Medieval Studies are Useless

[Gwaimir Windgem]

You said it in the Narnia and Middle-earth thread, near the bottom of the first page.

[GrayMouser]

Oh, right, about the Tolkien/Lewis friendship bust-up. I read it in an extremely poor biography of Tolkien -can't even remember the name or author; I'll look it up next time I go to the library, hopefully tomorrow, and post it on the Tolkien thread.

Apparently he was into the Rosicrucian/Golden Dawn crowd


http://www.thecrackedpot.net/3-3/Ink...sWilliams.html

[Lief Erikson]

Originally posted by Huan
Gwaimir, there are huge numbers of resources you could find on that time period. Your local library should be full of books on the subject. Specifically, though, you might want to check out a book by Lacey Robert called The Year 1000: What Life was Like at the End of the Last Millennium. It was written to compare and contrast the turn of the last millennium with the Y2K craziness. I haven't read it myself, but I remember it being in the news at the time.

Makes one wonder what the turn of the next milennium will be like (If it happens). Technology keeps advancing, advancing and advancing. What if missiles become outdated, just as the sword has .

I really used to like studying medieval history, while I was studying it. Nowadays I'm studying different things, but I still find the medieval time period very fascinating. That's the time period we draw fantasy from, after all .

[Varda Oiolosseo]

I love Medieval history! I think it is so intresting and fasinating.

[sun-star]

Originally posted by GrayMouser
And, sorry, I should have indicated that that was the British Secretary of Education.

Yes, and in my opinion he's not a very good one, especially on the subject of universities.

However, to be fair, he does claim to have been misquoted (or at least misinterpreted). He says he was talking about people with medieval views on the role of universities, rather than medieval historians - not that I believe him, or think it makes much difference in any case (he seems to use "medieval" as an insult!) But that's what he says, anyway

[Ruinel]

Originally posted by sun-star
However, to be fair, he does claim to have been misquoted (or at least misinterpreted). He says he was talking about people with medieval views on the role of universities, rather than medieval historians - not that I believe him, or think it makes much difference in any case (he seems to use "medieval" as an insult!) But that's what he says, anyway

Well... that's even more confusing. What the hell does he mean by 'people with medieval views on the role of universities'? That only the rich may attend? That you can only be a teacher if you have the blessings and funds of a rich, noble patron and you have lots of obedient students? That you should change your religion in order to attend or teach at a university, depending upon which religion happens to be the religion of the ruling class of people?

Help me out here, I'm really confused about his meaning?

[Gwaimir Windgem]

Though he and his family were members of the Anglican Church of England, Williams was also involved with certain mystical religious sects, especially one known as “The Fellowship of the Rosy Cross”— also called the “Golden Dawn.”

That's strange, last night I thought you'd left, and I did some research on it (for some reason, nothing had turned up when I searched before), and on a page I found, it said that the Fellowship of the Rosy Cross was an offshoot sect from the Golden Dawn, I think...

[Ruinel]

Originally posted by Gwaimir Windgem
... the Fellowship of the Rosy Cross was an offshoot sect from the Golden Dawn, I think...

BAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!! 'Fellowship of the Rosy Cross'?
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!! too funny!

[Bombadillo]

Ornamental!!!?? What, is he trying to say FUN!!?

So medeival times are just too fun and cool to study so students should just move on to something 'more useful' and forget anything ever happened then. Well 'more useful'... from that point of veiw all history is equally useless, like nothing affects us. What the hell is he thinking!?

Some people I just can't understand. And he's a big shot in education!

cool of cool off cool off cool off cool off cool off

[Anglorfin]

I'll educate him!!!

What really bothers me is the fact that he really doesn't know what he's talking about. He doesn't even present a valid argument for himself.

[Spock]

Those who forget the past (having never learned it) are bound to repeat it.
If you don't understand your past you can't possibly know where you are.
If you don't know where you are you can't possibly know where your going.
..makes a bit of sense it does....

[sun-star]

Originally posted by Ruinel
Well... that's even more confusing. What the hell does he mean by 'people with medieval views on the role of universities'? That only the rich may attend? That you can only be a teacher if you have the blessings and funds of a rich, noble patron and you have lots of obedient students? That you should change your religion in order to attend or teach at a university, depending upon which religion happens to be the religion of the ruling class of people?

Help me out here, I'm really confused about his meaning?

Well, this is what he wrote in a letter to the Daily Telegraph on 10th May, in response to questions like that:

letter

I'm not sure the link will work, so in case it doesn't, he's talking specifically about the funding of universities, and whether the government should pay for universities to be "communities of scholars". It was still a stupid thing to say, though.

[Bombadillo]

I am not in any way opposed to medieval studies (or for that matter Latin). I support the spread and development of both classical and medieval studies.

So, he supports it but he thinks it is useless, but he isn't opposed to it in any way, he just thinks that something more important should be taught in its stead, but he supports it. There's a word for that opinion: BULLSHIT!

[Ruinel]

Well... I read it... and now... I think he's a joke.

He's clearly not opposed to the study of history (Medieval or other) and not an opponent of the study of languages (he mentions latin).

In case the link is not working for you... here's what he is opposed to...

...the "medieval concept" of the university as a community of scholars can be only a very limited justification for the state to fund the apparatus of universities.

It is the wider social and economic role of universities that justifies the more significant state financial support.

However, I'm not quite sure what he means by the state can not justify funding universities as a comminity of scholars. Are universities supposed to be a community of say... idiots? ... the criminally insane? ... what?

Help me out here... I'm still confused.

[Coney]

Originally posted by Ruinel
However, I'm not quite sure what he means by the state can not justify funding universities as a comminity of scholars. Are universities supposed to be a community of say... idiots? ... the criminally insane? ... what?

Help me out here... I'm still confused.

It looks like more brit-politician talk for "Universities should be self-funded, this is a new excuse to prove our theory"

Why governments don't just say "If you want education, you're going to have to pay for it yourselves" is beyond me

[Ruinel]

Originally posted by Coney
It looks like more brit-politician talk for "Universities should be self-funded, this is a new excuse to prove our theory"

Why governments don't just say "If you want education, you're going to have to pay for it yourselves" is beyond me

Do these bozos know that the majority of research comes from funding universities? Do these bozos understand how expensive a college education is going to be for the average student without funds from the government. There was a time when only the elite could afford an education. The middle classes gave their sons into apprenticeships and saved up doweries to wed their daughter off. And the poor just sent their children (boys and girls) off to work as soon as they could as unskilled laborers.

Perhaps that is the future in which these bureaucrats want for their country. After all, an uneducated mass is a people easy to control. Especially if those in control are the educated, rich elite. Lets go back to a class run society. What a great idea!