at 12:37 AM.

09-04-2002, 06:35 PM	#38
Willow Oran Deus Ex Machina Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Seattle Posts: 1,951	I think I'd have to choose Finrod over Turin for the first ages most tagic hero, though Maglor takes a close second. For the second age I 'd choose Gil-Galad, for the third age I'd choose Elrond, I know he doesn't die but he gets permenately seperated from all of his children and he has to tell his wife who he has seen for half an age about it when he gets to Aman and I think that that's more tragic than any of the deaths suffered by humans. For the fourth age I'd definetly say Arwen and/or Aragorn. __________________ "5. Plain Rings with RUNES on the inside. Avoid these like the PLAGUE. -Diana Wynne Jones Tough Guide To FantasyLand ...it's not much of a show if somebody doesn't suffer, and preferably at length. Suffering is beautiful in any case, and so is anguish; but as for loathing, and bitterness... I don't think they belong on the stage at all. - Isabella, I Gelosi

10-12-2005, 07:14 PM	#39
Elanor Hobbit in the Music Join Date: Nov 1999 Location: Westmarch Posts: 1,111	There are way too many tragic heroes, and they get on my nerves. I guess it's because I don't believe in fate. Feanor, Turin, Thorin, and Denethor are the most annoyingly tragic, because they doom themselves, or they change their name too many times (I really think this was Turin's main problem!), or get so proud that they can't see beyond their noses. I think Turin is similar to Oedipus, and Denethor to King Lear. What other literary tragic heroes do you think resemble Tolkien's? __________________ Middle Earth Crossword Puzzle on the Tolkien Site of DOOM Segovia Mazes

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