08-25-2004, 03:42 PM | #261 |
Advocatus Diaboli
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well, if your father ever posts or publishes his ideas, i would be interested in reading them... really
i'm a sceptic by nature... if i was standing before god, i'd be looking for the little guy behind the black curtain but i do appreciate good research and interesting theories... i read a book long ago that i can not remember the title of, by a hindu man i believe... who interpreted the book of revelations from an astrological perspective (with references to constellations and such implied by the text, along with corresponding dates)... and he also brought into play the fact that astrology was a major 'science' back in those times... it was an interesting perspective, whether believable or not
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
08-25-2004, 04:07 PM | #262 | |||||||
Elf Lord
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Edwin Yamauchi's own achievements are impressive. After earning a bachelor's degree in Hebrew and Hellenistics, he received master's and doctoral degrees in Mediterranean studies from Brandeis University. He has been awarded eight fellowships, from the Rutgers Research Council, National Endowment for the Humanities, the American Philosophical Society, and others. He has studied twenty-two languages, including Arabic, Chinese, Egyptian, Russian, Syrian, Ugaritic, and even Commanche. He has delivered seventy-one papers before learning societies; lectured at more than one hundred seminaries, universities, and colleges, including Yale, Princeton, and Cornell; served as chairman and then president of the Institute for Biblical Research and president of the Conference on Faith and History; and published eighty articles in thirty-seven scholarly journals. He has made other academic achievements as well. Just mentioning some of them to show the authority of the words I was quoting. If you wish to debate various ones of them, I can provide some sources and evidence. Quote:
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Who would give up his life for something he knew was a lie? Giving your life up for something you believe is true is hard enough and requires a fierce loyalty. We know even from the Jewish leaders' writings from that time that Jesus did miracles. In their writings they called him a sorcerer who practiced black magic. If they could have denied his miracles, you can bet they would have. Quote:
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You can't just lump Christianity together with Judaism or Islam by saying they all contain the same kinds of things, when you don't know what evidence there is for any of the three or how compelling it is. Quote:
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If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
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08-25-2004, 04:23 PM | #263 | ||
Elf Lord
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Do you want to experience God, brownjenkins? Before I met him, I wondered whether he was knowable or possible to experience. I was too afraid to set a meeting or anything because of my fear that my religion would collapse. I feared that God would not show up at the meeting and my religion would be shown to be false hope. That was before I met Jesus and he transformed me. I wanted to meet God, but I was too afraid to approach him. He was gracious and met me. It says in the scripture that "he who seeks finds, he who asks receives and to him who knocks, the door will be opened." If you want to experience God, if you want him to prove himself to you in the way that will satisfy you, it's possible for him to do that. It's necessary to lay aside your predispositions against his existence, to be open minded and ask that if he's real and a person, he'll speak to you. That needs to be asked as a prayer. If you want to experience him, I'll pray with you as well. You said I may have a good point that to approach the spiritual you need to use spiritual methods, just as to reach the physical one needs physical methods. Are you willing to take this chance? The risk of course is that I'm right and your life, and lifestyle, will be changed.
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If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
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08-25-2004, 04:33 PM | #264 | |
Elf Lord
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__________________
If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
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08-25-2004, 04:34 PM | #265 | ||||||
Advocatus Diaboli
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
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08-25-2004, 04:44 PM | #266 | |
Advocatus Diaboli
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i prefer the little things, family, kids, friends, etc. if there is a god, i'm sure i'll have plenty of time to get to know him (or the other guy) when i'm through here i dabbled in a lot of religious teachings in my younger years... and was drawn more to the buddhist ideaology than any other... it chimed in the best with my view of life... but in the end, i have no desire for 'something more'... so i stick to what i know and love... the people around me including many here at the moot, of course
__________________
Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
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08-25-2004, 04:55 PM | #267 | |||||
Elf Lord
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(Gets excited again) Now we're getting somewhere. Those experiences were some of what they died for. I agree with you that believing something doesn't make it true (glad to hear you're not relativistic, by the way ); now look at what they believed they experienced. Quote:
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__________________
If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
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08-25-2004, 04:56 PM | #268 |
Mootis per forum
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Is just me, or are we getting out of topic?
