America and Its Culture

[HOBBIT]

of course movies are part of our culture.

they celebrate thanksgiving in canada? thats odd. go figure.

[Rían]

They're thankful that the Pilgrims didn't land further north?

[Lief Erikson]

Originally Posted by Gwaimir Windgem

I did not dismiss the sports, in fact I think they are a part of culture; just not part that's my cup of tea. As for movies, I find it difficult to define something positive by something of at least dubious value.

Lol!

No offense at all intended, but I just like a lot of movies and watch them a LOT, so I can't help but find that funny . And I think they do have a lot of value, in the same way theater does or fun books do. They're an art form that combines many different kinds of art. It ties the acting of theater together with skill at writing, that comes out in screenplays, and these are united too to the skills required for shooting the film well, and then of course many elements such as scenery, dress, and other are required.

There are many skills that go into the making of movies, and of course some movies are flops and most of them have at least weak points here and there. But the movie itself has the potential, depending on the level of effort, skill and craftsmanship that go into it, to be s wonderful work of art.

That's my opinion .

[Lotesse]

Originally Posted by Lief Erikson

Lol!

No offense at all intended, but I just like a lot of movies and watch them a LOT, so I can't help but find that funny . And I think they do have a lot of value, in the same way theater does or fun books do. They're an art form that combines many different kinds of art. It ties the acting of theater together with skill at writing, that comes out in screenplays, and these are united too to the skills required for shooting the film well, and then of course many elements such as scenery, dress, and other are required.

There are many skills that go into the making of movies, and of course some movies are flops and most of them have at least weak points here and there. But the movie itself has the potential, depending on the level of effort, skill and craftsmanship that go into it, to be s wonderful work of art.
That's my opinion .

Oh, LIEF!!! I so, so, so agree with you here!! This is so damn true, folks; Lief said it very well. So, so true. My respect-o-meter for you just now did a huge upward leap; the mercury looks fit to bust through the top of the barometer, dear Lief! Very, very cool -

[hectorberlioz]

I used to be a big movie man myself...not so much anymore, but I still like them.

Anyways, if I may point out, the Metropolitan Opera has been with us for quite awhile, and though they've performed very few operas by Americans, you really can't blame them. Most American operas are horrid.

But also this people: what about all the Great American Orchestras?
Cleveland, Chicago, New York Phil etc...

What about Coney Island?

Arnold Schoenberg, Igor Stravinsky, and Rachmaninov all lived in and loved California.

Tchaikovsky noted that Americans were far more friendly than most of his own people...

Dvorak visited Spillville Iowa and Niagra, and he wrote his Cello Concerto in B minor because he was so inspired by Niagra.

Hey, and then we have Ferde Grofe, who wrote a music suite for the Mississippi, Niagra, Grand Canyon, and Hollywood.

As Lief mentioned above, we have the Cowboy mythology, and that's pretty famous stuff in other countries.

Elvis too.

[captain carrot]

Originally Posted by Mari

... When there is a party here everyone comes in their countries traditional clothes, show some traditional dances or do other traditional things and all the Westerners (a few Americans, 2 from the Netherlands, 4 from France and 3 from Germany) are just standing there not knowing what to do. We have no clothes to wear except for our everyday clothes, traditional dances: I can't think of any but a walz or something like that (a dance which you cannot do by yourself) and when they ask about traditional food I have trouble explaining that we do have some traditional foods, but that they are hardly known even to ourselves.

oh, that'd be easy - us brits would just get tanked, chat up the blonde dutch girl, get pissed with the Germans, making fun of the french - the brits somewhat subtly, the germans with about as much sublety as a panzer brigade, subsequently have a fight with the germans, have some more beer and some chips, make up with the germans and everyone then argues with the french again.

Now, European sophistication like that - well, that takes hundreds of years of culture!


.................................................. .............................................

[hectorberlioz]

Everyone makes fun of the poor French, except the French.

British stereotype: "Fish 'n chips! I want me fish 'n chips!"

[The Gaffer]

Chicken Tikka Masala is officially Britain's favourite food nowadays. In fact, we even export it to India, would you believe.

Heaven in Europe:
The British are the police
The Germans are the car mechanics
The French are the cooks
The Italians are the lovers
and it's all organised by the Swiss

Hell in Europe
The Germans are the police
The French are the car mechanics
The British are the cooks
The Swiss are the lovers
and it's all organised by the Italians

Joke told to me by a Swiss bloke.

