The Teacup Cafe classic - Page 2

jerseydevil · 12-06-2003, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Falagar
Yeah, but those discussions don't go on and on and on, and haven't (at the moment) taken over the Book-discussion forum.

Well then maybe we should spread out the discussion on elves and men and orcs and balrogs. So do you think that elves came from men or elves? I think elves.

Falagar · 12-06-2003, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jerseydevil
Well then maybe we should spread out the discussion on elves and men and orcs and balrogs. So do you think that elves came from men or elves? I think elves.

Men!

...let's take this outside, before we're thrown out.

jerseydevil · 12-06-2003, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Falagar
Men!

...let's take this outside, before we're thrown out.

You can IM me if you have AIM.

But there are several places where Tolkien said it was Elves. Treebeard in Lord of the Rings says that it was elves. I consider the Lord of the Rings books - to be the key source because that is the published version. Then the Silmarillion, then letters.

Ruinel · 12-06-2003, 07:17 PM

*hands the tray of tea cakes and sandwiches to JD* Care for any?

I happen to agree with your point, JD. [edit: looks like you posted after I started this post] The point about the book forum. I haven't seen anything really that is out of control... not what I would consider out of control, at least. I certainly understand SGH's position though. I know that some people complained about the discussions appearing heated and angry. It's rather hard to read the emotions the poster has through the text.

I personally don't hold any grudges toward anyone at the book forum, Black Breathalizer included.

Tessar: as for the "forest-what'sits"... do you mean "forestry"?

**Nurvingiel** · 12-06-2003, 07:18 PM

You know what I think is funny? People will debate anything anywhere, anytime, even in a random thread with a silly name.

*sits back, sipping tea and nibbling scone*

Falagar · 12-06-2003, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jerseydevil
You can IM me if you have AIM. But there are several places where Tolkien said it was Elves. Treebeard in Lord of the Rings says that it was elves. I consider the Lord of the Rings books - to be the key source because that is the published version. Then the Silmarillion, then letters.

He doesn't actually say they're made from Elves.

I'll PM you the rest, don't have IM (hope you've not closed your PM/box)...

Quote:

Originally posted by Nurvingiel
You know what I think is funny? People will debate anything anywhere, anytime, even in a random thread with a silly name.

*sits back, sipping tea and nibbling scone*

Human nature.

Ruinel · 12-06-2003, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Nurvingiel
You know what I think is funny? People will debate anything anywhere, anytime, even in a random thread with a silly name.

I have to disagree with you, Nurvingiel... eh... *thinks* ... errrr...

nevermind.

**Nurvingiel** · 12-06-2003, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ruinel
I haven't seen anything really that is out of control... not what I would consider out of control, at least.

This, from the chief flamer of the Moot.

I'm over my initial shock. I don't think it's that bad. I'm surprised that this thread took off actually, go me.

Quote:

Tessar: as for the "forest-what'sits"... do you mean "forestry"?

Haha. In answer to Tessar's earlier question:
Forestry is a very diverse subject. I'm in a degree where we learn to manage the forest, so our different subjects include biology of various kinds, conservation, and forest operations (which is essentially 'how to get the lumber out of the forest'). You can focus on any one of these areas, or on research in Forest Sciences. I chose the 'big picture' approach, but they are all equally important and valid.

I actually prefer Earl Grey to English Breakfast. I'll have that for my next cup.

edit: whoops, formatting tags. and spelling. x_x

Ruinel · 12-06-2003, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Nurvingiel
This, from the chief flamer of the Moot.

BWAHAHAHAAA!!! Seriously? come on, Nurv

... if you think my posts are flames... lol! No offense intended, but really, nothing that I've put up here would be considered a flame at some of the other boards.

But I do understand that those are not PG-13 boards that I'm talking about. Sometimes I just need to be tapped on the shoulder and reminded of that fact.

jerseydevil · 12-06-2003, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Falagar
He doesn't actually say they're made from Elves. I'll PM you the rest, don't have IM (hope you've not closed your PM/box)...

This is what Treebeard says in Lord of the Rings the BOOK...

Quote:

But Trolls are only conterfeits, made by the Enemy in the Great Darkness, in mockery of Ents, as Orcs were of Elves.

Nurvingiel - I thougt this was a general discussion between friends? Even friends argue.

Falagar · 12-06-2003, 08:04 PM

Quote:

But Trolls are only conterfeits, made by the Enemy in the Great Darkness, in mockery of Ents, as Orcs were of Elves.

Notice the words "counterfeints" and "mockery", not "made out of".

Edit: Ops, sorry.

jerseydevil · 12-06-2003, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Falagar
Notice the words "counterfeints" and "mockery", not "made out of".

I see that. But I also know that in the Silmarillion it goes into even more detail on the creation of orcs from elves. So taking the two together - it is elves. I don't think a letter Tolkien wrote only 2 years before his death - when he might have forgotten what he had already published (LotR) or written (The Silmarillion) - is reliable.

