North Korea to Give Up Nuclear Aims

[Jonathan]

Originally Posted by Nurvingiel

Normally I'm against sanctions, but this one seems to be limited to military material. Which makes me wonder why we were selling tanks to Kim Jong-Il before.

Maybe China did. Now that they're grumpy they won't sell anymore tanks though

... The thread title is really out-of-date now, isn't it?

[Spock]

U.N. Adopts Resolution Against N. Korea
From Associated Press
October 14, 2006 2:03 PM EDT
UNITED NATIONS - The U.N. Security Council voted unanimously on Saturday to impose punishing sanctions on North Korea for its claimed nuclear test, declaring that its action posed "a clear threat to international peace and security."

North Korea immediately rejected the resolution, and its U.N. ambassador walked out of the council chamber after accusing its members of a "gangster-like" action which neglects the nuclear threat posed by the United States. Ambassador Pak Gil Yon said North Korea wants talks but warned that it will consider increased U.S. pressure a declaration of war.

The vote came after the United States, Britain and France overcame last-minute differences with Russia and China during what Russia's U.N. Ambassador Vitaly Churkin called "tense negotiations."

The resolution demands North Korea eliminate all its nuclear weapons but expressly rules out military action against the country - a demand by the Russians and Chinese. U.S. Ambassador John Bolton warned Pyongyang, however, that if it continues pursuing nuclear weapons, the United States would seek further measures.

The Security Council condemned the nuclear test that North Korea said it conducted on Oct 9. It demanded that North Korea immediately return to six-party talks aimed at persuading Pyongyang to dismantle its weapons program without precondition.

It imposed sanctions for the North's "flagrant disregard" of the council's appeal not to detonate a nuclear device and demanded that North Korea "not conduct any further nuclear test or launch of a ballistic missile."

The resolution bans the import or export of material and equipment that could be used to make nuclear weapons or ballistic missiles. It orders all countries to freeze the assets and ban travel for anyone engaged in supporting North Korea's weapons programs.

To meet Russian and Chinese concerns, the Americans eliminated a complete ban on the sale of conventional weapons. Instead, the resolution limits the embargo to major hardware such as tanks, warships, combat aircraft and missiles.

The resolution calls on all countries to inspect cargo leaving and arriving in North Korea to prevent any illegal trafficking in weapons of mass destruction or ballistic missiles. The final draft was softened from language saying the council "decides" - which is a stronger authorization.

But China's U.N. Ambassador Wang Guangya said after the vote that the provision allowing the boarding of ships to inspect cargo was still unacceptable to Beijing.

[Lief Erikson]

Well good. I'm glad that the differences between the major powers have been overcome, and that they could form a good agreement.

[Spock]

It's not a good one; no teeth in it, just the way China and Russia wanted. The same two countries that are screwing around with us on Iran.

[Curubethion]

Exactly. We tried this a zillion times with Iraq...it's almost like "Give up your nukes, or...you'll just have to wait and see what we do!" Really threatening.

Even worse, if we cut off food aid, all of the food will just go to the army, and aggravate the food crisis already in place there...

[Lief Erikson]

I don't think there is anything in there about cutting off food aid, thankfully. And I agree that this resolution is not going to resolve the North Korea nuclear crisis. But at least it shows them that they can't just mess with the UN as much as they want, without any fear of consequences.

[Nurvingiel]

From the article Spock posted:

"The resolution bans the import or export of material and equipment that could be used to make nuclear weapons or ballistic missiles. It orders all countries to freeze the assets and ban travel for anyone engaged in supporting North Korea's weapons programs."

Also, I read on CBC that the ban is also on tanks and other military equipment.

But why were people selling Kim Jong-Il military equipment before? Also, I doubt he started his nuclear program completely from scratch.

I think it's totally irresponsible and hypocritical to sell someone weapons and then get upset when they reach a certain threshold of military capability, we just shouldn't be selling fascist dictators this crap in the first place.

[Curubethion]

I don't think it'll do that much, especially since NK already has the nuke stuff in the first place...besides that, I'm sure there's governments hanging around that don't care heck about the UN.

[Spock]

Indeed.

Most only use it as a 'bully pulpit' to bash the USA.

[Nurvingiel]

The USA was certainly not the only country to vote for the sanctions.

I was referring to all nations who produce weapons at a large scale in my own comments.

[Earniel]

Originally Posted by Nurvingiel

But why were people selling Kim Jong-Il military equipment before? Also, I doubt he started his nuclear program completely from scratch.

I think it's totally irresponsible and hypocritical to sell someone weapons and then get upset when they reach a certain threshold of military capability, we just shouldn't be selling fascist dictators this crap in the first place.

Nuclear equipment is usually regulated, if I remember correctly. Some equipment, even parts of nuclear powerstations may not be sold to certain countries since it can also be used in the production of nuclear weapons.

Ordinary, or rather more conventional weapons don't seem to have those fail-safes. Probably because some will immediatly cry protest and god forbid we try and curb a hugely profitable economy, right? "Think of all the jobs it produces! Other countries will still sell weapons if we don't." I've heard a lot of the arguments already...

I think a lot more countries than most people realise produce weapons. And yes, I think a lot of them have far too lax controle on it too.

[Lief Erikson]

The nuclear test has now been confirmed. It did happen. Not that that's a big surprise, but it's still good to have that clear.

Originally Posted by BBC News

Air samples from North Korea confirm that a nuclear explosion was carried out a week ago, US intelligence officials say.
The Director of National Intelligence said the findings came after analysis of radioactive debris detected at the site of the test.

"The explosion yield was less than a kiloton," the US statement said.

[Spock]

The best part of that news report, Lief, was that the air samples were from NK and not the UK or US

[hectorberlioz]

I missed a day or two of news...Sat and Sun, so I haven't kept up with the N.Korea thing...

Are they really talking about giving up their nuke stuff?

[Spock]

....translation of N. Korean promise to give up nuke weapons = "when pigs fly".

[Nurvingiel]

[link]

[hectorberlioz]

So Test No.1 was real...

I wonder how consequential it would be to take out their missile launch sites...

[GrayMouser]

Originally Posted by hectorberlioz

So Test No.1 was real...

I wonder how consequential it would be to take out their missile launch sites...

Considering that they have 13,000 artillery pieces within range of Seoul, mostly safely hidden away in caverns in the mountains, capable of raining down 300,000 shells per hour (many of them tipped with chemical weapons)-

very consequential.

A war would leave NK totally destroyed, but it would at a minimum cost tens of thousands of lives, hundreds of billions of dollars and devastate South Korea for a generation.

[Lief Erikson]

Yes, I heard an Iraq war veteran talking about this. He said that North Korea's military technology is sophisticated enough that we would lose the full number we've lost so far in Iraq in the first few days.

[hectorberlioz]

So who will admit it first? The Bush Policy worked for North Korea, at least for now. We got China (or they let us, whichever you prefer) talk them into being tough on N.Korea, and now Kim Jong Il has sent us flowers saying he's sorry...

...but what's this? CNN says that Kim Jong Il did it on his own accord? Not a word of thanks to China, much less the Bush Administration?

Now all we need to do is have China get tough to Iran...