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Do not be hasty. That is my motto. Now we'll have a drink and go to the Entmoot. |
08-25-2004, 04:58 PM | #269 | |
Elf Lord
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Okay. It doesn't seem like this discussion's going to get anywhere though, in that case. So far you've been answering everything very rationally, I've been delighted to find. If you're not going to be convinced anyway though, and don't really have an open mind, then you're going to end up deciding against Christianity no matter how well I establish its case. Right?
__________________
If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
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08-25-2004, 05:00 PM | #270 | |
Elf Lord
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Quote:
__________________
If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
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08-25-2004, 05:04 PM | #271 | |
Advocatus Diaboli
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yes, terribly off-topic i believe time to head out anyway lief, thanks for the provoking conversation on the rest... i never rule anything out, i just argue it to death
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Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever. |
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08-25-2004, 05:08 PM | #272 |
Elf Lord
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(Dies) (and goes to heaven )
__________________
If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
08-25-2004, 05:10 PM | #273 |
Mootis per forum
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I do think it was an interesting excursus, and obviously related to the topic, but perhaps it was taking too long, with the risk of loosing the topic
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Do not be hasty. That is my motto. Now we'll have a drink and go to the Entmoot. |
08-25-2004, 05:10 PM | #274 |
Elf Lord
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It's been a fun discussion. Thanks for your attention!
Oh, before my ghost departs from this site I'd love to hear RÃ*an's answer to that one single question of yours, brownjenkins. I'll hang around waiting for that, before returning to the main subject. Do you have any problem with that, Fat Middle?
__________________
If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
08-25-2004, 06:43 PM | #275 |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
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Which question was that?
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
08-25-2004, 07:30 PM | #276 |
Elf Lord
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What sets Christianity apart from other religions. I said what I've heard, that Christianity is the only religion where God comes down to man rather then man working his way up to God. Could you elaborate?
__________________
If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
08-25-2004, 07:52 PM | #277 |
Half-Elven Princess of Rabbit Trails and Harp-Wielding Administrator (beware the Rubber Chicken of Doom!)
Join Date: Sep 2002
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I'd definitely start another thread for that one. Asking me to elaborate is dangerous!
I've been thinking about starting a thread "why do you believe what you believe?" or something like that for awhile now. Maybe I'll finally do it - my husband is in Peru until Monday so I'll have some more time to Moot. (he's a board member of a fabulous children's charity organization that works both locally and worldwide) Let me think about it ...
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. I should be doing the laundry, but this is MUCH more fun! Ñá ë?* óú éä ïöü Öñ É Þ ð ß ® ç Ã¥ â„¢ æ ♪ ?* "How lovely are Thy dwelling places, O Lord of hosts! ... For a day in Thy courts is better than a thousand outside." (from Psalm 84) * * * God rocks! Entmoot : Veni, vidi, velcro - I came, I saw, I got hooked! Ego numquam pronunciare mendacium, sed ego sum homo indomitus! Run the earth and watch the sky ... Auta i lómë! Aurë entuluva! |
08-25-2004, 09:16 PM | #278 | |
Elf Lord
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Quote:
__________________
If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
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08-26-2004, 12:37 AM | #279 | |
Domesticated Swing Babe
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My common sense tells me not to spend too much time debating certain topics with certain christians. I haven't read too many books on that subject...once I was convinced that christianity was mythology, I turned to more intriguing reading material.
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Happy Atheist Go Democrats! |
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08-26-2004, 12:57 AM | #280 |
Elf Lord
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Okay.
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If the world has indeed, as I have said, been built of sorrow, it has been built by the hands of love, because in no other way could the soul of man, for whom the world was made, reach the full stature of its perfection. ~Oscar Wilde, written from prison Oscar Wilde's last words: "Either the wallpaper goes, or I do." |
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