**Nurvingiel** · 12-06-2003, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jerseydevil
Nurvingiel - I thougt this was a general discussion between friends? Even friends argue.

Yeah I know, but they don't argue all the darned time. But whatever, I'm resigned to this fact of Entmoot now.

*finishes tea and gets up to brew another pot*

Would anyone else like some Earl Grey?

Falagar · 12-06-2003, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jerseydevil
I see that. But I also know that in the Silmarillion it goes into even more detail on the creation of orcs from elves. So taking the two together - it is elves. I don't think a letter Tolkien wrote only 2 years before his death - when he might have forgotten what he had already published (LotR) or written (The Silmarillion) - is reliable.

But it doesn't directly say in LotR that theyr're from Elves. It says "counterfeits". As it also does in HoME X, I believe. They were made from Men (or a mix of Men and Elves) in mockery/as a counterfeit to Elves. That's my opinion, at least.

I really hope the threads in the movie-forum will become less "violent" when RotK has been out for a while (I don't think EE will make it any worse).

Oh, and have any of you tasted wildberry tea? What do you think of it?

Quote:

Originally posted by Nurvingiel
Yeah I know, but they don't argue all the darned time. But whatever, I'm resigned to this fact of Entmoot now.

*finishes tea and gets up to brew another pot*

Would anyone else like some Earl Grey?

Yes please. With sugar or honey.

**Nurvingiel** · 12-06-2003, 08:22 PM

*brings back a tray with a pot of Earl Grey, a pot of honey, spoons, (ordinary honey, Beorn isn't receiving visitors today), sugar, and cream.*

Tea for all!

I would leap heartily into this debate on elves and orcs, but I really don't have an opinion on this one.

Orcs are a twisted version of Elves, wether they were once Elves or were made in mockery of them. That's good enough for me.

Here's a good question to add to that thought: Can Orcs breed? Request: Let's please not mention the weird orc-membrane-mud-pit scene from TTT, and base this discussion solely on the books.

Falagar · 12-06-2003, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Here's a good question to add to that thought: Can Orcs breed? Request: Let's please not mention the weird orc-membrane-mud-pit scene from TTT, and base this discussion solely on the books.

It says somewhere (the Silm, I think) that they "reproduce in the manner of the children of Iluvatar".

**Nurvingiel** · 12-06-2003, 08:28 PM

Thanks! Some tea? *offers tray*

Falagar · 12-06-2003, 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Nurvingiel
Thanks! Some tea? *offers tray*

Haven't received my Earl[y] Grey yet.

mithrand1r · 12-06-2003, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Nurvingiel
Yeah I know, but they don't argue all the darned time. But whatever, I'm resigned to this fact of Entmoot now.

*finishes tea and gets up to brew another pot*

Would anyone else like some Earl Grey?

I would love some Earl Grey. With one packet of sugar please.

If some one has a moment may they please pass the krumpets.

Also here is some baklava for all to enjoy.

*Passes tray first to Falagar*

***Tessar*** · 12-07-2003, 01:11 AM

Oooo that's MOST interesting! And yes I did mean forestology or forestry, whichever it is.

*takes a sip of peppermint tea* Ooooooh my nerves. *rubs temples* I've been assistant teaching an acting class once a week and so today from 11:30 a.m. to 4:30 p.m. consisted of teaching two different sets of children how to act...

Did I mention that all the kids in the first class are under ten, and that the second class isn't much older?

*whimpers and sinks down into his chair*

Thank Goodness I've only got one class left to teach the little buggers...

12-06-2003, 07:17 PM	#24
Ruinel Banned Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: I have no idea. Posts: 5,441	hands the tray of tea cakes and sandwiches to JD Care for any? I happen to agree with your point, JD. [edit: looks like you posted after I started this post] The point about the book forum. I haven't seen anything really that is out of control... not what I would consider out of control, at least. I certainly understand SGH's position though. I know that some people complained about the discussions appearing heated and angry. It's rather hard to read the emotions the poster has through the text. I personally don't hold any grudges toward anyone at the book forum, Black Breathalizer included. Tessar: as for the "forest-what'sits"... do you mean "forestry"? Last edited by Ruinel : 12-06-2003 at 07:19 PM.

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12-07-2003, 01:11 AM	#40
*Tessar* Master and Wielder of the Cardboard Harp of Gondor Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: IM IN UR POSTZ, EDITIN' UR WURDZ Posts: 6,433	Oooo that's MOST interesting! And yes I did mean forestology or forestry, whichever it is. takes a sip of peppermint tea Ooooooh my nerves. rubs temples I've been assistant teaching an acting class once a week and so today from 11:30 a.m. to 4:30 p.m. consisted of teaching two different sets of children how to act... Did I mention that all the kids in the first class are under ten, and that the second class isn't much older? whimpers and sinks down into his chair Thank Goodness I've only got one class left to teach the little buggers...