[hectorberlioz]

Thats like us coming up with french fries and exporting McDonalds to France...

[sun-star]

Originally Posted by The Gaffer

Chicken Tikka Masala is officially Britain's favourite food nowadays. In fact, we even export it to India, would you believe.

Heaven in Europe:
The British are the police
The Germans are the car mechanics
The French are the cooks
The Italians are the lovers
and it's all organised by the Swiss

Hell in Europe
The Germans are the police
The French are the car mechanics
The British are the cooks
The Swiss are the lovers
and it's all organised by the Italians

Joke told to me by a Swiss bloke.

What's so great about the British police, though?

[Rían]

They're just so CUTE in their little uniforms!

[Earniel]

Originally Posted by hectorberlioz

Thats like us coming up with french fries and exporting McDonalds to France...

Except that French fries are not originally French.

Originally Posted by hectorberlioz

As Lief mentioned above, we have the Cowboy mythology, and that's pretty famous stuff in other countries.

Quite. There's this movie I once heard of, and that I am still hoping they'll play it on TV one day that puts cowboys against a dinosaur. Now I ask you, what can beat that?

[captain carrot]

Rian:

They're just so CUTE in their little uniforms!

little uniforms?

One suspects Rian may have seen one too many striptease shows!

[Lief Erikson]

Originally Posted by The Gaffer

Chicken Tikka Masala is officially Britain's favourite food nowadays. In fact, we even export it to India, would you believe.

Heaven in Europe:
The British are the police
The Germans are the car mechanics
The French are the cooks
The Italians are the lovers
and it's all organised by the Swiss

Hell in Europe
The Germans are the police
The French are the car mechanics
The British are the cooks
The Swiss are the lovers
and it's all organised by the Italians

Joke told to me by a Swiss bloke.

Lol! That's great, Gaffer .

[Anglorfin]

Whenever someone mentions American culture I usually tend to think about the past in America. Back when there was still a richness to life or whatever you want to call it. Sad truth is nowadays I believe people are forgetting a lot about what made this country great. How millions of people would look at America as the land of opportunity (it still is, just not in such a romantic way).

That's a good word for how I view American historical culture. Romantic. Everyone had big epic dreams. Even the dream of owning the house and the struggle to do so was epic. The American Revolution, romantic. The idea of cowboys and the wild west and settlers exploring a new land was romantic. Hell even the space race to me is romantic. Sure every country has their dark spots in history (or modern times for that matter) but America has done a lot to be remembered for in the 231 years that it's been around.

As for me personally I love cultural celebrations of any sort. And just the fact that in America there are so many different celebrations all over the nation for scores of different heritage groups that call America home is really amazing. I doubt parades happen with such frequency anywhere else in the world.

[Lief Erikson]

My suspicion is that living inside our current time period makes it feel normal to you, and hence less romantic. Other time periods look less ordinary because you aren't in them, and they seem somewhat more romantic or epic as a consequence. I suspect that if anyone from 100 years ago could look forward into the future and see our society as it is now, the word "epic" would not come near to covering sufficiently the astonishing vista.

I agree with you, though, that many Americans tragically don't appreciate what they have.

[Mari]

Originally Posted by Anglorfin

oh, that'd be easy - us brits would just get tanked, chat up the blonde dutch girl, get pissed with the Germans, making fun of the french - the brits somewhat subtly, the germans with about as much sublety as a panzer brigade, subsequently have a fight with the germans, have some more beer and some chips, make up with the germans and everyone then argues with the french again.

Now, European sophistication like that - well, that takes hundreds of years of culture!

Do I want to be sophisticated in that way? But it does seem like fun. Here there is no alcohol allowed and during "parties" we are supposed to play games like rock paper scissors... Guess that sometimes European "sophistication" is still better even without the traditional stuff

Originally Posted by Anglorfin

Whenever someone mentions American culture I usually tend to think about the past in America. Back when there was still a richness to life or whatever you want to call it. Sad truth is nowadays I believe people are forgetting a lot about what made this country great.

I think this is a problem of many countries (especially Western) since it is so easy to mix with other parts of the world, through internet and all, that we forget our own heritage or just don't value it anymore.
But I guess that no matter how much I am desillusioned about Western culture, I am still proud to be Western (and an individual for that matter, no offense to whomever might be offended)

By the way, one of the greatest products of American culture (if that's what you want to call it) must be movies!!! Especially Disney-movies with a happy ending. Yep I am that kind of person.

[Anglorfin]

Originally Posted by Lief Erikson

My suspicion is that living inside our current time period makes it feel normal to you, and hence less romantic. Other time periods look less ordinary because you aren't in them, and they seem somewhat more romantic or epic as a consequence. I suspect that if anyone from 100 years ago could look forward into the future and see our society as it is now, the word "epic" would not come near to covering sufficiently the astonishing vista.

I agree with you, though, that many Americans tragically don't appreciate what they have.

Aye, I know that must be part of it. But it's hard to not think about culture without history; as I feel those two are inseparable. If culture is just remembering great moments in history then America is full of richness. But if we define culture by the remembering and practice of traditions then I can say that America's culture is still very weak. America still hasn't been around long enough fully gain it's own culture in this sense.

The difficult part is that historically speaking, not very many Americans have been Americans for too long. None of my ancestors lived in America 120 years ago; which is a long time by this country's standards; but even I can't help but think sometimes that my adopted culture is the American one. It must be 10 times harder for someone who is only 2nd generation American to think of America as their real home.

I think there is a very simple reason to why this happens too. It's a sort of racism but not the negative type in the way that most people would think about. We are so different here (not that there's anything wrong with that), that we look around and see that our neighbors are a different color or speak a different language. And no matter how much people want to pretend that we can all fit in together it just doesn't work sometimes. A Latin-American will never get too excited about St. Patrick's day same way as an Italian-American wouldn't get excited about Cinco de Mayo. Everyone still needs to look towards their own ethnic heritage in order to feel comfortable. That's not to say that all people can't enjoy Cinco de Mayo; but it will never hold the same significance to me as it does to a Mexican-American.

But the fact that people can and do celebrate whatever they want is great. Any festival or holiday holds the same basic meaning as any other holiday. If someone can't have a good time then there's something wrong with them.

[Nurvingiel]

Originally Posted by RÃ*an

They're thankful that the Pilgrims didn't land further north?

Ha! Yes.

No, I think we just thought, "Hey, another excuse to eat a big turkey with your family? Why not. And we have a lot to be thankful for too. Let's also have Thanksgiving and celebrate it in October."

It's our only non-commercial holiday and is therefore awesome, so, thanks guys.

I agree with Lief and Lotesse about movies.

You don't have to like American movies or even like watching movies at all. But you must admit that, as an art form, they are part of a country's cultural output. Books and art are widely considered to be "cultural", but not everyone likes reading or looking at paintings.

Speaking of paintings, who are some famous American painters? I can only think of Canadians and Europeans.

[Lotesse]

Should we start from right now and work our way backwards? Jesus, where to begin. Let's skip all the fantastic, mindblowing contemproary art that's blowing up the art scene right now and just back-peddle a few years, and go back from there - actually, bear with me 'cause my people here mentioned zig-zag between the ages; however, they're all American -

American Painters:


Jeff Koons
David Hockney
Andy Warhol
Whistler, James Abbot McNeill
Georgia O'Keefe
Grandma Moses
Joseph Stella
Jean-Michel Basquiat
George Wesley Bellows
Edward Hopper
Arshile Gorky
Mark Tobey
Man Ray
Roy Lichtenstein
Ellsworth Kelly
Jackson Pollack
Winslow Homer
Mary Cassatt
Mark Rothko
Jasper Johns
Gilbert Stuart



Babe, wait -you know what? this list would take a lot of patient hours to keep on compiling. I could go on, and on, and on... And on... There are thousands and thousands of genius artists whose chosen medium is painting, to have arisen out of the United States over the last three hundred years of this country's existence.

Aside from Wikipedia, here's that huge list: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:American_painters -

here there's another source of american paineters for you to peruse for interest, and a few more names. - http://www.artcyclopedia.com/artists...ists-20th.html

It's too late in the night at his point, and I could quote you five hundred more names but I am friggin' damn tired right now. America is home to all kinds of brilliant genius artists who've served to add to the unique, vibrant, rich young and daring culture that is the American culture. Ta hell with these damn commies tryna say otherwise, dammit!! There is so much textural, exciting, brash, crazy, young, vibrant and fancy-free beauty to the American culture; those oldie european nations are just jealous of all the vitality and exuberance we've got over here. Hah.